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Find financial and money saving discussions including debt and pension chat on our Money forum.

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Find financial and money saving discussions including debt and pension chat on our Money forum.

Money matters

Would you report this to the CSA?

31 replies

Distel · 26/04/2006 16:53

Basically we have found out that my 16 year old step son is no longer in full time education although he is not working either. This means that we officially don't have to may maintenance for him anymore, But because he isn't working, he is not going to be giving his mum any money to replace what we will be stopping. I know we can report this and get the payment stopped legally, but is it right morally?

Hope this makes sense.

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desperateSCOUSEwife · 26/04/2006 16:57

distel i would report it for the fact that your step son has to find his way in his life
and start looking for work or go into education

I would not fund a 16yo whether it was my own child or step
to sit on their arse all day, or in their pits
they need to find a vocation imo
good luck
xxx

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Distel · 26/04/2006 17:01

Thankyou, It's not like we don't need the money but do manage paying and have done for so long that we don't reallt miss the money but I keep thinking what we could do with an extra £120 a month.

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FioFio · 26/04/2006 17:07

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Distel · 26/04/2006 17:15

He is not really in touch, whenever he phones his daughter, he is out. He hasn't actually spoken to him since before christmas.

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Distel · 26/04/2006 18:22

Can I bump just to get some more oppinions please.

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Freckle · 26/04/2006 18:25

Check the wording on the original order to make sure that you can stop paying maintenance when he is no longer in full-time education.

I would also write to his mother to inform her of your intentions as it would be unfair for her to find out simply because she goes overdrawn.

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Caligula · 26/04/2006 18:25

It very much depends what the circumstances are. Is he planning to go back to full time education? Is he still living with his mother?

I don't think the moral responsibility stops with him leaving education. He will still need to be housed, fed etc. Presumably somebody is supporting him. His mother? Someone else?

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Caligula · 26/04/2006 18:26

If my DS leaves full time education at the age of 16 without work, I'll be horrified, but I won't stop supporting him.

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Distel · 26/04/2006 18:29

He is still living with his mother (well, havn't heared otherwise) and we don't think he has any intentions of going back to college, is saying that he is going to get a job. Ex wife is awkward to talk to at the best of times, all she wants to do is moan about him, wich to a certain extent I can understand.

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Distel · 26/04/2006 18:29

It is for these reasons Caligula that we are undecided.

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Caligula · 26/04/2006 18:31

Do you know whether he plans to go back to ft education? Or what he's planning to do re work/ training? TBH I'd be wanting to deal with that one before the issue of maintenance.

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waterfalls · 26/04/2006 18:32

Child benefit stops when full time education stops, he is 16 now, time to start learning to be a man, and pay his own way to his mother.

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desperateSCOUSEwife · 26/04/2006 18:33

caligula tbh they can take the piss

they come out of school thinking they are entitled to sit on their arses all day

I think it is up to us as parents to give them that kick up the backside to go and find work or stay in education tbh

btw i will support my kids in education and help them when they are actively seeking work
but not to be layabouts

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Distel · 26/04/2006 18:35

We don't really know what he plans to do as DH hasn't really spoken to him, all thsat we know is from his daughter, when he phoned ex wife, she just tried to start an argument about unrelated things. We are aware it may not be the entire truth but dh is letting the dust settle before speaking to ex wife again. This is just what we have been thinking about.

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pooka · 26/04/2006 18:36

I don't know the background, but I think morally your dh has shared responsbility for his son, regardless of whether he is 16. Maybe at 18 I'd be more likely to consider stopping CSA payments but until or he gets a job capable of supporting him I would still see him as a dependent child.

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thewomanwhothoughtshewasahat · 26/04/2006 18:41

I'm quite horrified tbh - the kid's 16 - give him a chance! I didn't know what colour eyeshadow to wear when I was 16, let alone know what to do with my life. (although I did have a job and was in ft education). I think all you need to do to find the answer that fits with your consience is ask what you would expect to do if it was your dd/ds. I see no reason at all for your dh to differientiate. I would think the reasonable approach (for your dc and for your ss) would be to discuss it with him, to set some parameters - eg how long you're prepared to support him/under what conditions.

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Freckle · 26/04/2006 19:40

And it's all very well to say give him a kick up the backside so that he'll get a job, but how many jobs are there for 16 year olds with (presumably) minimal qualifications? There are no benefits available to 16 year olds in his situation, so how is he supposed to support himself if his parents (both parents) don't do so?

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Rainbow · 26/04/2006 19:56

There are benefits out they for 16yo Freckle.

You have other children under 16 presumably Distel and you could use the £120 to support them. At 16 I went on to HE and my parents continued to receive child benefit for me, my sister didn't and my parents child benefit for her stopped when she made her own benefit claim.

There are jobs out there for 16 yo. They have to be prepared to look and work though. I have come across a lot of young people who expect to be paid just for turning up!!

I know it's not easy to pin a 16yo down but try and talk to him, find out his plans etc.

To answer the original question, yes I would report it to the CSA. If you don't it could lead to all sorts of complications later especially if DD is younger!

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FrayedKnot · 26/04/2006 20:01

DH had a court order to pay maintenance for his DS & DD until they were 16 or left full time education. The CSA was never involved.

At 15 DH started paying the money directly into their bank accounts rather than to his ex. He also explained to them that he would continue to pay the money while they were at school, college or university, but it would stop when they were working. The expectation was that they would eitehr be studying or working. Doing nothing was not an option!

Both left school after GCSE's and both started working - well, both already had part time casual jobs which they continued, initially.

Both are now working full time in other jobs.

He continues to support them with things like paying for driving lessons etc but no longer pays them the maintenance money.

In some ways I think this kind of unfair because if they lived with us, he would continue to support them living under our roof, even if they did contribute some of their wages to us, which we would expect, but it would be a nominal amount and probably wouldn;t cover everything. But it's also really quite difficult b/c where do you draw teh line, if not? As I said DH continues to support them with specific things which they would find difficult to afford, and will expect to do so until they are quite a bit older, I should imagine.

I think your DH needs to have a proper chat with his son about it.

DH was desperate for both his to go on to further education, and made it quite clear that he would support them, but neitehr of them chose that route.

Perhaps your DH could suggest to his DS that the CSA money will stop, but that he will contiinue to pay him an allowance directly (not necessarily the same amount) if he chooses to go on to futher ed?

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Caligula · 26/04/2006 20:21

I'm interested in what sort of jobs there are out there for 16 year olds. Career jobs? Or McJobs which they'll do for five years before they wise up and realise they have to go back into education in order to eventually be able to make a living? Serious question, the labour market has changed so much in the twenty years since I first went into it, and nowadays professions which never used to ask for any qualifications beyond 2 CSE's, appear to be demanding degrees for entry level. I wonder exactly what sort of jobs there are?

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claire7676 · 26/04/2006 20:35

Sorry sweetie, but as a mum and a step-mum, I don't think you should stop paying. He is only 16 and if he lived with you, you would still be supporting him just as much now as when he was 15 and at school I imagine.

However, agree that he should not think it ok to do nothing. I know these things are rarely easy, but I think your dh needs to speak to his son and find out what his plans are.

If there is any chance that he and mum can have a united front then even better, but I know from experience this isn't always possible, especially when money becomes involved.

FWIW, I also think that stopping it by writing to the CSA is only likely to enflame things everywhere.

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rickman · 26/04/2006 20:46

I don't think you should stop paying. Do people really decide that at the age of 16, their kids don't need financial support anymore and should just look after themselves? What a load of old crap that is.

I assume that all over you with children over the age of 16, have now kicked them out and don't offer any support?

Distel, what do you intend to do when your own children reach 16? Leave them to get on with it? Just because your ss doesn't live you and has now reached the grand old age of 16, I don't think your dh should decide that his duty is done. I thought you were a parent forever, didn't realise there was a time limit on it.

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panicpants · 26/04/2006 20:49

Im a mother and stepmother (well to dp's daughter) and I really think you should stop the payments for the following reasons.
The csa take a proportion of the money, so not all the money goes to the step son anyway, he needs to stand on his own 2 feet and take some sort of responsibility, you can always loan him money or support him in other ways, whose to say he even sees any of the csa money anyway.

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Caligula · 26/04/2006 20:54

Do those who believe his father should cut off his support, also think his mother should?

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edam · 26/04/2006 21:00

If you stop the money, you'll piss off your dh's ex and dh's son - and there will be a backlash. You'll be leaving the son in the lurch when he's still only a kid - I know he's 16 but he's hardly a fully-fledged adult. Most parents still support their 16yos.

If I were in your shoes, I'd get hold of him and talk about giving him a time frame for finding a job to support himself and/or cut the money back a bit. It's fair enough to expect the 16yo to make a contribution to his own upkeep now he's left school but not fair to leave him in the lurch. Some sort of compromise seems in order.

I know it's tricky to get hold of him but 16yos don't tend to be terribly helpful or understanding of the difficulty they cause adults.

FWIW my father took advantage of a major error on the drafting of the maintenance order and stopped paying when I turned 16 even though I was at school. Destroyed our relationship for a decade (and contributed to my mother's house being repossessed). So that's where I'm coming from on this.

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