What happens without HRT?

[ByersGreen]

Are there any concerns about doing nothing.

I don't sleep well and have flushes. Weight is fine. Bit down tbh.
This will all pass I assume.

Is there a long term negative to seeing this through without any medication?

'It's really hard to debate it on here without getting shouted at. And being pushed to go to private expensive clinics'

Yes I've noticed!

'Are you considering HRT yourself and wanting more reassurance?'

I'm always considering it, can't you tell

As I've said throughout though the conflicting info puts me off. The aching joints etc etc are all manageable. I don't want to tie myself to reviews and prescriptions but if new data came across that showed definitively it does protect against dementia, that it doesn't increase the risk of dementia as some data shows then that would be helpful. It isn't recommended for longer than 5 years so I just wonder if dealing with the natural decline in oestrogen over the course of years is better than replacing it then stopping it again.

Anyway I'll continue reading! but please, I'm not after a 'heated debate' nor am I stupid. Even if those stats are over 5yrs an extra 1 in 50 would seem a significant number.

To call women 'parrots' is deeply insulting.

I don't feel at all insulted and quite understand what JaniieJones was saying. I think she has been very measured in her responses.

I have no idea what that post said tbh!

The fact is that according to the LATEST RESEARCH there is a small increase in BC among women who take HRT (with progesterone).

Yes there's a huge risk in being overweight, yes the risk increases with alcohol but there IS an increased risk with HRT.

Being told that you are frightening people off by mentioning it is ridiculous.

I have taken HRT and currently feel fine off it (but as I can't remember what that deleted post said maybe I do need it for brain fog)

'but as I can't remember what that deleted post said maybe I do need it for brain fog'

OP, you don’t sleep well right now and experience flushes.
Don’t assume that these symptoms will go away, but they may decrease as time goes by. Only you will know how you truly feel during menopause.

The point is, you have a choice. Which path type chose, HRT to not, is your call at the end of the day.

Every menopause is different as you can see from the response you have received. Some sail through unscathed, whilst others suffer and enter hell.

It is important to note that there are Oestrogen receptors in many parts of a woman’s body, hence the weird symptoms, we can experience at any point during the menopause. For me, driving has become problematic and remembering words. For others, it is joint aches and brain fog.

Best of luck. Having a choice is what is important during menopause.

@Bryonyshcmyony

It's really hard to debate it on here without getting shouted at. And being pushed to go to private expensive clinics

Just make your point and don't get drawn in. Other women reading it will either find it useful or dismiss it.

@IfNot

I didn't think the info on HRT was conflicting? I thought the info had been updated based on newer research? It is always funny to me how when we were young doctors couldn't put us on the Pill fast enough, and the risks were totally glossed over (or at least I don't remember any debate about whether young girls should be on the Pill). The Pill helps nubile young girls have sex but no babies. Whereas HRT helps older women cope with life in general, be able to sleep, do their jobs, not kill their teenage kids as well as have sex sometimes, and suddenly it's "oh the danger!" Hmmm

My thoughts exactly. 100% well said.

Surely it comes down to individual assessment of their own risks vs benefits. There is no right or wrong.

I decided to try HRT aware of the risks and benefits. The long term benefits were not much of interest to me because I am at very low risk of heart disease and osteoporosis. I however have breast cancer in the family. Still I was prepared to give HRT a go. So much that I've tried 4 different regimes. Not provided the respite I was hoping from it, so it really wasn't worth it.

My friend often moans about hot flushes and other symptoms. I've asked her why she hasn't given hrt a try, but her response is that she's learned to cope with it all, it's bearable and she doesn't want to try medication that she deems unatural.

Of all my friends and colleagues going or having gone through the menopause, only about 1/4 are on HRT. About half moan about it but just get on with it. About 1/4 sail through it with little affect.

I do however think there is a false assumption that HRT will definitely help with all symptoms experienced and be a life saver. It certainly is for many, and reading here, it would seem all, so the whole process of trying different regimes, having to wait weeks to see improvements that have never materialised has been mentally and physically tough.

It left me thinking it was only me and therefore feeling even more alone. However, I was surprised when I opened up about it to find out that I was far from an exception and that many women don't fare well on hrt at all.

I think it would help to have a more balance views, as the hardest part for me as been the constant disappointment of seeing my hopes crushes and it would have been easier to accept that it might indeed never be the lifesaving it is for the most.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

I think younger women should keep in mind menopause is not a problem for many women

And l think younger women should be aware that up to a third off working women leave their job due to menopause issues. As l had to.

I think they should be aware of both. I think we have gone from little or no discussion of menopause to alot of information about how terrible it is but the reality is that it isn't terrible for anyone. I loved not having periods, I loved that my lifetime of migraines stopped. I had no hot flushes, no brain fog (well no more than usual) and because my menopause was surgical in my 40s I had none of the peri menopause build up. For me it was a win win situation.

I think it is good to be informed, good to know what help is available if you have problems but also good to know it isn't always a problem.

Sorry should say it isn't terrible for everyone, not anyone.

@vivainsomnia

I do however think there is a false assumption that HRT will definitely help with all symptoms experienced and be a life saver. It certainly is for many, and reading here, it would seem all, so the whole process of trying different regimes, having to wait weeks to see improvements that have never materialised has been mentally and physically tough.

It left me thinking it was only me and therefore feeling even more alone. However, I was surprised when I opened up about it to find out that I was far from an exception and that many women don't fare well on hrt at all.

I think it would help to have a more balance views, as the hardest part for me as been the constant disappointment of seeing my hopes crushes and it would have been easier to accept that it might indeed never be the lifesaving it is for the most.

That is interesting. I really didn't know that.

I am dithering about whether to get my prescription refilled. I feel OK, I think. Very mild hot flashes. Mild anxiety. But sleeping OK and plenty of energy atm. I'm going to wait a few weeks and see how I go.

Like @MakeCrisps most menopausal and postmenopausal women I know, including me, are not on HRT. I didn't realise this was unusual.
To answer your question, in my case, a few years of poor sleep an hot flashes, a thickened waist and carry on.

To answer your question, in my case, a few years of poor sleep an hot flashes, a thickened waist and carry on

But doesn't poor sleep impact you mentally?
I think quality sleep is the key to feeling alive, I mean if you have night after night of poor sleep, surely it impacts your ability to function after a while (particularly if the flushes are the cause of the poor sleep?)

It was the 'few years' thing that scared me.

My flushes etc started when I was 46 and I didn't know what to make of that.

Endure them, carry on for years hoping I would soon be out the other side - and everyone pointing out that 51 was the average meno age. My mother had periods until she was 53.

TBH, it was like being given a prison sentence with no set term (sorry if being melodramatic) and I wasn't prepared to write off four, six whatever years of my life. I got HRT.

And I fully agree with other posters here who point out that the Pill is not without its risks, and doctors underplay the risks of the Pill unless there are strong contraindications. But it is also implicated in higher rates of breast and cervical cancer (which I;ve never understood, no, but apparenttly it is.)

'But doesn't poor sleep impact you mentally? I think quality sleep is the key to feeling alive'

Yes but the older you get you need to take more of an active role in things you did easily when younger. I could sleep for hours after drinking coffee and doing little exercise. Now I can't, so I drink decaffeinated coffee or green tea and need to exert myself be it cycling or brisk walking for an hour a day. I know people who drink every single night, find once older they wake up early, they call this 'insomnia' so then get sleeping pills. Just stop drinking every night and see how that affects the sleep pattern after a couple of weeks.

Women need to be prepared, it isn't all doom and gloom but things need more attention and more effort than when younger. Overheating etc can flare up then settle down in many women, once it starts it doesn't mean that is it for ever.

I think quality sleep is the key to feeling alive, I mean if you have night after night of poor sleep, surely it impacts your ability to function after a while (particularly if the flushes are the cause of the poor sleep?)
Before the menopause, I slept so well. I went through very stressful events, a very demanding and pressurised life, but it was time to sleep, I just left that world, crashed and woke up refreshed and ready to go.

Then I found myself not coping with stress like I used to and before I know it, I started to find things overwhelming when I would have just dealt with it before. I also noticed that even though I was going to sleep fine, and seeming to sleep ok, I woke more and more feeling jetlag and that I had got no sleep. It made no sense until I got the fitbit and realised that I was waking up many times in the night and getting very little deep sleep.

This has been the story of my life for 5 years now. I have tried everything and I do mean everything. If only things could have been sorted when I gave up caffeine, took on meditating, and increasing my exercise. I changed jobs, cut down on hours, have no stress in my life, yet quality sleep evade me every night. Every other symptom is manageable. I don't get many hot flushes, I don't get anger burst, or sudden depression. I just get all the after effect of poor sleep and that's really not nice.

That's why I try 4 types of HRT, but the regime never helped. It just feels like my life is a cycle of feeling totally exhausted mentally and physically during the day and comes evening, I am washed by adrenalin and absolutely nothing I do to relax has any effect.

My mum keeps assuring me that it will just pass, that it did for her so I just wait. In the meantime, I try to focus on the positive. I am healthy, I have a good life, I just have to put a lot of what I could do if I slept better on pause, there will be plenty of time to do it all again when the menopause is over.

'That's why I try 4 types of HRT, but the regime never helped. It just feels like my life is a cycle of feeling totally exhausted mentally and physically during the day and comes evening, I am washed by adrenalin and absolutely nothing I do to relax has any effect.'

Perhaps it isn't hormone related then? If 4 different types of hrt haven't worked I'd go back to your gp and ask for cbt, maybe try anti anxiety meds and/or sleeping tablets if you've tried everything else. Hope you get it sorted.

Janie, I don’t drink alcohol, or coffee. I exercise regularly and eat well. Im 50 and post menopausal. If I don’t take my Hrt, I don’t sleep, literally! No amount of exercise is going to rectify that. If I don’t sleep, I can’t function, if I can’t function, I can’t work, if I can’t work, I’m broke and miserable. That’s the reality for some ( not all women).

The OP needs to find out for herself how she copes with whatever the gift of menopause offers her 🤞

'Janie, I don’t drink alcohol, or coffee. I exercise regularly and eat well. Im 50 and post menopausal. If I don’t take my Hrt, I don’t sleep'

Yes and I absolutely wouldn't tell you not to take it, I do see how some people need it. Just some don't adjust their lifestyles once they peri and menopausal and then wonder why they can't sleep.

I've just had my first prescription written and looking forward to starting. I have taken very little hormonal contraception compared to most women, and have been trying to do menopause alone when I just thought what the hell, try it. I think I might be expecting a lot to change though! We will see.
I was glad I'd read up on it as I was just offered anti depressants the last time I raised symptoms with a doctor.

My sleep is not helped by youngish dc and a stressful job that I'm finding harder to cope with. I can't make any lifestyle changes in those two areas!

I'm glad the question has been asked. I'm approaching peri menopause most probably (45) and HRT is on my mind. You see - I get that drinking and being over weight are greater risks BUT I don't and never have done or been either! I'm tee-total and have been for years. Vegetarian (vegan right now due to baby being allergic to milk protein). Exercise for 1hr 6 times a week. I've lowered my bc risk by breastfeeding - I've racked up 19yrs of breastfeeding (on going) having had 9 children. My DM took old type HRT for 5yrs (came off it because of the bc risk report). Is fit and well and no signs of osteoporosis. I do worry about dementia as my grandmother had it but there is no proven link yet.

And I've always been a poor sleeper - I can get by on very little sleep. But the collagen protection, hair thinning protection, mood protection - now they're important to me and tbh I just don't want to be old!