UC Childcare

[HereWeGooooooo]

Hi everyone,
I'm currently claiming this for my half of nursery fees. Had an idea the other day to start claiming on the entire invoice and ask my ex to cover the rest, that way we both benefit - I pay no fees and he pays 15 vs 50%! But is this allowed…
Thanks so much!

It would be fraud as you're not actually paying that amount out in childcare.
It's unlikely this will flag but if it does the consequences could be very serious, it is a criminal offence. Up to you whether to take that risk. Personally I wouldn't.

You would need to prove you were paying the entire bill before they’d pay out to you

Thanks! I’d pay the entire bill in full of course then claim on it! Receive 85% back from UC and 15% from my ex

Thanks! I’d pay it, upload proof etc but am I actually allowed to claim on the entire invoice if we look after our child 50/50?

Anyone?

This is fraud, as your ex is then paying you some of this money back. UC accounts can be audited at random and it would become obvious very quickly what you have been doing. You would then be liable to pay that money back and will have committed fraud.

you would be foolish to do this

Thanks for this! Can you explain how is this fraud, exactly?
I'd pay the bill in full, say £1000.
Submit to UC and receive 85% of this back, £850.
And ask my ex to pay the remaining 15%, £150 vs the 50%, £500 he has been paying...

Someone else was concerned about this here https://www.reddit.com/r/universalcredithelp/comments/1gzi85u/exwife_claiming_85_nursery_fees_still_says_i_have/. Responders didn't seem to think it's fraud. Please do expand so I can make sense of it...

How would they know if it's classed as child maintenance?

Put it as a question on your log and an advisor for UC will give you an answer then you will be clear.

It’s fraud because presumably if you & your ex were to be treated as “one” unit then you would not be entitled to UC, and therefore UC would not be paying a % of your childcare.

You are able to use it on your half because YOU are entitled to the UC childcare assistance. You don’t know if your ex is, but by pretending that you are paying the whole invoice UC is having to pay out more than you as a family are entitled to.

it isn’t fraud, he’s increasing his child maintenance which isn’t included for UC.

It is fraud. They have 50/50 care, which means they are both responsible for 50% of childcare.

OP is eligible for UC help on her half, that’s great.

Dad is not eligible for UC help on his half, so he pays, that’s great.

By OP trying to now claim she is responsible for 100% of the childcare what she is doing is trying to make UC pay out towards 100% of the childcare, 50% of which there is no entitlement for because dad earns enough to not be eligible.

she didn’t say they share child 50/50, just the fees. Dad wouldn’t be able to claim UC for the fees when mum already is as you can’t both claim for the same child. Mum is claiming for the kid anyway so absolutely can claim for all the childcare she pays out for. Dad then ups his maintenance by this value of whatever 15% is and it is totally legal, even if other people don’t like it.

Not sure it is fraud technically. UC child element is a flat rate, so op wouldn't get less of that because she only has DC 50% of the time I don't think? And if that's the case why would childcare be any different.

Like pp said, you could ask in your journal

A direct quote from OP: we look after our child 50/50

Again, it’s not “totally legal” because they are each responsible for 50% of the childcare. Dad pays his, mum claims UC on hers. Dad is not eligible for UC help on his 50%, so he pays it, OP is trying to fraudulently claim that she is paying 100% of childcare costs so that UC would pay towards 100% rather than her entitled 50%.

For UC purposes Op is the primary caregiver and therefore she can claim the UC. If she is paying all the childcare she can claim for it. It’d be great if both parents were legally responsible for 50% of childcare fees and general childcare costs, but that’s just not how it works.

If Op is only working part time but paying for full time childcare fees UC may have an issue with that however

OP is entitled ONLY because she is submitting her claim as a single person. UC is a means tested benefit which means if we’re combining his & her side for childcare costs then his income should also be factored in- and if it was they wouldn’t be eligible. Which OP knows. Hence- it is fraud.

How do you no they wouldn’t be eligible?

OP is a single claimant though and In uc eyes she gets full child allowance which also entitles her to full childcare fees as she is classed as the primary care giver

Ask your job coach, they know your situation and the system better than we do. Any advice they give will be tailored to your particular situation.

It is not fraud. @HereWeGooooooo is entitled to pay the entire childcare bill and submit the receipts for her childcare element of UC. Her ex partner is entitled to pay her as much maintenance as he wants to, as long as it equals or exceeds the CSA rate. It doesn't have to calculated for any specific purpose, as long as the maintenance is for his children (if it is spousal maintenance it is deducted £1 for £1).

Therefore, @HereWeGooooooo can pay the entire childcare bill, claim the 85% assistance (minus any deduction for earnings) and she can request that her ex partner increases his child maintenance to a level that allows her to do so.

They share care of the child equally and yet OP claims the UC- so he is not eligible.

You pay the whole nursery bill, and he pays the 15% as maintenance.

It's totally normal for one parent to have the contract with nursery and pay the bill. It's not fraud.

It’s not fraud and maintenance can still be paid even with 50/50 care. The op is legally obligated to pay the whole 100% if her ex chooses to give her the 15% as child maintenance that’s a separate issue and legal to do.