Pension Credit/Pip and my bloody dad!

[VillageFete]

Hi,

Any help will be massively appreciated.

In short, my dad is a nightmare. All of my adult life i’ve had to mop up the many messes he finds himself in. He is always cutting corners, making bad decisions and gives no thought to the future. I ended up on antidepressants because I couldn’t cope with his demands anymore, it’s genuinely that bad.

I feel some kind of weird loyalty to him, as there’s no one else to advise him, but i’m a working mum of 3 young kids and i’m just about staying afloat myself with all of the admin of my own life. I’m busy, and i’m stressed (Aren’t we all)

He is 69 year’s old. No private pension. Multiple health issues, such as unstable angina, abdominal aortic aneurysm, kidney stones, musle/muscularskeletal issues, mobility issues diverticulitis.. I could go on. I deal with all medical appointments and take him to them, which is a massive task and very difficult to manage.

He has, without a doubt, ADHD. He’s often manic at times and he jumps from one thing to another and cannot tell you a simple story, or answer simple questions without going off on a huge tangent. He’s very difficult to understand and you can never get the full story with him.

Anyway; 5 year’s ago I sorted out a PIP assessment for him. He was awarded the full whack. It was a stressful time but I felt relieved that he had some support in that respect.

When he reached pension age, I sorted all of that out. He assured me he had very little in savings and so pension credit was sorted to top up his state pension (He has no private pension) Again, I felt relieved that this was dealt with and grateful that he had some kind of security.

He lives in a small house in a deprived area. His rent is paid for him, due to pension credit I assume, or would or be paid anyway because he of pension age and is awarded full PIP? I don’t know.

He calls me yesterday and tells me that he wants to come off pension credit. I couldn’t get to the bottom of why, other than he has some money due to him from somewhere, he wants to invest it in shares, he will earn excellent money from this blah blah…. I’ve heard it all before and these schemes never work out. He says it will need to go in to his bank account and he can start working again (He is NOT fit to work, plus is 70 this year) Buying and selling at auctions, as well as investing in all of these shares.

I don’t know his full financial situation, I cannot make sense of the things he tells me and very often he says one thing and then changes his story down the line.

I think he’s bored, fed up and is seeking the next thrill. He doesn’t like sitting around doing nothing but unfortunately his health dictates that quite often, he has to.

I’m just exhausted with him and am appealing for advice!

If he comes off pension credit, will his rent not be paid? Does he need to come off PIP too if he’s earning a wage in the future based on these shares he’s banging on about?

I’m in the process of going for power of attorney for him, and feel as though i’ve got to help him make the right financial decisions, but with 3 young kids and working myself I am absolutely run ragged and just don’t know where to start with all of this.

He has been nothing but a burden my whole adult life 😞 He doesn’t see me as his child, he sees me as some kind of PA.

I would get him to the GP for a medical assessment. Adult Social services should be involved. Age UK and CAB give excellent advice.

Of course you can get attendance allowance (the person who needs somebody to attend to their needs) and carers allowance (for the carer who attends to those needs) at tge same time.

Although you may not be getting involved now (and it does sound like you need to take a large step back) I might be able to reassure you a little about HB and CT reduction. He will be getting full rent and CT reduction due to being on pension credit but it isn't all or nothing. If he stops getting pension credit the council can assess him based on his savings and earnings and he could still be eligible for help depending on the figures.

This is completely untrue.

OP do you think your father may have dementia, rather than adhd?

Tell him you've had enough and to pay for a paid PA through Age Uk or similar !
PIP is non means tested.
It is likely to be the fact that he is living alone and on PIP that gets him pension credit because of the severe disability premium.
Getting top whacks of PIP, pension. pension credit and all rent and council tax paid can add up to significant amounts of money. Top rates of PIP alone are £750+ every four weeks.
Do you think money could have been building up in his account and he has not been declaring it to Pension credit ? If so then he needs to come clean asap. Any savings over 10k need to be declared and there is a deduction on the amount of Pension credit he would receive for any savings above 10k.
At the moment there seems to be a bit of a crack down on benefit fraud and whilst I'm not implying that he has done anything wrong he does need to be very careful if he is the type to bury his head in the sand whilst claiming means tested benefits.
People can still claim housing benefit without claiming Pension credit ( on Pension credit you get it all paid), but not if he has savings over 16k.

The carers allowance is claimed by the person doing the caring. It is possible for the same to get Attendance allowance and carers allowance but people generally don't because if you are getting Attendance Allowance you are clearly state pension age and most people claim state pension and carers allowance is an overlapping benefit with that so you don't get paid both. You can still get a carers premium paid on means tested benefits though.

The benefits he is claiming could add up to around £450 a week income with no rent or council tax to pay so do you think he could have been spending this or could it have just been building up ? I really think the sooner power of attorney is sorted the better.

It sounds like he may have gradually increased his savings over the last few years. You need to check how much he has. If it's over £10k he needs to declare it to the pension service and the local council (re his housing benefit) asap.

Do you know if he is getting Guaranteed Pension Credit or Savings Pension Credit? His latest award letter will tell you which one.

If he was awarded PIP prior to receiving his state pension he keeps the PIP as well ( subject to the usual calendar reviews). Attendance allowance if awarded if the individual is assessed as needing additional support after they have started to receive their state pension.

He keeps his PIP because it was awarded prior to him receiving his state pension. If he was assessed after starting to receive his pension it wa ours be attendance allowance.

Having many chronic illnesses myself I know how difficult it is to deal with them. There's a real chance your dad is anxious and depressed so I would concentrate on that first with a trip to the GP. Then I would suggest he contacts some of the charities that deal with his specific conditions. From there he might find some help groups and new friends which might take the burden off you

@Ramdogs ai think it’s guaranteed pension credit. Can’t be certain but it rings a bell.

@Bignanna Difficult to say because he’s always been erratic, restless and jumps from one thing to another. He ticks many ADHD boxes and always has. Unfortunately there’s narcissistic tendencies there too. I’m not too well versed in dementia to be honest, but can’t deny there seems to be some kind of cognitive decline. I think he’s depressed post lockdown too.

I’m using the Turn 2 Us benefit calculator and just making figures up for the savings part. I’ve done 18,000 up to 23,000 and it’s still telling me that he’d be entitled to pension credit? And therefore housing benefit?

I’ve put his postcode in, how many bedrooms he has, his date of birth, the fact he’s on enhanced PIP for both components, and even when I say he has a fair amount of savings, it’s saying he is entitled to guaranteed pension credit?

Sympathies OP.

In addition to the specific financial advice here, what about posting on Relationships on how to deal with FOG (Fear, Obligation, Gullt)?

It is so common, and wrecks the lives of many of us struggling to meet impossible demands of being sandwich generation.

If he's still entitled to it, then this won't affect him. That's great news. Nothing for you to worry about.

It is possible he's still entitled to Guaranteed PC with those savings, if he is on a low income and max PIP. But it's really important you confirm his actual savings and inform the pension service as the amount of pension credit will probably need to change. Pension credit isn't a flat rate so will go up or down depending on savings held. If he has undeclared savings it's likely that PC is being overpaid.

If his guaranteed credit changes to savings credit then it gets a bit more complicated.

You need to get his pension credit claim updated asap and go from there.

@DeepFatFried I will definitely post on relationships. Thank you. I truly didn’t realise this was common as non of my friends appear to be in these circumstances. If anything, they get support from their parents. I get zero from him, yet he always wants something from me. If I was in a jam though, i’m sure he’d help me. I feel so very torn and that FOG you’ve described is spot on!

@Ramdogs Thank you. It makes sense. I guess I need to go and see him and work out what he has and then update pension credit, as you say. I know he has 10k in his current account, but no idea what else he has and where it is.

The problem with this man is nothing makes sense. You get half a story and can never quite get to the bottom of anything with him. It's truly exhausting.

You absolutely need to establish his savings and update pension credit. Any savings over 10k need to be declared.
I sense at the moment that there is a general crackdown by DWP and local authorities ( half of who are on the verge of bankruptcy ) on people not reporting changes and them uncovering benefit fraud. I had to accompany a very ill , elderly gentleman to our local council offices a couple of weeks ago after he was found guilty of benefit fraud - a very small amount of council tax support that he had been claiming and forgot to inform them that savings had gone over 16k. he was slapped with a huge penalty fine or face a criminal record. It was distressing.
I would urge anyone with elderly parents who are claiming means tested benefits to encourage them to check savings limits etc. Some of these people are getting large amounts in pension credit, disability benefits etc and the money can soon build up often without them realizing. Some very elderly are on fixed assessment periods for Pension credit where they don't need to report savings increases for a certain period of time but I believe for newer claims this has now been scrapped.

@Miley1967 You're right, there is. A lot are being hit with penalties as well as repaying the overpaid benefit. Unfortunately a lot of them are pensioners as some with the max PIP, and all that goes with it, are getting more than they spend and end up going over the capital limit without realising it's a problem.

Just another one echoing you are not responsible for him. I remember being in a similar situation re the embarrassment, my dad was in hospital after a fall on the way back from the pub. I was heavily pregnant sitting with him for hours in a and e where he was complaining that it was full of non white people. You know it’s not your fault but the mortification is hard to ignore.

what would it feel like not to help him out of his mess? Horrible inside and guilt inducing but you can train yourself I speak from experience.

@TorroFerney Oh, I empathise. It’s bloody awful. To not help him, well, i’d feel horrendous. It would eat me up; but I’m also really angry and sick of his shit and don’t want to help him any longer.

Looking at his current account, it’s his PIP payment that’s pushed his money in account just over 10k, so yes, it’s a case of money building up and him not spending much in the last 2 months.

Are we supposed to call pension credit and tell them that? 🤷🏻‍♀️

I have just dealt with another one this afternoon as well. Has hundreds coming in a week, not been spending it and now ESA stopped as gone way over the savings limits. It's a massive headache and often not intentional ! This new government have ordered a massive crackdown on benefit fraud so I expect we are seeing the start of them checking things more carefully.

@VillageFete Yes. You need to add up all his accounts, shares, bonds etc and tell pension service about the lot.