BBC1, 8PM Tomorrow (Monday 30/9). Panorama - The Menopause Industry.

[SebastianFlytesTrousers]

Documentary presented by Kirsty Wark investigating the multi million pound global menopause industry.

Should be interesting.

Me too.

So for anyone yet to watch, the Panorama is 10 minutes max discussing why many of the supplements are a waste of money, then a 20 minute hatchet job on Louise Newson.

I go to an NHS meno clinic. I have an appointment every 12 months. The appointment lasts 10 minutes if I'm lucky. However, they have supported all my requests for HRT, in the form I want them without issue until my last appointment at the beginning of September.

I've been on Hrt for 5 years. I'm on 75 patch and coil plus extra progesterone. I said to her that symptoms seem to be rearing again...insomnia, joint pain, hot flushes at night, heart palpitations and anxiety is building horribly. When I mentioned anxiety, she said 'hmmm...we aren't really sure if menopause affects anxiety so...' and then just stared at me. My jaw clanged to the floor and before I could gather thoughts to disagree, she'd moved onto tell me that as I'm 'this far in to the menopause, they don't usually recommend an increase in estrogen '?!

She suggested that because I'd had these issues building over the last 3-4 months, that I probably had a dodgy batch of patches so to just start a new box of patches ASAP. (Can you imagine having a "dodgy batch of meds" for a diabetic patient or for a cancer patient or for someone with cystic fibrosis for example?!!) She's calling me in 4 weeks to see if symptoms have improved. If not, she said they'd consider changing to estrogen gel rather than patch to see if its an absorption issue.

I was totally knocked sideways when she said that about anxiety symptoms. When my peri kicked off at 45 and I eventually started hrt at 50, the anxiety was off the scale but was then totally eliminated by the hrt!! It saved me! And I don't know if it's standard nhs to not increase estrogen if you've been taking it for 5 years?!

Sorry I've de-railed with personal info when thread is about newson clinic but I'm not convinced that even nhs specialist nurse knows what she's talking about!

Just watched. I have had endometriosis and fibroids so always thought I’d never be allowed to have HRT. Was then prescribed it by an endo consultant and it certainly helped with hot flushes.
I then did get whipped up into the whole menopause industry and then paid privately. Oestrogen dose was upped and testosterone was introduced. Not good.
Just waiting for biopsy results due to persistent bleeding and pelvic pain. I stopped the testosterone a while ago.
Nee consultant says she wants to remove my ovaries and tubes yet but not given me a reason.
One thing I do know is that clinics are overrun with post menopausal women who are bleeding because their HRT doses don’t suit them.
This film scared the life out of me. I’m not on a particularly high dose of anything now, but I just find the whole lack of clarity terrifying. As women we are just getting pushed around from pillar to post and it’s unfair.
The supplements section was interesting.
But most of all the value came from women being in a support group talking to each other.
Sometimes I wish I hadn’t bothered at all taking HRT but it had seen me through the perimenopause reasonably well. I’m now worried about what’s happening with my womb biopsy though.

Why are Dexa scans so difficult to get? Im in Glasgow and the nearest scanner without a gp appointment is Inverness!! I stopped hrt due to spotting and health anxiety and i want a dexa scan to see if my bones are ok. I will pay for it.

Confused about something. The BBC report said 100 micrograms of oestrogen (abbreviating to mcg for now) is the upper safe limit. I take Oestrogel and each pump has 750mcg in it, and I take four pumps - as recommended by my standard NHS gp. So I’m taking 3,000 per day.. maths says that’s 30 times the recommended dose which I don’t believe for a moment can be the case. Is it different if it’s through the skin? The article didn’t suggest that was the case. Two pumps is the standard dose which I started on. Also taking Utrogestan for 12 days a month. Can anyone clarify? Have they made a mistake and should they be saying milligrams (mg) rather than mcg. As I’d be on 3mg per day and 100mg would then seem to be massively high in comparison, which makes more sense.

It looks like one pump of oestrogel is the equivalent to a 25mcg twice weekly patch. So that would make sense that 4 pumps is the maximum dose.

Most women start on 50 mcg patches so equivalent to 2 pumps.

Thank you for pointing this out - it makes her actions all the more foolhardy when she isn't actually a consultant gynaecologist herself. I'm not one for 'eminence based medicine' but it is concerning to see GPWSIs presenting themselves as experts. See also Webberley Not sure the distinction is made clear to the public.

Just for information, LN's prescriber is Dr Nick Panay - eminent Endocrinologist and former chair of the BMS and current chair of the IMS.

I wondered if it was going to be a hatchet job on Louise Newson, they’ll no doubt wheel out a few women who’ve had bad experiences with her clinic - no doubt they won’t have the equivalent number of women they have helped - I’ll watch it !

I don’t think she’s ever claimed to be a gynaecologist! She’s was a GP, she’s trained as a menopause specialist and is also a physician. I’m not sure you’d get to see anyone with this expertise on the NHS. You may get lucky and your surgery may have a menopause specialist.

Btw my GP is more than happy to prescribe testosterone so not just consultants can prescribe

But he thinks it’s safe to prescribe higher does of oestrogen? Surely this might be a sign that the guidelines may need tweaking.

She talks about it and names Dr Panay on a very recent Instagram post.

Successful woman takes on the NHS, witch hunt ensues, no-one is shocked.

How many middle-aged women could go on Panorama and talk about the absolutely shit service they’ve received from the NHS?

I know of so many women that have been fobbed off and disregarded - and at least one that has died young as a result.

But take us backwards, BBC, why not?

Pricks.

It was prescribed due to poor absorption from the patches she is using by her own admission - partly also due to poor adhesion. If she were to switch to Estrogel, possibly she wouldn't need 'two patches' (her words). She has stated that she doesn't find that Estrogel fits in with her lifestyle though. So nothing to do with 'guidelines needing an overhaul' as this is an individual case of poor absorption/patient preference of product.

https://www.uclh.nhs.uk/our-services/find-service/womens-health-1/gynaecology/reproductive-medicine-unit/menopause

Specialist clinic, NHS, run by a consultant. There are others elsewhere. Not enough, it's true, but they are available.

Really disappointed in Kirsty Wark to be honest. Rather than exploring why so many women are going ro private clinics in the first place (because the NHS advice is so hit and miss, so often absolutely bloody awful) they have cherry-picked some horror stories from one particular clinic they dislike.

Kirsty Wark did so much to start the conversation about menopause, along with other women like Davina McCall and Mariella Frostrup. And the tone of that Panorama was "back in your box, stop whingeing, accept whatever crumbs of shitty advice the NHS is prepared to dish out as private clinics will damage you".

Yes I know it’s down to poor absorption. So surely other women may suffer from poor absorption?

My point is it must be tricky to prescribe higher than the licensed dose. No GP would. She can have higher due to her expert doctor. She is getting criticism for doing the same. He is ok to do this. She is not?

Perhaps the guidelines don’t need to change but the education and understanding about how individuals absorb differing amounts of oestrogen does.

I mean honestly. Do we all think women really want to pay ££ for menopause medication. I think we’d rather the GPs and NHS were better at this.

She mentioned this years ago when she started HRT and who she saw.

Discussing her own dose of estrogen is personal to her and her medical history.
For a start, she's had a hysterectomy. (This is all in the public domain on her website etc.)

That means she is not at risk of hyperplasia no matter how much estrogen she uses (which is the main point of the BBC programme it would seem) and we don't know exactly what she means by a 'higher dose'.

My feeling is the BBC is cherry-picking examples with an agenda.

Having said that I can't understand why a woman on a 300mcg patch would be using only 100mgs Utrogestan and it not being addressed if she had symptoms.

It seems the NHS and GPs have no desire to be better at it. They are not interested. OK, you get the odd superstar GP who does take a real interest, or one like the 4th I saw who agreed with me that he was happy to prescribe HRT. But the others were not interested and did not even make the connection to sudden onset anxiety at the age of 49 and a hysterectomy.

Oh ok great. Everyone can go there. What is everyone moaning about? Why are women paying private?!

I pay through the nose for LN’s clinic. They are helpful, sympathetic, efficient, expert and speak to me - and, moreover, listen to me.

In short, everything the NHS doesn’t do.

Kirsty Wark should make a film about that.

I didn't say everyone could go, I said they are available. Some women may not be aware of that and find it helpful. The consultant who runs it also has a private clinic which may be of interest to someone who wants/can pay for private care and would like to see someone qualified at that level.