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Original poster

How do you afford a second child?

63 replies

Frizzyliz · 26/09/2015 14:19

So my dd turns 2 at Xmas and we are thinking of possibly trying for number 2 over the next few months/a year.
However, I just have no idea how it is possible for people to have 2 children!

Dh earns around £30k and I earn around £23k.
I work full time and dh is a teacher with dd in nursery full time. It costs almost £200 a week for 51 weeks of the year.
We chose a nursery as we need reliable childcare without worrying that the childminder has a holiday coming up/is ill so we need other arrangements as we don't have anyone to watch her while we work.
We own a home, but consciously made sure we didn't borrow above our means. I also budget like crazy to save on groceries and we don't go on holiday or do expensive things.

If we were to have a second child it looks like more than my entire wage would go on childcare so it wouldn't be realistic for me to go back to work even though I would love to be able to work 2 or 3 days a week (I doubt I'd be able to find work like that though)

How do people ever afford to do it? I know we are both in ok paid jobs and people worse off than us manage it but I can't see how we could.

OP posts:
ssd · 26/09/2015 14:21

we earnt £17k between us when I had ds2, I very much had my head in the sand

but we managed, very frugally though

and am so glad we did, he's upstairs with a pal shrieking and laughing at some game, totally adorable.

Babyroobs · 26/09/2015 15:42

We had 4 dc's in seven years but only managed it by working around each other and thus paying minimal childcare costs. So dh has always worked 9-6 ish ( with some flexibility around start and finish times) and I have always worked weekends/ nights and evenings ( and still do 16 years later !)so that when the children were small we only had to pay for a morning or afternoon childcare. If I had a 9-5 job also there would have been no way we could have afforded even two kids.
Have you checked to see if you would be entitled to any help with childcare costs from tax credits ( I suspect your joint income is too high although may not be on a part time wage for you). Or you could see if either of your employers participates in the childcare voucher scheme whereby you both sacrifice part of your salary for childcare vouchers before tax. Or you could see if a childminder works out cheaper (some will offer sibling discount). In the long run it will pay for you to keep working. Your eldest child will get 15 hours free Nursery when they turn 3 which will reduce your childcare bill then they may start school not long after they turn four depending when ther birthday falls, so it really is high childcare costs for a few years.
Some people see if they can have a mortgage break for a couple of years to afford a second child as childcare costs for 2 can be as much as a monthly mortgage payment or more.

Allyoucaneat · 26/09/2015 15:56

We work opposite shifts to avoid childcare costs. I work 8am-5:30pm mon-tue and 8am-2pm wed and dp works 3pm-11pm wed-fri.

We earn around £30k between us, manage mortgage, holidays etc. We budget tightly but don't go without, although we don't go out as a couple often.

Original poster
Frizzyliz · 26/09/2015 15:57

With dh being a teacher it makes it tough as he needs to put extra in at weekends and evenings to prepare lessons etc so I'm not sure alternative hours would work.

We don't qualify for anything at our current earnings. I'd have to really research what we'd qualify for if I worked part time (which I'd prefer to) It could be tough to work out though especially as I might not be able to get a part time job and initially i could have to go back to my current job full time.
The worry I always had with childminders was their holidays. Dh only has school hols off and so if hols were in term time I'd have to take holiday without him and if it was holiday time and I couldn't get the same time off work me and dh would never see each other.

OP posts:
Original poster
Frizzyliz · 26/09/2015 15:59

Dh gets childcare vouchers and my work are currently trying to implement them so that saves some but not enough to make sense me going to work full time once we had a second.
It doesn't seem to leave enough for the rest of life if I didn't work.

OP posts:
whathaveiforgottentoday · 26/09/2015 16:03

As I teacher myself, I always opted for a childminder as it worked out much cheaper. I paid 1/2 price during the holidays and paid by the hour rather than a full day as could pick up by 4.30. Most childminders have school age children so take their holidays in school time anyway. I can think of only one occasion in the 7 years we used a childminder when she took holiday in term time and that was because her youngest child had just left year 11 and for the 1st time could save money by going on holiday in term time.

Babyroobs · 26/09/2015 16:07

Dh and I only ever take one weeks holiday of together for the week we go away somewhere. All the rest of dh's annual leave is taken off in odd days to cover when I have to work in the school holiday ( I try to do mainly nights and weekends). family time is really sacrificed by working so many weekends and having to take seperate leave but this is just the way it is. We do what we have to to avoid huge childcare bills. To be honest a lot of couple I know work around each other like this whether it is one working evenings/ weekends in a supermarket / bar / chip shop etc or doing nights in a care home or whatever it takes.

Jenijena · 26/09/2015 16:14

Don't forget that by the time your second is born, your eldest will be eligible for some funding towards childcare. For us, we're saving about £200 a month.

I think the answer is with two children, and 'medium' salaries, you work to keep the job open and/or your sanity. That first month without childcare bill is going to be amazing!

Having said that, it's taken me two years to fall pregnant with my second, so going to have approximately five childcare 'free' months before it all starts again... (And I'm also ignoring in denial about the cost of pre and after school care...

LittleMissStubborn · 26/09/2015 17:15

My sister is a teacher, she used 2 different CM's. One was quite happy to not work in the holidays, and the other she paid 50% fees.

She also had just over 3 years between them (but 4 school years) and so didn't ever have 2 in f/t childcare, because as she went back after m/l he was just about to start f/t school.

I, on the other hand, gave up work and we have lived on one (modest) wage ever since. Firstly dh worked and now almost 8 yrs on and other child, I work and he is the sahp.

HeadDreamer · 26/09/2015 17:29

You need to earn more to work full time Smile I earn double what you earn. That's quite an average wage. I guess that's not the answer you are looking for!

Also nursery here is more like £1100 a month.

Also i don't have two at nursery at the same time. My second maternity finished after DD1 started in YR. that helps a lot with childcare costs.

Babyroobs · 26/09/2015 19:15

£53k an average wage. Really ? !!

HeadDreamer · 26/09/2015 19:26

babyroobs if you believe what a lot of MNers earn, then yes. Many are in the city and they easily get over £100k. And then you see the kind of holiday advice they are asking on the travel boards. Then the independent school for 2-3 children.

In my NCT group of 6, 4 are planning to go private for secondary. Our house is also the second smallest. It is easy to know we clearly worse off.

Pico2 · 26/09/2015 19:31

It's not why we've done it that way, but a 4-5 year age gap means only one set of nursery fees at a time. I do know people who have that age gap for that reason.

TripleRocks · 26/09/2015 19:33

We managed it by waiting for the 15 hours funding to come through (3 year age gap) and banking the full allowance of childcare vouchers for the year I was on maternity leave, which then tided us over the one year they were both in childcare.

I pretty much broke even from my salary last year, but DD started school this month. When DS gets his funding through in 2017 we might even be able to start repaying some of the capital on our mortgage! Massive juggling act but we've made it through.

captainproton · 26/09/2015 19:38

I know some people wait until about 9-12 months before their eldest starts school. That way reducing childcare costs. Also if you have a summer baby your child will start school almost a year before autumn babies. This helps costs too.

Groovee · 26/09/2015 19:42

I was at home for 6 years. I had planned to go back when Dd was 2 but just as I lined work up I was pregnant with ds.

But we managed. When I returned to work, I work in a school nursery, I used a term time only childminder.

Imperialleather2 · 26/09/2015 19:46

This sounds harsh but if you can't afford it you can't. I'd like a third but we can't afford it so we're not.

As for posters suggesting looking at entitlement to benefits i really don't think that's agood plan for starting out. There is no guarantee that you'll always been entitled.

Theres advice if leave an age gap big enough so you only have,1 lot of childcare at a time.

As for how do others afford it, they just earn more.

Florriesma · 26/09/2015 19:56

You probably can afford it on that wage. But I would investigate childminders. Some will only take their hols in school hols.
If you time it right (!) Dd could be in nursery when you're off on mat leave. So instead of doubling costs you just extend them. Childminders may only charge half for retention fees in school holidays for pick ups. It seems a bit mad to pay for 51 weeks nursery when you probably don't need that much. Unless there's no other choice of course.

Ifiwasabadger · 26/09/2015 20:03

Good question. I'm overseas, very expensive country, no benefits or state support.

So we are having just the one child as it is all we can afford.

Original poster
Frizzyliz · 26/09/2015 20:09

I'd love to get a job with more money but unfortunately it's just never happened and I think I'm probably on the best I can get in my role. Yes I don't want to rely on the free hours or anything else we could be entitled to.
I know others who seem to have 2 close together but don't earn massive amounts more than we do and I never understand how they do it. Holidays, spending more than we do on shopping etc.
I budget like crazy and still can't see how.
I'd rather not wait until dd starts school before having a second. The 15 hours free will be useful and save some money, as will the childcare voucher scheme, but even with those I think childcare for 2 will be more than my take home pay. It makes me sad that it's so difficult.
Do you want until finances are better or do you go for it and cope best you can!

OP posts:
Babyroobs · 26/09/2015 20:10

Imperial - Aren't the current govenment looking to extend free childcare for 3 and 4 year olds to 20 hours a week from 2017? Therefore some people will get more than others currently do. Some people will always have to rely on state help whether tax credits or free childcare to get by.

Original poster
Frizzyliz · 26/09/2015 20:14

We were unable to find a childminder initially as and then found her nursery which we love so much.
I think a childminder could be an option but we'd have to really look into it.

OP posts:
LittleMissStubborn · 26/09/2015 20:16

Well we earn less and have 3, it depends how you define 'afford' I guess.
But childcare will always be a big expense, and I think that is how people often define affordability.

AlpacaLypse · 26/09/2015 20:22

Whatever you do, don't fall into the trap of thinking 'my salary is the same as the childminding bill, so I might as well stay at home'. You can do that if you choose, but if you want to still have a career in your current profession in the future, you need to keep your feet somewhere under the job table.

I did give up my job for the duration of the preschool years. And I don't regret it. However, it was a job, rather than a career, with a very small company that went bust three months after my twins were born anyway (probably because I was no longer there to sort out the boss's mistakes Grin), and I really wanted to enjoy the baby years. I started my own business a few weeks after they started primary school.

If I'd had a 'career' going on, I doubt very much that I would have chosen that route.

I also had some savings, which I chose to spend on subbing out our lifestyle for those five years. Only £8K, but it made a huge difference. There was just a thousand left at the end, which I used to start the business with.

It's worked out well for us, the business now supports us all - including DP, who I took on full time last year!

Wincher · 26/09/2015 20:28

We have a just over 3 year age gap. This meant that when I went on mat leave we started getting the free 15 hours so ds1 could stay in nursery. He's summer born so by the time I went back to work he was starting school (we had two weeks of not having a child at the nursery!). We manage to juggle things with family/childcare swaps so we don't have anyt termtime childcare costs for ds1, and holday club is peanuts compared to nursery (and since your Dh is a teache4 I imagine you won't need much holiday childcare). So basically how we have afforded it is to space our family so as to only have one child in childcare at once. We're not alone - everyone I know seems to have 3 year gaps for that reason.