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Lone parents

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Original poster

Parental rights

26 replies

Belindaa · 09/12/2008 17:36

Does my childs father have the same rights as me? i'm the primary caregiver... He does have parental responsibility, but i've been making all the decisions for the last 9 years without any imput, hardly any monetary support, and he see's her one one night a week....
He hasn't really taken a huge interest until a week ago... now he seems to be going about things without discussion with me....
He's going to his solicitor tomorrow to find out where he stands with making decisions without consulting me first...
Can he go and have meetings with her school behind my back without me knowing??

I feel like he's taking over....... and i feel a little scared...

OP posts:
mankymummy · 09/12/2008 17:41

What is it he is actually doing?
What does he want to do?
Can you talk to him?

TinselBaublesMistletoe · 09/12/2008 17:57

There's no such thing as rights, only responsibilities. If he has PR then he has the same responsibilities you do and could go to meetings and things like that, if you're worried make sure the school always inform you directly. He won't be able to just take her away and if he applies to courts he has to show that the upheaval of moving her from her home is better for her than her staying. From what you've said I can't see that anyone would think he is behaving in a responsible way.

LittleJingleBellas · 09/12/2008 18:07

Neither of you have any rights.

Only your child does.

LittleJingleBellas · 09/12/2008 18:07

In theory

Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 18:22

He went behind my back today and had a meeting with the school about my dd's bullying, even though i met with the school last week regarding it.
I must admit that i could have involved him earlier, but he's never really taken an active interest so i didn't bother to consult him...
He also admits he hasn't been taking as much interest as he should have... he's been more concerned with his recent gf of 2 and a half years that he has now just split up with, hence the interest in our dd...
He also wants more time with her which is great, but he wants the whole weekend rather than having a weeknight, i suggested he have her thursday after school until sat eve, but he won't commit to weekdays as he says he might get a job and that will interfere with his time with her.
I'm starting a new f/t job soon, and i'd like some quality time on the weekend too...

I've tried talking to him, but when we were together we had a volatile relationship, and usually talking means him speaking and me acting like a nodding dog....
We had a conversation the other day ad it was going well until i had a doc appt for our dd to see if she needed to speak to a councellor. He just took over in the doc's, talking about himself and getting off track as usual(he could sell stripes to a zebra if he tried, he's one of theese people who has the way of turning everything in his favour and changing the subject when it suits him!)
When we got out and back to mine, we had a blazing row in front of our dd and he ended up talking at me as he used to... painting me out to be the one who makes all the mistakes and isn't doing everything right..........i've tried my bst over the last 9 years without his support.....and i know i've not done everything right...

He sent me a text today after i said i wanted to come to the school with him... it read:
it is my right as a parent with responsibilities to deal with things alone if need be. if i believe her issues are getting way laid at home or school.. You admit to losing control of the situation yourself. You also choose to negate my involvement which will inevitably play a larger part than b4, as needs must. i tried to begin an open communication line with you but its only open to the degree u want to tell me, which while resenting my help is actually stopping that open comunication. I'm sorry this doesn't meet with your appreciation, as you've already expressed but this is for ^ and whats best for her

I don't even know what he means about em admiting to losing control, maybe it was to do with me saying i don't always know what to do, but i always try...

I feel so down and don't know where to turn.....

OP posts:
LittleJingleBellas · 09/12/2008 18:33

Call the Lone Parent helpline and speak to one of the advisors there. They know all about these tossers, there are thousands of them and they can give you proper advice about what tack to take iwth this prick.

Basically he is trying to pretend that you are a control freak and he's been trying to be reasonable and open up dialogue with you. As you've refused to do things the way he wants (which is his definition of reasonable) he therefore has to go behind your back.

Don't let him play that game. Stop getting annoyed or upset by him, he's a twat and not worth the mental energy. Get some advice about how to deal with his nonsense.

Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 18:36

Thanks...

But can he make a decision and impliment it without my ok?

OP posts:
Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 18:37

or does the primary caregiver(me!) have to be consulted first?

OP posts:
LittleJingleBellas · 09/12/2008 18:41

Depends on what the decision is. If it's to do with school, no. If it's to do with where he takes his DD for contact visits, yes.

Lone Parent Helpline will be able to give you the exact breakdown of who can decide what if you give them the scenario.

Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 18:46

He takes her where he wants when she's with her, i never interfere with his time with her... he's taken her abroad on holidays before now.....
The only time i did interfere was 3 years ago when i had to go to a solicitor to stop him taking her to a hare krishna temple in watford gap(i live in Gloucestershire!)

Thanks....LJB

OP posts:
yerblurt · 09/12/2008 18:53

If the father has Parental Responsibility (PR) then you both have the same rights and responsibilities to the child (the emphasis is on the responsibilities).

In law there is no such thing as 'primary caregiver', if you both have PR then you are both equal in the eyes of the law.

Dad will have PR if he is named as father on the birth certificate and the child was born after 3 dec 2003, or if you were both married. If dad doesn't have PR then he can acquire it by you both completing a Parental Responsibility Agreement or he can make an application to court. PR is rarely not granted.

He may not have acted with as much involvement as you wanted, but as the child's dad he does have at least the right and should be given the opportunity to be kept informed of the child's educational and medical progress.

It sounds as though you both could do with an approach that reduces the tension between you both - a place where you can both express your feelings and maybe come to some form of agreement for the child's future, say by using a Parenting Plan.

I would suggest you look into family mediation or some other forum to have a discussion. It's got to be better than being at each other?

Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 18:59

He applied to the court to have parental responsibilty, and it was granted in his absence, (he didn't turn up as he decided to go to india to find out about Hare Krishna, hit france and got deported!)..
I gave him a parenting plan booklet 5 years ago after picking it up in the courts waiting room, he looked through it and gave it back without mentioning it, i then gave it him a week ago, and he did come over to discuss it but ended up talking about himself!

I just feel that for so long i've done it all, now he's trying to take it all over!

OP posts:
NowICanSpellGeansaiNollaig · 09/12/2008 19:01

He ONLY has PR IF you were married, even after birth of your child, OR if your child was born AFTER 1st December 2003.

NowICanSpellGeansaiNollaig · 09/12/2008 19:04

Ps the school should NOT forward him reports without your consent and he's NOT entitled to a meeting with the teacher.

(UNLESS of course you were married, and then, sadly, even if he only gives you tuppence a year, he can have a teachers meeting etc)

My x went to his solicitor recently, over PR, and his solicitor must have advised him that as he had not contributed to his children he would not be guaranteed to win PR, so the fact that he's hardly given you anything goes in your favour in this regard.

Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 19:07

He's already PR, he had it back in 2001 i think...

OP posts:
NowICanSpellGeansaiNollaig · 09/12/2008 19:07

Sorry x post. He was granted PR even though he didn't show up in court??? god it's a mad world.

Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 19:13

His solicitor turned up.... we had an access order to be sorted too, but they couldn't deal with that without him being there, so he just got the PR order and no access order(thats what they called it back then!)..
He's messed me round for years with having her, cancells at short notice, so i've given up on arranging things for myself on nights he was supposed to have her....
Grrrrrrr thnaks for lettting me have a rant and blow out!!!

OP posts:
yerblurt · 09/12/2008 19:28

By NowICanSpellGeansaiNollaig on Tue 09-Dec-08 19:04:15
Ps the school should NOT forward him reports without your consent and he's NOT entitled to a meeting with the teacher.

You're so wrong on this one.

The education act defines a 'parent' as anyone who cares for a child, a biological father etc. In fact dad would not even require PR for the school to provide information.

The school is following good practice and the law by providing dad with the information requested. He is entitled to be provided with copies of all school reports, details in advance of school events (plays, sports days etc), parents evenings. He has every right to make an appointment to see a teacher.

The school does NOT have to obtain consent from mum as this would be treating dad as an unequal parent and thus discriminating against him. Quite right too.

good god are you living in the dark ages?

Original poster
Belindaa · 09/12/2008 19:36

I phoned up Parentline Plus today, and they told me that i had the right to be involved with any and all meetings set up involving our daughter, whether he liked it or not... it was my right as a parent to know what was going on....

OP posts:
OptimistS · 09/12/2008 21:07

Hi Belindaa. My advice to you on this one would be to kill him with kindness. Tell him that you have decided he's right and that from now on you wish to involve him in every decision/discussion regarding your daughter. Then call him over EVERYTHING. It's a win/win situation for you. He'll either get irritated by it, drop it and let you carry on doing everything as before, or he might pleasantly surprise you and actually start behaving as a really caring, responsible parent who supports you.

Unfortunately, the law is not on your side on this one. PR means that he does have the right to have an input on deciding her school choice and even her religion, so I think this slightly devious way of dealing with things might suit you better. If he's manipulative like you say, openly resisting him might backfire on you. Play him at his own game. If this sudden interest is due to a recent breakup, chances are that as soon as he gets over it or finds a new girlfriend, things will go back to the way they were. Alternatively, is it possible that he has finally realised he's been sadly lacking in the fatherhood stakes and genuinely wants to turn over a new leaf?

NowICanSpellGeansaiNollaig · 09/12/2008 22:55

Yerblurt, my child's school consulted their lawyers and thankfully they disagree wtih you.

NowICanSpellGeansaiNollaig · 09/12/2008 23:02

Yerblurt, ehm, I feel cross reading your post.

My children's father is an unequal parent and it is entirely right and proper that the school recognises this. The notion of his being equal to me as a parent is ludicrous.

He has never contributed a penny to their upbringing, we weren't married thank God, and my dc1 was born before PR was automatic for unmarried fathers.

TinselBaublesMistletoe · 09/12/2008 23:45

I agree with NowICanSpellGeansaiNollaig.

My brother's oldest two kids aren't his, their father still has PR. Officially he died (stopped paying maintenance, wasn't claiming benefits or paying tax, CSA said when she chased them up they thought he was dead) but then turned up at the school. He tried to contact the school but they got in touch with my brother and SIL before they spoke to him so they won't talk to him.

OptimistS · 10/12/2008 00:00

PLaying devil's advocate here. This was something that really worried me as my ex has parental responsibility. I did some research.

NowIcanSpell and Tinsel, you are right that schools can behave discretionally here, but in cold, hard legal terms, a parent that has parental responsibility has legal rights to demand meetings, collect child from school, etc. However, in practice, no school in their right minds would allow a child to leave with someone the teacher has never seen before, regardless of whether or not they have parental responsibility. The trick is to play the system, and as the resident parent contact the school and make it clear that dealings direct with the NRP to the detriment of the resident parent could be extremely damaging to the child. Then you have the school on your side.

Does that help or have I inflamed people and made matters worse? Eek?

Original poster
Belindaa · 10/12/2008 15:09

OptimistS, how would you suggest i go about this? I can be a bit thick sometimes, but i am worried that he is starting to deal with the school without me.... and just telling me what he does(he did this yesterday, regarding amentor system that she school told him about, and not me, and then he asked our daughter before even discussing it with me!)
I wish i could just move away and have nowt to do with him, but my daughter is his child and she has her rights too.......
A large kitchen knife could always solve my problem!

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