Time to think about our children's future

[Goodpepper]

How much does your child's future keep you up at night?

Will they have a fulfilling job? Will they make enough money?

Sometimes we obsess so much about our financial situations that we don't think about how our children will cope with theirs when they're adults.

I've spoken to many people about how hard their lives have been. Mainly because their incomes weren't consistent or enough.

It's downheartening.

I don't want the same for our children. That's why I've started thinking about their futures. Especially their jobs and financial education.

We shouldn't tell our kids what jobs to take. It's their lives. So, getting our kids to learn about jobs isn’t about picking their future career. It’s about letting them know the many options they have so that they can expand their future choices.

From an early age, kids identify with workers they come in contact with. If they don’t meet any people that work in rewarding jobs, they may not realise those jobs exist. How would they learn about them?

Life is racing ahead. New jobs are being created daily. You need to make your child aware of the variety of jobs that exist and tell them what duties they involve. Try to find jobs that aren’t common. Look into jobs that may suit them. Ones that pay well would be ideal. If it suits their personality and interests.

You can't keep looking for options for them forever, so DEVELOP THEIR INTEREST in finding out about other jobs.

Some work now should lessen the amount of anxiety you and they could have in the future.

What do you think?

I have learnt so far ( four kids) that no matter how much you push them to go to Uni or do a degree where there's a good chance of getting employment at the end of it, they will do their own thing. My ds1 graduated last year and is doing a job now which is unrelated to his degree and not really a job I consider to have longer term prospects but he loves it and puts a lot of passion into it so good for him but I do worry. My main worry is them getting on the housing ladder long term as it seems near impossible. The third thing is no matter how much you try to drill a sense of financial responsibility into them, some won't listen. We saved child trust funds/ ISA's for them, not a lot but just to help them along. DS1 blew all of his in his first term at Uni with nothing to show for it. DS2 has been much more sensible, saved and invested and has a good amount saved. Each of my kids is different, one just lives for the day and blows everything, the other much more financially savvy. You can only encourage and guide, but at the end of the day they will do what they want.
So yes I am anxious but mainly because in ten years time, much as I love them I don't still want them living here ! I am ready for peace and quiet.

This is true. Growing up my parents were low paid workers, factory / local council employee cutting grass etc. I didn’t know many people at all with real careers. I went to Uni and got myself a career in the civil service and their father is a diplomat (quite senior) so this has definitely opened them up to many more career options than I had. Their uncle is a lawyer for google and already spoken about getting work experience / internship for DS who is about to go to Uni. We are educated to be able to help with careers too, looking up other jobs alongside jobs DS is interested in, helping with Uni applications etc. My children are not spoiled at all but they are definitely privileged and have a step up in life compared to my generation (or me). I do think it’s who you know that can get you on in life

I totally agree with @Babyroobs. Kids have an annoying way of being their own individual people who make choices that you may agree with. You can guide snd support, but you have to let them go their own way.

Some of the jobs I have had, did not exist when I was a child

How does one plan for that ?

It can be a case of continual learning throughout life

Nobody can really predict the future

You do your best.

Give them some financial education. Support them developing their interests and exploring careers (easier said than done).

But you can't control them. And you will still worry about them.

You do your best, then you try to let go, to preserve your own sanity. You are not responsible for where they end up.

Both of my DS have experienced significant MH issues in late teens/early adults (mercifully got them through GCSEs). I was kept awake at night when they were younger worrying what might happen if something happened to me as main breadwinner so I made sure I had decent life and pension cover via work and there was provision for them in my will.
I have tried to emphasise the need to find a job which might sustain them and possibly a family too.

@Babyroobs That's so true! Your story is almost the same as mine. My brother would get his allowance and blow it before it even got into his hand. I mostly saved for more valuable things. He used to get envious about the nice toys I had, but he just couldn't develop the discipline to save. He could see the potential rewards from saving, but that wasn't strong enough to change his ways. I wonder what it is that makes someone like that?

Everything seems to cost more when you compare them as a percentage of the average wage, especially houses. The worry about our kids not getting on the housing ladder is a big one. Many young adults are choosing to rent to avoid getting a huge mortgage, then they blow their money on "experiences". That's fine while they're young, but what happens to them when they get older and rents just keep going up?

I'm trying to understand the psyche of people that don't get (or can't be bothered getting) the idea of financial responsibility. On the surface, it seems like laziness. But is it? Is there something deeper?

According to research, kids begin understanding basic concepts of money and jobs from about age 4, and they're pretty much set in their ways about these topics by the time they're 7. Change is a bit hard after that.

Knowing that, what would you say to parents of preschool kids about guiding their kids?

@Darbs76 My parents and grandparents advice boiled down to this: study hard and get a job in an office. I think my grandma was in real estate. My dad was first a sales rep, then an accountant. My mum studied journalism but ended up doing clerical work first, then nursing. I didn't get much exposure to many other careers, but movies influenced me. I ended up studying physics. No jobs in that, so I became a programmer. Eventually I moved to graphic design and bought a print & design business with my wife.

You can see I was all over the place. I didn't get much direction, though I'm sure my mum tried. Most of my friends are in the same boat.

Have you noticed similar experiences with other people? What advice would you give parents about guiding their kids' careers?

@tuliplover I agree too. It's hard to give my daughter any advice (not just about money). She is so stubborn. It's probably too late now. But it seems that our example in dealing with money may have offset her stubbornness a bit. She's reasonably good with saving, but she still spends on a lot of rubbish.

If only I knew what I know now, she might be better. As I said to @Babyroobs, research found that kids begin understanding basic concepts of money and jobs from about age 4. They're pretty much set in their ways about these topics by the time they're 7. Change is a bit hard after that.

I'm thinking that all we can do now is be there for our daughter when she stumbles.

@VelvetREDV01ce you definitely can't plan for jobs that don't exist yet. All we can do is keep an eye on developments and see if any jobs might align with what our kids interests are. Like you say, continual learning.

It's important to know what our kids' interests are when they're young. They''ll continue to shift and change, but by keeping up with them, you can make suggestions. Developing their interests and curiosity in a fun way should trigger their motivation.

Arousing their curiosity, interest and motivation is what I'd suggest to any parents of kids of ages 4-7. Not facts or consequences. I wish I could start raising my daughter again.😆

@MamaSharkington when you said...

"Give them some financial education. Support them developing their interests and exploring careers (easier said than done)."

With what I know now, I'd start with simple activities when they're 4 years old. Many people would object to that, but it's the age when they start forming the core of their understanding of money.

And you've hit the nail on the head when you say to develop their interests. Interest is what will sustain their path towards a rewarding career or business (emotionally and financially).

What sort of financial education do you mean? What age would you start them at? How would you develop their interests?

No jobs in physics OP? Graphic designers are one a penny!

@SmithfamilyRobinson Dealing with MH issues along with financial issues compounds the hardship and the worry. We have the same thing going on with our daughter. We've had so many scares throughout her life. She's 21 now and reasonably stable. I'd almost given up on her a few times, but kept on going back to support her. We also took out life insurance and set up our wills to make sure she wouldn't be financially disadvantaged.

How did you go telling them to think of their career and finances?

I didn't really understand the world of work until I worked PT as a student at 16 & volunteered too. Its not just about the wages, it is developing the soft skills too & building relationships with people.

I would encourage flexibility, try a job, if you don't like it try something else with transferable skills or retrain

I never received any career guidance from school or further education

@Under345C0ver543 I got my first job when I was 19 as part of my uni degree. It was a shock to the system! I was shy and my boss ended up being a guy that most of the others didn't like. Lucky me. It didn't help me with my soft skills. In fact, it made them worse.

Growing your emotional intelligence is very important when working with others. I found that the interactions with my work associates made the job fun or awful, so that was more important to me than money. That's part of what would make a job rewarding to me. Another thing I look for is being able to do a job where I can help people.

It's great that you've discovered these things yourself! It took me a long time to work it out.

Can you link to this “research” please? Absolutely a 4yo can have some understanding of the concept of money and jobs - but I don’t think for a moment that any attitude is hard set by 7, and it’s certainly not the case in my direct experience.

I'd say don't necessarily expect/require them to go to university, especially if they're not academic. Some of the most successful people I know started out as apprentice tradespeople aged 16 (one is now fairly high up in a major motor manufacturer, several others have their own, very successful, businesses in the construction industry). Or there are ways to get a graduate level education combined with employment, so you don't end up with the student debt to pay.

Also, not getting a job where they 'have' to work in London will help enormously with being able to buy a house before you're 40/50.

Definitely nurture a good attitude towards money, not spending everything you earn and be aware of how much the cost of small non essential spends can add up massively over time. Classic example being the tenner a day (or more!) many people spend on a coffee and bought lunch. Costs thousands over time compared with making your own.

Kids change their minds on what they want to do as they grow up. Ds always wanted to work in politics, but after being involved in local groups & a Mayoral campaign he has totally changed his mind & is looking at doing an access course to train as a nurse. He has to do this after packing in his A levels to do politics.

@Testina, I've looked at a few papers to find this out, and would love hearing about yours and other people's experiences, whether they prove or disprove the findings. I've listed the research references below for you.

Job aspirations seem to be set mainly by a child's social background and gender stereotyping.

Financial behaviour seems to be set by the basic approaches and skills which parents model, discuss, and demonstrate.

References

Journal of Vocational Behavior
Children’s career development: A research review from a learning perspective
by Mark Watson, Mary McMahon
www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S000187910500062X

OECD Report - Envisioning the future of education and jobs
www.educationandemployers.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/OECD-Report.pdf

Habit Formation and Learning in Young Children
Dr. David Whitebread and Dr. Sue Bingham University of Cambridge
mascdn.azureedge.net/cms/the-money-advice-service-habit-formation-and-learning-in-young-children-may2013.pdf

@Perfect28 Pretty much. I live in Sydney. The physics jobs that are here go to people with higher degrees and experience. I only got an undergraduate degree. And by the time I finished it, the joy of physics had left me.

As for being a graphic designer... I enjoy it. And it gives me time to do other things I enjoy. Einstein was a patent clerk. There's more to a job than money or prestige.

Definitely don't have to be a uni graduate. Most tradesmen here (Australia) get more money than technicians. And some "dropouts" do amazingly. Does the name Mark Zuckerberg ring a bell?

Instilling good money habits in your kids when they're younger than 7 seems to work the best. And you don't do that by teaching them. You need to deal with money the way you want them to learn. And discuss how you use money with them. Your thought processes are important in showing your kids what's important.

Our children watched a lot of "How it's made" on YouTube with us so they understood not only that these people all contributed something to making a product, anything from sweets to speedboats but also that some jobs are repetitive. We also talked to them about the machinery, that someone designed it, the parts were made just like we see in the program, those parts were assembled and make this machine that cuts pringles out of a sheet.

We pointed out all jobs, bus drivers, people on tills in shops, bank clerks, talked about our parent's jobs, our jobs, made sure they understood people are actors in films or tv programs or do voices for characters (we know someone who did this for a children's TV show)

We basically explained by late primary that we do not live with our parents and at some point they too will earn enough money to move out. That jobs can be paid well or not so well, you can absolutely love your job, or just find it meh. Neither correlates to pay. We explained the higher the grades the more choice you have especially for things like university. Someone's aspirational choice is someone else's insurance choice. We made sure they understood how much things cost from furniture, cars, holidays, food shopping, a meal out just as part of conversations when we bought stuff. They know how much it cost to replace all the windows in our house, how much the new boiler and all new radiators cost. They have learned the perceived value of things, like a t shirt with a logo on is somehow perceived to be valued by some, it is just a cotton t shirt, it isn't spun with gold so why does it cost £45? My Dad was in textiles marketing so this comes very naturally to me.

We made sure they understood the importance of education and simple things like learning your times tables will make maths easier for you. We put the time and effort in to help them with reading and homework.

For their future we saved separately from the CTF due to not wanting to hand over thousands to them once they hit 18. We could control it. We are funding them through university but cannot help with a whopping house deposit just a contribution to it. Ds1 is at uni, Ds2 is sitting his GCSEs.

@OnTheBenchOfDoom That's commendable! Did you find that passing on your knowledge this way was a big effort? Or did it just blend in with what you were doing at the time?

@Goodpepper no I found it really easy. I grew up poor. I knew that we didn't have money from a young age. I knew what it felt like to be sent to the front door to ask whether we could pay for the milk next week because we didn't have the money this week. In contrast Dh grew up in a more middle class home. But we have the same attitude to money, save it, then spend it.

We made them guess how much the tank of petrol was going to cost at the fuel station, we shopped with them and made them choose bread and look at the price differences between the supermarket and branded breads. It is just sprinkled into every day life.

We also made them look up the average teacher salary for secondary school and then put that into a mortgage calculator and see how much they could borrow. Then find a flat or house locally. We talked about all the usual bills we pay out including our extortionate dental plan. They are both very good with money, they don't blow it all, yet.

@OnTheBenchOfDoom That's great to hear. I've been researching ways to teach young kids about money and jobs. What you've done ties in with what I've found. Another significant aspect of money I found was that kids' financial habits are supposed to be pretty firm by the time they're 7. What are your thoughts about that?

I also wonder about personalities. We grew up middle class. There were three of us: me, my brother, and my sister. We essentially had the same lessons and examples from our parents, but our attitude to money is pretty different. I tend to save, my brother loves to spend and is always in debt, and my sister was somewhere in the middle (but closer to me). A child's personality must play a big part in how they deal with their finances. My daughter's money mind is closer to that of my brother's. Sigh!