Really upset and worried about money.

[NannyMogg]

I recently married GrandadMogg after he retired (we have had a longstanding relationship living in different cities during our working lives). He has debts and is still overspending. Illness/disability is a factor. I'm not sure he accepts he has seriously impaired judgement with money. On top of ASD I wonder if there are the first signs of dementia.

I am not a paragon of thrift but just about float not sink. I don't want to post lots of personal potentially identifying information as I have family members on MN.

I am talking about small sums. Making up a scenario which sort of illustrates the problem:
I have paid off the mortgage on my small home where we now live together. We currently have £200 per week after housing costs. In 6 months I will get a small pension of about £50 per week.

The overspending includes regularly coming home clutching an irresistible antique lampshade/bit of tech/random thing that cost £50 -£100. Often something he already owns a similar or exact one of already.

GrandadMogg retired early due to a serious health condition and has a very small pension. He has been building up debts partly justified by 'I might be dead in a year'. This is possible but he also might not be dead in 10 years.

I have full time care responsibilities for another relative, carers allowance and a part time job (earning over £139 per week would mean losing £76 carers allowance). We plan to move home nearer to relative which is a cheaper area and could then increase income by having a lodger. I was earning more until recently but my relative's care needs have increased substantially. GrandadMogg often keeps my relative company (though not able to do practical care) which they both enjoy.

He is a person with many lovely qualities. Money management is a blind spot.

What can I do to get things on track and keep them there? I feel sure someone somewhere has an answer, please help me find it.

I wouldn't marry someone like this. You will be responsible for all his debts. Why not just have remained his partner?

Are you sure?

So he knows he's overspending, knows he's in debt but does it anyway?

I would say that's more of a shopping addiction than dementia tbh. Also is it basically in character? He perhaps has never bought anywhere, never managed to save?

Thats very entrenched behaviour. The only problem is now youre married, it affects you.

All I can suggest is talking about it and becoming the money policeman. 'We don't need it, we can't afford it, take it back'. My mother ended up in that role. It was horrible, they divorced, he died penniless having embezzled thousands from others.

There is just a chance imo that he could come to regard taking things back as just as entertaining as shopping. More likely he will take it back and buy something else.

Why did you marry at this stage of life?

Can your dh have an allowance each week or monthly to buy his crap with? Maybe turn it into a buy and sell scenario with things he's bought double of or stuff you don't need.

I'd be hesitant to police his spending, it's not your job to fix this,but if you've pooled finances and are now married his debts become your debts and you'll end up filling any financial gaps he leaves.

What bank account is he using to shop? Is your home still only in your name?

I am sorry but marrying means his debts become shared, he has a claim on your home and savings.

Should he need funded care you will be treated as a couple.

You should really have got legal advice before marrying. It’s not too late to get advice now - much easier to sort out now with a short marriage.

Only if it's in joint names , his name on the debt , she is not responsible.

www.equifax.co.uk/resources/debt-management/marriage-and-bad-debt.html#

Ignore the posters saying you have now taken on his debt, this is not true. Just make 100% sure you don't put any of his debt in your name or against your home.

It does sound like he has gained more from the marriage than you though, he now has a home (mortgage free) and a live in carer (you).

I was married to someone with debt (tho he is now an ex), and together we did manage to pay it down, and he modified his spending somewhat. I insisted on weekly sit down money meetings - sounds business-like - where we looked at a budget and made financial plans, and each week looked at spending. Give him a discretionary spending budget and if he goes over it, tell him to return the item. You have to be really tough. It's not much fun.

Take complete control of the finances.

Why did you get married?

Thank you, I will look at shopping addiction. I'm not sure it's this but may be a compulsive element.

Interesting question. Are you married? If so why do you now think you married at that stage if life?

Is it possible to restrict his method of spending so that he has access to just one card with a max of £30 on it at any one time?

As soon as he comes back with stupid crap, either return it or resell it.

Brutally, I think you have made a mistake in getting married to this man. Marriage is not about love, at any stage of life - it’s a legal contract with rights and obligations. If it’s clear that he cannot see his obligation to you to preserve the wealth you share for BOTH your benefit, long-term, then you should at least consider ending the contract. He may die soon but that doesn’t give him the right, before he goes, to torpedo your future without him.

Thank you for this thoughtful reply. We haven't 'pooled finances exactly.

The only reason to marry at late stage of life on a practical level is to avoid inheritance tax and for the surviving spouse to claim the deceased spouse pension. It’s usually half what the actual pension receiver got . Plus you could get widows allowance for a year if he dies before you. He could of course decide to divorce you and claim half of your home and that is the real reason to never marry someone at late stage life who brings nothing to the pot.

Debts have to be paid from someone’s estate, so if he does die before you and has any capital at all that will disappear paying off debt. If you have ever signed as a guarantor then the debt would be passed to you on his death, so make sure to never agree to be a guarantor nor take any joint debt.

Mixing money with someone who is bad with money is always a mistake but it’s done now.

I would suggest he transfers x amount for living expenses in to an account that you control. So work out how much all the boring stuff is like council tax and utilities, halve it and ask him to transfer the money by direct debit every month.

Do not pool finances.
Do not put him on the deeds to your house.
Make it clear that the house is your asset.
Make a will leaving your house to your children if you have them. Leaving him a life interest maybe.
(the house only starts to be seen as a marital asset if you divorce. If you have been married a long time or he is dependent on any way and you divorce… he will get half your house).
He can have his own bank account, maybe in the form of a cash card where he can’t run up an over draft, for his spending. Never let him have a joint account or card with yours.
Get LPA put in place, do not name him as your Attorney for finance!

I would never marry again. Op do you have children? Have you made a will leaving them everything?

I got married in the first place because I foolishly loved my exhusband and for our children to be protected. It worked but I now wouldn’t want to be married to someone who can’t organise their finances. That’s just unattractive.

I think it’s about shared values and communication. I don’t live with dp but we’re talking about going on an expensive holiday in the summer. He needs to save, i don’t, but we’ve already discussed the excursions we’d want to go and we really enjoy looking at YouTube videos on the destination. If you wanted to go away could you have an adult conversation about finances and saving or would you pay for him? At some point we’ll live together - we’re in no hurry - and we’ll have an adult conversation about bills and responsibilities. I couldn’t do that with someone with no self control.

You ask what you can do to get things back on track....

Here's the problem - marriage is a legal contract that pools your assets, as well as affording your spouse the right to make some major life decisions on your behalf if you are unable to do so.

I have no wish to cause alarm, but in stark terms - You have essentially taken your aeroplane of life and chosen your spouse as your co-pilot. That's fine as long as he can fly the plane - but in financial terms he can't, and he doesn't want to learn (and might not be capable of doing so).

The setup can bumble along for a while as you pilot everything and monitor him to make sure he doesn't fly off the flight path. But what happens if you fall ill and can't do it? Or become too weary of trying? Perhaps you already are?

Before marriage you had options and some security - your house and other assets could be used as a source of income if you needed health interventions or support care; you could appoint someone trusted to take Power of Attorney on your behalf, for finances as well as follow your wishes in terms of health incapacity.

Do you think your husband will be ever be capable of overcoming his current compulsions /illness/disabilities and to fly the plane?

Unhitch your co pilot and make him a passenger - you will both be on a safer journey on the future together. Otherwise he may crash and burn you both.

Credit card mostly I believe. We don't have any joint accounts.

Home is in my name.

Very helpful advice - some I have already in place.

Web ate my reply, thank you for this analogy will re-reply when better signal!!

I am married, I got married because DH and I wanted to have children and I wanted to be a legally recognised unit in case it effected either earning potential. DM married again in her 60s but to a man with considerable assets and no dependants. He was keen to be married as he has health issues and does not get along with his brother - he wanted DM to be next of kin.

I would not marry a man with debt if it threatened the home I had bought and paid for, which is why I ask. I wondered if you had similar reasons to DM's husband.

My situation isn't like your DMs at all. It's difficult to answer properly without identifying details but our decision to marry wasn't in order to make us financially better off re our individual earning potential although that might ultimately happen (neither was it to prevent another family member inheriting).

I need to figure this problem out and everyone's answers are helping me. It's not one sided.

I should admit to myself that if I hadn't spent quite a lot of money on legal advice before marriage there'd be more in the kitty for antique lampshades!

I'm beginning to think there are two separate issues. One is we need to do the boring budgeting, financial conversations and planning as a couple now however tempting to avoid.

The other is the medical/ASD side which needs thinking about and maybe some advice.

Thank you.

Did you use any particular tool or approach?

I have heard of Ramit Sethi and Alvin Hall but not looked into their methods very closely.

I need a Marie Kondo of finance!