Joint UC calculation

[Linkedin721]

Hi, hoping someone can help me work out my joint UC claim as DWP cannot advise me of my calculation until the end of June. It’s a joint claim, I can’t work out of the monthly award will be £99.65 or £469.80 due to the wording surrounding LCWRA work allowance. I work full time and my husband is signed off from work (self-employment) , no children and no housing element (live in mortgaged home). I earn £1697 net after tax, NI and pension. My husband has been signed off sick since February. He is expected to be assessed as LCWRA. When calculating UC I was confused if my husband’s £673 work allowance applies to my income. If so will the calculation be my wages (£1697) - work allowance (£673)=£1024 when wages taper x 0.55p = £563.20 total deduction from £1033 claim (couples allowance £617 + £416 for husband’s LCWRA) = £469.80 total UC award. If my husband’s work allowance cannot be applied to my income then the calculation would be £1697 x 0.55p = £933.35 deduction from total £1033 = £99.65 total award. Thanks in advance and apologies if this is obvious, UC is all new to me, however assuming his work allowance won’t apply and I’ll have 55p deducted from my full wage £1697.

Did you get the payment?

No, my statement went up on time stating how much I would be paid by tonight 8pm, nothing confused theres nothing in to do list or journal. I did speak to an advisor yesterday as it usually goes in early hours yesterday if it falls on a Sat who just kept saying it was paid from their end gave a payment reference but never ever known anyone to not be paid by the date you are told by

I hope you get your payment tomorrow @AmeliaRose2801

Thank you, I am hoping too never known anything like this before

So we are completing the UC50 work assessment form, it requires evidence. My husband contacted his GP and they said the DWP will contact them if anything needed? So it’s quite conflicting as form asks for medical evidence and the HCP say they don’t provide this. All we have are referral letters (form says do not send) and his medical notes with Medication and referral so it doesn’t really highlight how the health issues affect daily living.

Do you have things like hospital Consultants letters, the ones they send after appointments at the hospital? It really is best to send your own medical evidence rather than rely on them contacting your GP. A GP patient summary which the GP receptionists will print off for you is better than not sending anything. It will list GP consultations and medications etc

What evidence did you send for ADP you can use the same letters. You can ask the GP if they will provide a private paid for letter.

Just to update you that the claim has been calculated and the award for this month is £0.00 because the allowance is only £815 (couple £617 and caring duties £198). Sent the work assessment a few weeks ago so hoping LWCRA is applied soon. I am reducing my hours to 3 days a week from next month, earn my approx £280 a week net, so too much for carers allowance. My husband was rejected for ESA as he has not paid enough NI. He is self employed and always paid what they asked for so a bit annoyed this did not count. If he was required to have paid more NI contributions why didn’t they tell us instead of sending a giro slip for lower amount? ESA said he needs to complete a work assessment- even though they rejected his application? He completed a work assessment for UC, why are ESA saying he doesn’t qualify but then talking about a WA?

Also his sick line runs out 30/06, when should he call doctor to renew? A few days before? Can the GP wrote a sick note for the future, ie 01/07 so there are no gaps?

Sorry, WRT ESA rejection they said you can appeal - would I have grounds to appeal stating he paid the NI contributions he was asked to pay believing it to be the correct amount? It should be clear that the NI payment HMRC suggested he pays is not sufficient in terms of NI credits. We assumed the amount he was billed for would be the correct amount to count towards full years of NI contributions. At the time I didn’t think about ESA, I assumed HMRC billed him based on the accounts provided from self assessment. Presumably this wasn’t enough NI for his state pension either. When I look at his HMRC account it says the info is not available for 2021/22, 2022/23 which is really not useful, how can they still be calculating accounts from 4 plus years ago?

Definitely worth proceeding with that work capability assessment for ESA if as that will count for the Uc as well ( the work capability assessments are exactly the same for both benefits ). So if he got awarded support group/ LCWRA after the assessment you will get the extra LCWRA element on the UC claim. IT's up to you whether you want to pursue the ESA issue. Perhaps seek advice from CAB or similar. I know if you are slightly short on NI contributions you can make up some of the shortfall but I guess it depends how short he is. The years they would be looking at for ESA are 2022-23 and 2021-22. Sorry just re-read and seen he has already completed an assessment for UC so he shouldn't need another. If he is awarded LCWRA not only will ne get the extra element added but you should also get what is called a work allowance meaning that a proportion of your earnings are disregarded before deductions take place for earnings. At the moment you won't have that work allowance meaning your earnings are likely wiping out the whole UC award. You should start getting some UC once LCWRA is awarded and applied - it is only paid from the fourth UC assessment period after he started handing in sick notes.

Just to add also in relation to the ESA issue - you are no better off by it being awarded as it is deducted in full from your UC claim, so anything you got from ESA would come straight off your UC. It would benefit you now as you are not getting any UC but once the LCWRA is hopefully added to your claim and you do start getting some UC, then ESA would just be deducted anyway. There are other benefits to getting ESA paid alongside UC like it is paid fortnightly and is non means tested etc. Hope this makes sense.

thanks so much for this. I am just annoyed that we paid what HMRC asked for re NI but now they say we didn’t pay enough. We would have paid more if they had told us? We assumed that would be correct. Thank you for explaining the esa will not matter once lcwra applied. We put sick not e in a few weeks back but it was dated 01/02 so unsure if it’s 4 months from then (can’t be as this had passed) or 4 months after the first award - 25/06 £0.00 award, then no lcwra until 25/08? Will it be backdated so 4 x £416 or is that wishful thinking?

25/10 sorry! Not 25/08

@Linkedin721 regarding New Style ESA the only NI Contributions that count are Class 1 - employed or Class 2 - self employed. Class 3 only relate to the State Pension. You said early on he'd not worked since (I think) 21/22 for having the right conts for NS ESA was always a long shot. Currently the qualifying years are 21/22 and 22/23. Conts in one year only are not enough.

It's only worth appealing if you can show Class 1 or 2 payments were made or credited. If he goes into his NI record via the Government Gateway does it tally with his work record and payslips?

I'm not sure why the form for the Work Capability Assessment mentions ESA as we've established, at least from a DWP perspective, that he's not eligible. But the process in UC is exactly the same so I wouldn't worry too much.

You say you sent the UC/ESA50 form back. Have you heard anything more from the Assessment Service such as when you can expect a phone or face2face consultation?

You need to speak to the GP surgery to ask for a new fit note to follow on from the one that expires next week. I cannot see why keeping that continuous should be a problem.

@Bromptotoo thanks for another informative reply, appreciate it. We have heard nothing back from the work assessment, it’s only been 12 days or so so early days. Re-reading the esa rejection letter it actually says he MAY get a work assessment? Hope they can use the same one as UC. Seems confusing that esa would inform him his claim was unsuccessful but then go on to speculate he may get a work assessment? Hope they don’t take too long as the LCWRA award is the crux of the whole claim. I am going to write to them regarding the NI contributions to see if they can relook at it. Adult disability payment (Scotland’s PIP) is still being re-examined (he was one point from enhanced rate). The result from redetermination are due 17/07 as they have 56 days. If he gets the extra point the weekly payment increases to £109 from £72 so that would be helpful.

Hi all, just an update. I have not heard anything back from the UC50 work assessment form posted 6 weeks ago. I was hoping they may have got in touch to arrange the work capability assessment by now. I have updated my UC account to reflect my reduced contract and I have uploaded another sick line. As I started my reduced contract on the 1st of July, and the assessment period is 18th June- 19th July, I assume the calculation will be 2 weeks full time wages plus 2 weeks part time wages. So I won’t know our usual award until the third statement is generated and this will be the first one calculated using 4 weeks of part time wages.

It will be based on your actual pay, as reported by the employer to HMRC when running payroll, for the whole of the AP.

Yes, but I was just thinking as assessment period falls in between my switch from full time to part time it won’t be until next month the award is calculated using just part time hours. I reduced hours on 1st July, my assessment period is 19/06-18/07. Still not heard anything from LCWRA, we submitted the UC50 3 months ago, no acknowledgement or any arrangements for a work assessment or medical / health review. Our claim is still only £815 so will only get £100-£120 I think on 25/07. We will find out on 21/7. My husband’s sick line was extended until 01/08 and doctor said after that she will provide another sick line with no problems (she does not even need to see my husband)

Unsure if I should cut my hours to 12, as I only get £12.86 an hour I could qualify for carers allowance as my earnings would be low enough to meet criteria. This may be better while we await lcwra. I would lose pension though. £150 wages and £80 carer allowance is still not ideal as I know UC will deduct carers allowance as income (no issue with this at all- just trying to work out what would be best as lcwra can take a while). Just unsure if I could survive on £230 a week.

After GP issued Fit note it's a 13 week minimum wait time until the allowance for LCWRA kicks in.

Date starts day Fit note handed in. Then 13 week wait.

Did he have an accountant when he was self-employed?

He should have been clear on the he difference between NI contributions. It's possible to pay less, as a self-employed person, but that does affect benefit entitlement. I had to top my NI up with a couple of hundred pounds to be eligible for Maternity Allowance.

If he was only paying Class 3s, the minimum he has to pay, ESA are correct.

Edited for clarity.

LCWRA is not backdated the 13 weeks and then assessment period. If you are awarded it it is issued going forward only.

It's actually up to the individual to check the amount they pay is the correct level for their needs.