What happens without HRT?

[ByersGreen]

Are there any concerns about doing nothing.

I don't sleep well and have flushes. Weight is fine. Bit down tbh.
This will all pass I assume.

Is there a long term negative to seeing this through without any medication?

@krystalweedon

Statistically, women using HRT have less co-morbidity and live longer than women not on HRT (this is not opinion, it's factual.)

@JinglingHellsBells do you have some links on this, please?

Don't have time to look for you, but put the right words into google and you will find plenty of papers on it. I think the International menopause Society shows this in the their paper on women's health in midlife.

it's easy enough to find.

@Bryonyshcmyony

It is also factual that women taking HRT are more likely to get breast cancer is it not?

I think that's been proved to be incorrect. It was a scare story which stuck.

Has it? That's good.

"There is little or no change in the risk of breast cancer if you take oestrogen-only HRT.

Combined HRT can be associated with a small increase in the risk of breast cancer.

The increased risk is related to how long you take HRT, and it falls after you stop taking it.

Because of the risk of breast cancer, it's especially important to attend all your breast cancer screening appointments if you're taking HRT"

NHS website

@Bryonyshcmyony

It is also factual that women taking HRT are more likely to get breast cancer is it not?

There are no more deaths from BC using HRT. There are more deaths from heart disease, dementia and fractures.

There are also 8 x as many cases of BC from being overweight (28 extra cases per 1000 women, compared to 3-4 cases using some types of HRT.)

It's not an easy choice, but it's important to look at the stats when making a choice.

No more deaths but more cases?

Each person is different and you need to find what suits you whether that be natural, a bit of both, or full-on HRT. One thing I don't appreciate though is constantly being told that if I don't take HRT I will end up with all kinds of things wrong with me such as dementia, osteoporosis, etc., etc. As with a lot of things, your genes and how much you take care of yourself will determine how you age. I don't think someone who is the same age as me (50's) who is on HRT is better off than me who is fit and healthy, has a great diet and a healthy BMI.

I agree SummerLoving. (I'm 60 btw and run regularly to try and maintain my mental and bone health.)

What I don't understand is whether HRT is just putting the problem off for 7-8 years? Which of course is great in itself, but does your body somehow change in those years to get used to less natural oestrogen so that you can then gradually stop? Or do you get a sudden artificial menopause when you come off it? If (and this is a big 'if', as I don't know) the symptoms gradually stop as you go through it, is it better to go through it when you are maybe 50 and then feel better by 60, rather than start it at 60? Or does it not matter, and if you can put it off, better for the rest of your body?

It's like filling the bath with the plug out.

You and some others on here are peddling HRT as if it is some kind of fountain of youth that will give everyone a healthy and long-lasting life. It's not. It helps some people who are really struggling, it does nothing for others, and for some, it will make them sick. It made me worse.

There are quite a few heavy-handed pro-HRT on here and it makes me think that you come in hard-hitting to justify your own personal decisions.

Taking HRT should be the last resort, not the first port of call.

I think you can't rely on HRT alone. If you think taking a magic pill will mean you can do fuck all, drink wine and generally live like you did in your twenties you might get a shock. Diet and exercise are massively massively important as you age. Of course, sometimes HRT will give you a boost so that you actually feel like exercise when you couldn't face it before. I know my HRT cured my joint pains so I'm wondering when they'll come back...

I'm 61 and periods stopped around 54. Some hot nights, possibly more anxiety than before? Otherwise I'm fit and energetic and luckily very healthy. Never took anything for it.

I can’t take HRT.

For me: l use Hyalofemme as can’t use vaginal oestrogen.
Take soy tablets for hideous itching
Anti depressants for increased anxiety
Steroid drops for permanently itchy eyes.
Lots of emollients for eczema

And actually I’m fine.

If you think taking a magic pill will mean you can do fuck all, drink wine and generally live like you did in your twenties you might get a shock.

This is actually what I am experiencing with my friends. None of them have dropped the booze or rich foods. None of them have taken up exercise or lost weight. They feel "fantastic" on the HRT, but they are still unfit and overweight.

But apparently, they are going to live longer than me....

I do think there is an element of perspective needed. I have a friend who is on hrt, before starting it she used to describe 'being drenched with sweat', being 'wringing wet'. Now I spend a lot of time with her and during theses episode there wasn't any sign of dripping sweat not even a moist brow. Not saying saying she didn't feel hot and uncomfortable but some of the hyperbole around the menopause does sometimes seem to encourage people to seek out prescriptions and medication. 'Rages' being another thing. They are mood swings, similar to what teenagers get in puberty. We wouldn't give them medication to stop puberty though, we give them support and advice on managing it.

VA is of course unpleasant but local treatment which is without any risk works just fine.

'Also - helps stop collagen loss. Keeps your skin plump'

Yes and I can't help wondering if the over botoxed celebs do it for this reason rather than the 'symptoms' they say are unbearable.

If someone presented me with definite evidence that says it protects against dementia I'd possibly take it but when there is evidence that says it may protect and other studies that say it increases the risk I'd rather not. Maybe in 10 years it will be more common as more conclusive evidence emerges.

When I went to the doctors as a teen for heavy periods and mood swings they put me on the pill.

I don’t see this as any different. I’ve turned into a vile ragey person that I don’t recognise (Well I do recognise, it’s my menopausal mother), frankly, my family deserve better then the person I’ve become.

But that’s just me and my experience.

@SummerLovingHadMeABlast

If you think taking a magic pill will mean you can do fuck all, drink wine and generally live like you did in your twenties you might get a shock.

This is actually what I am experiencing with my friends. None of them have dropped the booze or rich foods. None of them have taken up exercise or lost weight. They feel "fantastic" on the HRT, but they are still unfit and overweight.

But apparently, they are going to live longer than me....

They're foolish. The more I read about breast cancer and alcohol the more I'm trying to cut back on it. I accept a very slight increase in risk on HRT (from the Mirena progesterone element) but my doctor has made it clear that alcohol is what I should really be careful about.

And we have to take more exercise, not less, as we age to keep healthy, has been my experience.

Getting older is not for the faint-hearted.

@EvilPea

When I went to the doctors as a teen for heavy periods and mood swings they put me on the pill.

I don’t see this as any different. I’ve turned into a vile ragey person that I don’t recognise (Well I do recognise, it’s my menopausal mother), frankly, my family deserve better then the person I’ve become.

But that’s just me and my experience.

Yes, fair comment.

I go round in circles about this, on the one hand it's a manageable life change why increase any risk of any health issues but as you say we don't question it with other meds. I think with the pill it obviously has the duel benefit of actually preventing unwanted pregnancies so the benefits really do outweigh the risks.

@JaniieJones

I do think there is an element of perspective needed. I have a friend who is on hrt, before starting it she used to describe 'being drenched with sweat', being 'wringing wet'. Now I spend a lot of time with her and during theses episode there wasn't any sign of dripping sweat not even a moist brow. Not saying saying she didn't feel hot and uncomfortable but some of the hyperbole around the menopause does sometimes seem to encourage people to seek out prescriptions and medication. 'Rages' being another thing. They are mood swings, similar to what teenagers get in puberty. We wouldn't give them medication to stop puberty though, we give them support and advice on managing it.

VA is of course unpleasant but local treatment which is without any risk works just fine.

'Also - helps stop collagen loss. Keeps your skin plump'

Yes and I can't help wondering if the over botoxed celebs do it for this reason rather than the 'symptoms' they say are unbearable.

If someone presented me with definite evidence that says it protects against dementia I'd possibly take it but when there is evidence that says it may protect and other studies that say it increases the risk I'd rather not. Maybe in 10 years it will be more common as more conclusive evidence emerges.

Like your friend, I was 'drenched in sweat' and 'wringing wet'. However, it wasn't always visible as they never showed on my face/brow. Usually the hot flashes would start across my chest or back, and clothing disguised this. It wasn't just the hot flushes that were so awful, it's the way the sweat instantly cools and is freezing against my (permanently hot skin). For a good six month, I used to change my clothes midway during the day, I had duplicates so no-one noticed I had done this. Shortly before I started on (the correct for me) HRT, I was having 50-60 hot flushes a day. It was debilitating.

I doubt your friend was being hyperbolic at all. Unless you experience it yourself and to the same degree, you have no way of judging someone's else experience.

Having been through menopause, and a premature one at that, I am supremely grateful for HRT, and also thankful that I had the money to pay for a specialist as the various GPs I saw were useless and disinterested.

@SummerLovingHadMeABlast

It's like filling the bath with the plug out.

You and some others on here are peddling HRT as if it is some kind of fountain of youth that will give everyone a healthy and long-lasting life. It's not. It helps some people who are really struggling, it does nothing for others, and for some, it will make them sick. It made me worse.

There are quite a few heavy-handed pro-HRT on here and it makes me think that you come in hard-hitting to justify your own personal decisions.

Taking HRT should be the last resort, not the first port of call.

@SummerLovingHadMeABlast

Myself and other posters are posting medical facts that you can find yourself online.

Nothing to do with opinion. Sadly these posts about HRT always descend into arguments and accusations. which is just weird as it's women slagging off other women.

Do you not think that the women who do use HRT are using it as the 'last resort? '

It's a personal choice. There are risks and there are benefits. Everyone makes their own choice based on information .

The facts are that 1:3 women will develop osteoporosis.
Most women do not know they have it until it's too late.
How many have a bone density scan to check? Practically none until they break a bone.

Come on Bryony, that’s old ill informed news from 2001!
Why are women on HRT more likely to get BC ?? Please explain.

Let me tell you. I had breast cancer aged 38. No HRT and perfectly healthy. Just bad luck.

Read Oestrogen Matters by Avrum Blumimg. A retired oncologist who would prescribe HRT to women who have had BC and he will tell you WHY Oestrogen is vital for the female body.

Can it ever be proved that HRT can cause BC? No it cannot.

It’s comments like yours which put the fear of god into women who may wish to contemplate trialing HRT. Except half the time, their ignorant GPs think the same thing e.g HRT contributes to BC.

Come on Bryony, that’s old ill informed news from 2001!
Why are women on HRT more likely to get BC ?? Please explain

Don't get arsey with me! That's what it says on the NHS website. Maybe contact them and tell them they've got it wrong?

It’s comments like yours which put the fear of god into women who may wish to contemplate trialing HRT

Don't be so unpleasant.

'There are quite a few heavy-handed pro-HRT on here and it makes me think that you come in hard-hitting to justify your own personal decisions.Taking HRT should be the last resort, not the first port of call.'

I agree with this, there is a current trend to medicalise it but as I've said until evidence is more conclusive it really shouldn't be encouraged imo.

If it was proven to significantly protect against dementia and osteoporosis (not just for as long as it is is taken) we would all be given it. It isn't in the interest of the nhs to deprive people of a medication that will not only protect the patient but of course reduce the pressure and therefore financial demands on the nhs.

Yes and the demanding we all look at the statistics unless the statistics don't say what they want in which case they are uninformed!