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Original poster

Have I seriously messed up DDs UC claim with savings - what to do?

81 replies

CatsOverheating · 05/01/2024 22:08

Young adult DD is having to make a first UC claim because of health issues. When they were children by making sacrifices I had gradually squirrelled some money away for the future for her and her sibling, including birthday gift money and money from a grandparent (now deceased) but I had kept it quiet so that it wasn't pestered or frittered away. It was meant for university, a small safety net and similar important things for both of them if I'm not here.

DD has been asked about savings in her UC application and so has asked me if there is anything to declare. I've looked out the paperwork for the first time in years and I think I've really messed things up for her claim. There is much more in her savings account than in her sibling's savings account, when it should be equal. I remember mislaying her sibling's building society passbook, and so putting the money into DD's, intending to transfer it over in the future to make equal amounts in each. I obviously didn't get around to doing this! I feel such a fool and could kick myself.

There is around 11k in the account in DD's name and under 3k in her sibling's. This obviously isn't what I intended at all - about 4k in DD's name belongs to her sibling. I can't afford to make this right myself, so I need to transfer that money over. If DD wasn't about to make a UC claim that is exactly what I would do to make things fair and equal.

How do I deal with this correctly? If the money stays in DD's account she will have about £90 a month deducted from her UC payment if I've got my sums right from googling, which she can't afford, and when it's not actually her money. If I transfer it out I'm concerned she will get into trouble with UC. Can anyone help please before she puts the claim in and I do anything?

OP posts:
Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:12

As I think is your concern, if the transfer is done right before UC claim it will look suspicious- I'm not sure how they would view it if you/DD tried to explain, as if it has been sitting in the accounts that way for a long time and is suddenly moved because of a UC claim it may not hold water with them.

RandomMess · 05/01/2024 22:15

Can DD buy a car out of her savings then gift car to younger sibling?

I'm trying to think of any sort of expenditure that would be feasible.

Original poster
CatsOverheating · 05/01/2024 22:17

I agree - that is my concern. I wouldn't have remembered or discovered the issue now if it wasn't for her claim. Equally it's the claim that makes it an immediate problem. I'm completely stumped to know what to do for the best.

OP posts:
Prometheus · 05/01/2024 22:19

Surely if she has the £11k in savings that will tide her over so she doesn’t need to make a UC claim?

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:19

RandomMess · 05/01/2024 22:15

Can DD buy a car out of her savings then gift car to younger sibling?

I'm trying to think of any sort of expenditure that would be feasible.

This would also be a grey area. The DD can only buy a car for herself, and need it. She cannot gift in this way it would be flagged as deliberate deprivation of capital.

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:20

Prometheus · 05/01/2024 22:19

Surely if she has the £11k in savings that will tide her over so she doesn’t need to make a UC claim?

She can claim UC with savings up to £15,999; her claim would be reduced by a tariff amount per £250 savings per month.

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:22

CatsOverheating · 05/01/2024 22:17

I agree - that is my concern. I wouldn't have remembered or discovered the issue now if it wasn't for her claim. Equally it's the claim that makes it an immediate problem. I'm completely stumped to know what to do for the best.

In my experience OP it may be best to leave things as they are. The tariff deduction you are aware of will be made. I know you said that some of that money is her sisters and this would seem unfair to both sisters but unless you can convince UC of this it is going to be difficult.

Original poster
CatsOverheating · 05/01/2024 22:24

Prometheus · 05/01/2024 22:19

Surely if she has the £11k in savings that will tide her over so she doesn’t need to make a UC claim?

She hasn't 'got' 11k in reality, she has 7k - don't you see? People are actually allowed to claim UC with up to 16k as I understand it? We also aren't sure how her health issues will pan out unfortunately. I don't want to do anything wrong - I just want to see if I can put things right. If I can, I want her to avoid losing about a third of her monthly UC entitlement when the situation isn't correct or her fault.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 05/01/2024 22:24

@Catsknowbest but they aren't going to know whether she uses the car or not are they?

Even on UC you are allowed to buy yourself a car to learn to drive in.

When it gets sold etc you don't have to declare it.

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:28

RandomMess · 05/01/2024 22:24

@Catsknowbest but they aren't going to know whether she uses the car or not are they?

Even on UC you are allowed to buy yourself a car to learn to drive in.

When it gets sold etc you don't have to declare it.

In my experience with clients and capital they dig deep when it comes to savings that have lain dormant suddenly being used at the same time as a means tested benefit claim is made. They can, do and will ask for detailed information.

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:30

CatsOverheating · 05/01/2024 22:24

She hasn't 'got' 11k in reality, she has 7k - don't you see? People are actually allowed to claim UC with up to 16k as I understand it? We also aren't sure how her health issues will pan out unfortunately. I don't want to do anything wrong - I just want to see if I can put things right. If I can, I want her to avoid losing about a third of her monthly UC entitlement when the situation isn't correct or her fault.

Edited
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Yes they are allowed to claim with that level if savings. Thankfully the days of the means test where you had to sell everything you owned are long gone. Even people in need of benefits are allowed some savings and that is how it should be.

NCGrandParent · 05/01/2024 22:33

I don't understand if this is in her name or not?

LauderSyme · 05/01/2024 22:33

@Prometheus she doesn't have 11k; some of that belongs to her sibling.

The benefits system allows for claimants to have some savings and OP saved hard to get this money together for her dd to afford something significant. So it would be a really bad idea to piss it up the wall on living expenses if she doesn't have to.

OP I worked as a Benefits advisor in local authorities, we worked closely with the DWP.

What you need to do is transfer the funds so that both bank balances are as you intended them.
Obtain proof of both bank accounts after the transfer.
Write a letter explaining clearly who you are, what you did and why.
Have dd submit the letter along with both bank statements and all her other documents/evidence to her UC claim handler.
She won't get in trouble. It won't stop her being able to claim. The worst that will happen is that UC will treat her claim as if she still has the higher amount of savings and reduce her award.
If they do this she can appeal for a different decision by asking for a mandatory reconsideration within a specified time limit.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 05/01/2024 22:33

CatsOverheating · 05/01/2024 22:24

She hasn't 'got' 11k in reality, she has 7k - don't you see? People are actually allowed to claim UC with up to 16k as I understand it? We also aren't sure how her health issues will pan out unfortunately. I don't want to do anything wrong - I just want to see if I can put things right. If I can, I want her to avoid losing about a third of her monthly UC entitlement when the situation isn't correct or her fault.

Edited
Show quote history

The issue is she does have 11k. That’s what’s in her name. You can’t take 4K of it and give it to her sibling now.

Whilst yours might be an honest error, they won’t allow it because obviously everyone would just transfer savings out if they could.

Unfortunately she’ll have to use the savings to top up her UC until she’s under the 6k lower limit.

Hollyhead · 05/01/2024 22:35

I would attempt to explain - i’d send evidence of payments and both siblings accounts and ask for ‘permission’ for the 4k to be transferred. If they can see it’s just you putting the money in the whole time and that you have another child who has less and you declare your error then you’ll have done the best you can do.

karlpkan · 05/01/2024 22:36

Has your DD worked in the past? Just wondered if she could claim new style ESA, which is based in past NI contributions and isn't means-tested.
Could she be eligible for PIP? This is a non means-tested benefit that's paid to cover the costs of a disability, and could be paid in addition to UC so it wouldn't be instead of it. But if she is getting money deducted from UC then it can help to have the extra money coming in.

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:37

It really is a difficult one OP. I'm just not sure what the best course of action is. It may well be worth trying to explain the situation. If you are up front they may accept the savings explanation- at least then you and DD won't be worrying that you're doing anything incorrectly. If they are adamant that because the savings have only become an issue now that the UC claim has to be made there won't be a great deal you can do but at least you will have tried, and in the right way. Know that doesn't help much but in my experience these things do genuinely happen, ie the savings situation only clicked now because of your DD need to claim and that is just one of those things.

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:38

LauderSyme · 05/01/2024 22:33

@Prometheus she doesn't have 11k; some of that belongs to her sibling.

The benefits system allows for claimants to have some savings and OP saved hard to get this money together for her dd to afford something significant. So it would be a really bad idea to piss it up the wall on living expenses if she doesn't have to.

OP I worked as a Benefits advisor in local authorities, we worked closely with the DWP.

What you need to do is transfer the funds so that both bank balances are as you intended them.
Obtain proof of both bank accounts after the transfer.
Write a letter explaining clearly who you are, what you did and why.
Have dd submit the letter along with both bank statements and all her other documents/evidence to her UC claim handler.
She won't get in trouble. It won't stop her being able to claim. The worst that will happen is that UC will treat her claim as if she still has the higher amount of savings and reduce her award.
If they do this she can appeal for a different decision by asking for a mandatory reconsideration within a specified time limit.

Yes you have definitely put that better than I tried to do

LauderSyme · 05/01/2024 22:38

@YetMoreNewBeginnings is wrong. You can give some ££ to her sibling and then explain to the DWP the truth of what has happened in words of one syllable, backed up by documentary evidence.

The best that can happen is DWP will take your explanation at face value and award dd the full amount.

jollywhite · 05/01/2024 22:39

I never understand these theads. If you have enough money that you're able to even have savings, you don't need benefits.

Even people in need of benefits are allowed some savings and that is how it should be.

That's just bullshit. The vast majority of working people are jst about managing and can't put money away for savings. If you've £16k in savings you absolutely shouldnt be entitled to anything.
Use your bloody savings! That's what they're for surely, a rainy day?! That's what we have to do, and our savings are decimated. I certainly can't apply for benefits, it's just tough shit.

Paddleboarder · 05/01/2024 22:42

I signed on for UC credit recently and can't recall having to show anyone proof of savings. I did declare it on the form but no one asked to see it. Since then I have spent some of the money and so need to update the claim. I would transfer the money as intended and explain if necessary.

Catsknowbest · 05/01/2024 22:42

jollywhite · 05/01/2024 22:39

I never understand these theads. If you have enough money that you're able to even have savings, you don't need benefits.

Even people in need of benefits are allowed some savings and that is how it should be.

That's just bullshit. The vast majority of working people are jst about managing and can't put money away for savings. If you've £16k in savings you absolutely shouldnt be entitled to anything.
Use your bloody savings! That's what they're for surely, a rainy day?! That's what we have to do, and our savings are decimated. I certainly can't apply for benefits, it's just tough shit.

Not responding at any length to that.

LauderSyme · 05/01/2024 22:43

@jollywhite you're an advocate for the race to the shitty bottom I see.

MrsSkylerWhite · 05/01/2024 22:43

How did that happen?, £11K to one and only £4K to the other?

LauderSyme · 05/01/2024 22:45

@jollywhite if you "certainly can't apply for benefits" it's because according to the means test you don't need them. Leave alone the people who do.