Who knew your fanny shrivelled up and ran away when you hit mid 50s!?!

[shrumps]

I certainly didn’t and I miss it! The only part of my body to become skinny and Im absolutely pissed off. Why did no one tell me about this?? And now I feel I can’t tell anyone else in case it’s just me.

@RosaNovella that’s interesting to hear…should vagifem not be inserted fully?

There is a lot of discussion about this on Reddit where women who were still having symptoms found that placing the cream/ pessaries slightly lower down worked for them
Obviously my official advice is discuss with your GPgive it a try
I think fingertip to second joint was the advice

I really think this thread should be pinned at the top of the Menopause topic
@shrumps can you ask mumsnet?

What does one do with coconut oil? Shove it up minge and wait to feel better

Here's a question for everyone who has experienced symptoms. Do you think if you had known about the issue and got treatment earlier things would have been better / less distressing / less disruptive / had better outcomes etc?

I really think the NHS should do more to warn about it. E.g perhaps do a leaflet about what to lookout for and give to people aged 40 or 45? What do we think about this?

In 2018 a woman called Jane Lewis wrote My Menopausal Vagina. She was nobody famous (then) or medical, just a woman suffering with all the symptoms described here. She started a thread on another meno forum, began various treatments and eventually wrote the book with the help of her daughter. It was sent to many GP practices both for them and women to read. She was also interviewed on daytime TV.

I know women in their 80s and 90s who were on vaginal estrogen 40 years ago- so it's been around for a long time.
There was a lot of media publicity for vaginal estrogen 3 years ago when it was licensed to be sold over the counter so women over 50 didn't need a GP appt to use it.

I was warned by my (my age, woman) GP ahead of time, that definitely helped me as I was able to then just go in and tell the (young, male) GP available at the time what she’d said and get a prescription with zero fuss.
It seems like perhaps something the smear nurses could naturally incorporate.

Also looking at the main nhs page on menopause, while vaginal issues are mentioned there wasn’t an obvious link to the specific page on it and rather minimal info on treatment.

I have daily meds which can ‘encourage’ thrush and so got regular thrush cream on prescription. It was only when I got a mirror and looked at my vulva I realised I had vaginal atrophy. I didn’t think that happened until mid 70’s.
I had a telephone appt with my gp, naturally he rang whilst I was walking the dog 😂, told him of my discovery and was prescribed the estriol cream.
I very rarely suffer from thrush now and extra estriol cream is my first treatment if I get itchy.
So I was having steroid cream when I probably didn’t need it and it may have made the issue worse.

I've read that book! Poor woman had to stop work and used to hold frozen cans of beans against her bits to reduce the inflammation.

It should be required reading for GPs. We have a lot to thank women like her for, who have made it easier to get vaginal estrogen by publicising this issue. It used to be seen as too embarrassing to discuss until recently, so we have these women to thank for that, too.

Goodness knows what my poor mum did, as her generation simply didn't talk about these issues. Periods were referred to as 'The curse' and the menopause was 'The Change', ffs. I'm 62 so my mum's generation were a while ago.

This whole fucking thread needs to be pinned, and possibly published and circulated to GPs everywhere, and maybe questions in Parliament, why not? Seriously, it's one of the best and most informative and empowering threads on the Meno board - hell on MN generally - I've ever read. And while I suppose we must all, drearily, be aware that there may be an entire host of horrible men wanking away to tales of shrivelled labia, I think this is too important a topic to self-censor. If we can't talk openly about this on MN, then where??

It's a real kick up my bum to remember to use my topical oestrogen cream regularly, too. Apart from helping with thinning skin and plumpness, it also helps massively with the odd tiny pee leak overnight. Also DO MY KEGELS bloody hell, I'm so stupid to forget this stuff/can't be arsed.

My fanny is rather sad now. Labia majora are thinning. They're actually skinny. Inner flaps are definitely still flapping around but they can be sore at times (USE YOUR CREAM you daft eejit). Pubes are falling out at a rate of knots, especially where my knicker elastic rubs. My clit is most definitely shrunken. But it does still work, just about. Sometimes it's just impossible to get any interest down there, but other times it's better. I also recently invested in a Lem (clit suction device) and, well, we should all have one of those. They're amazing. I'm treating it as a medical aid to improve blood flow.

One thing I did try but recently have discontinued is testogel (testosterone gel). I only saw a very slight possible uptick in libido but no increase in energy levels, and while at first I didn't think I was getting any side effects apart from massively hairy inner thighs, I'm convinced my head hair is thinning fast. Plus, at about the same time I started to use it, I began to get hot flushes again. Not sure if it's incidental or not but I'm on HRT and they'd pretty much gone. So - testosterone isn't necessarily a holy grail to get hold of. I'm glad if it helps with clit shrinkage and libido for some women but please do watch the side effects.

BUT @GlomOfNit this topic comes up time after time - this thread is one of dozens that have been posted and it's got attention partly because of the 'cheeky' title!

I always assumed that once topical estrogen was available OTC women would know about it. It was all over the news and in women's mags, on websites etc.

There are adverts for Ovesse (the cream version) in loos in service stations for example, on the doors of loo cubicles.

Not all women suffer- around 50% or a bit more, supposedly , and 1 in 4 on HRT need it as well.

I think the issue is partly that only 15% of women use HRT and therefore are not having conversations around meno symptoms with a doctor.

I started vaginal estrogen before full HRT- I decided that the soreness etc could not be thrush as thrush treatments weren't working, and normal discharge was going AWOL, so I asked my consultant for the cream to try.

i had no idea about it , till I started suffering. I honestly thought I had some sort of STD ( I’m in good company as Halle Berry has come out and said the same).
A lot of my friends of the same age look blank or think I’m exaggerating, but I’ll keep banging the drum. I will be on HRT till I die .

Agree
Im an HCP so I asked for it
I think the message is coming through
At every GP its been brought up even though its on my notes

I think there are some doctors who feel they can't win!

Some male GPs may be uncomfortable asking a woman of 45+ 'How is your vagina?' unless the woman starts the conversation.

And so few women are on HRT and therefore aren't seeing a GP anyway, that they are either embarrassed or unaware of the issues (which I don't really understand because as far back as 40 years an older colleague (late 60s) of mine quite openly said her skin was dry and 'everything dries up when you get old' with a knowing smile.

Yes it's certainly a perennial topic here, but I think (possibly because of the clickbait title) that it's garnered a lot more posts than usual, and therefore a greater number of personal perspectives. I think that's really valuable. Ideally I think more women on MN should see this, not just the ones who frequent this board.

I agree. There are lots of adverts around now for Ovesse both online, in women's glossy mags and in women's loos.

Also if women read 'menopause websites' for instance Balance, every symptoms of meno is covered including vaginas.

I think if you know you might have issues with very painful sex, accommodating things and/or urinary incontinence, getting a pelvic floor physio to examine you is an excellent idea. You are right, not everyone benefits from Kegals but most do- if you think you are hypermobile or have urinary incontinence or other issues (tightness) then get that checked out as you have to do different exercises than everyone else. I know someone that did, it cost £50 for an initial consult and you can find a pelvic floor physio through Nuffield or local private hospitals.

Most people don't do enough pelvic floor work though, so I'm wary of saying don't do it til you get checked- I mean I just started following an Instagram lady and my vag is now like a steel trap!

Funnily enough, I did not have big problems with the rest of menopause, just felt drier all round (I'm also on medication that dries things out). I didn't have the night sweats, hot flushes etc and am not on HRT.

So, whether you find the menopause a complete nightmare or quite ok, the loss of oestrogen can definitely affect our tissues round our whole bodies and dry them out. I can't tolerate contacts for the same reason now.

My friend told me about vaginal atrophy when I was 50 and I never even heard those words. I was astonished. Glad she did tell me! It's life-changing in a small, day-to-day way to be comfortable and able to have nice sex if you want to.

Like Bill Bailey?

im 43, haven’t noticed anything yet.

should I do anything preventatively? Other than kegals.

Does estrogen etc have any risks associated with it? I think HRT increases cancer risk, is that right?

Not meaning that in an inflammatory way, I think I will probably request HRT when the time comes.

I don’t know much about it, but I know some of these symptoms sound horrific, and I know a few
women who said HRT been a lifesaver.

My point was Kegels are pushed as the be all and end all when in fact they are not
Wonen should be properly assessed not given blanket advice
I dont have a prolapse, have never had a prolapse and in fact it was the opposite causing my symptoms
Not sure what you mean by "accomodating things"?
My symptoms were urinary frequency and burning not painful sex -that would be VA, I dont have it because Im on pessaries
Essentially Im wondering how many women were give short course antibiotics by GPs when they had hypertonic pelvic floor not recurrent UTI

@UnaPersson My mum is old (in her 90s) and her generation did use vaginal estrogen. They were embarrassed to ask for cream, but many did. It was conversations between women rather than online!

Best if you do some reading online where this is covered. Look at the Balance website of Dr Louise Newson or any of her videos and podcasts.

Am I the only woman who has never examined her fanjo 😳
I think I’ve been quite lucky by the sounds of things.
I’ve never had a UTI or thrush or anything like that.
But If I looked at everything with a mirror I wouldn’t know if it was good or bad?

Maybe my mum used it but didn't tell me! Hope so if she needed it. I didn't realise it had been available for that long.

You can get electric shavers for intimate bits that get pretty close but don't damage the skin like shaving or waxing, it's like day old growth. Cheap, £15 off Amazon.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0FS7CWYXY?ref_=ppx_hzsearch_conn_dt_b_fed_asin_title_1&th=1