Ex wants son to live with him more of the time

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Ex and I have been separated 3 years and our three children live with me and stay every other weekend with him . He was emotionally abusive to me and the children, particularly to our eldest son. It was awful, DS tried to run away, would curl up on the floor sobbing. I asked ex to leave to improve the children's home life.

DS is now 14 and his relationship with his Dad has improved a bit but he still cries a lot at home about things and tells me he hates his Dad, he is a bully, he wishes his Dad was dead.

His Dad is a bully, can be very insensitive, shouts a lot and has made DS feel very guilty about the situation, as though he is somehow responsible for ensuring his Dad is happy (his Dad tells him how desperate and unhappy he is after I 'kicked him out', made him leave his own home...). As a result DS won't even tell him when he has a good day or talk about fun things he has done at home for fear of upsetting his Dad and making him feel depressed.

Yesterday DS son said that his Dad said he wants him to now live with him 50% of the time (just him, not our younger two children he wants them to continue going EOW). I have asked DS what he wants and have told him I will support his decisions. He his adamant he does not want to live with him but says he is too scared to say no to his Dad. I completely understand this, his Dad is emotionally abusive, twists things round, will take it very personally and will try to wear DS down about it. How would you approach this? I don't believe for one second that my ex is doing this for our son's benefit. I think he is lonely and angry and is doing it purely for himself. How can I help DS feel strong enough to voice his opinion?

At 14 - tell him you are happy to tell ex this isn’t what he wants .

You are at the point you may need to be more clear about why he was asked to leave .( At an age appropriate level )

conversations about living with someone to avoid a difficult situation would make it more difficult.

I assume contact isn’t court ordered ? I would tell him at this age the courts would listen to what he wants.

I do sympathise. It is very difficult. Do you have a child arrangements order for contact? I can't believe that at 14 any court would go against your son's wishes if it got that far. I would just tell your ex your son is happy with current arrangements. I have been in a similar situation when my DS did not want to go as much as he wanted because they have found their dad difficult. They have simply told their dad they want to stick with current arrangements when he has tried to push for 50% over the years. There are ways they can say what they want without being confrontational. If you support what they have said in any communication with him, there is not much he can do other than apply to the court, which at that age he is unlikely to have the result he wants.

tell your poor son he can decide whether he wants to see his horrible, abusive father or not, and that you will not allow his father to bully either of you into going there more often. How does he behave towards your younger children?

You need to be your son’s voice here. I’d also talk to his school about the situation and try to get him some counselling re the abuse

That’s so tough, your poor DS. I think first, he will need reassurance that this will not happen, you will do whatever it takes to ensure that. I’d also let him know that a court wouldn’t make him go age 14 and you’ll support him if he decides he doesn’t want to see his dad anymore (if his dad tries to wear him down and it becomes too much).

Can you give your DS some non confrontational phrases to “broken record” his dad. So:
”I like to be with siblings so don’t want to change schedule”
“I’d prefer not to change as I like this routine”
etc

Thank you for your replies @Netcam and @Starlightstarbright3 . My understanding was that at his age a court would listen to what DS wants. We don't have anything formal, we went to mediation a few years ago and agreed that it was best for the children to live with me (I had always been their primary carer) and that Dad would see them once midweek (he comes over for dinner one night a week, which I hate, but it works ok for the kids. Once I have moved from the former marital home which should only be a few months away now, I'm going to suggest they have dinner at his once a week instead as I need a few more boundaries in place) and then they say every other Saturday night with him (he didn't want Friday nights too as apparently needs to rest after work.

I suppose my worry is that when ex keeps asking DS, he will eventually say yes to 50/50 just to stop his Dad from asking and out of guilt. Once he agrees to it ex will never back down and I feel it would be the worst thing for DS right now. My heart bleeds for DS, it seems as though he has the weight of the world on his shoulders right now, having to listen to his Dad's problems, being pestered to move in with him and then all of the usual teenage worries, hormones, friends, school work etc.

I think you have to step right in here and draw your ex's fire away from your son. You may even have to say 'I won't allow this, if you want it, take me to court' knowing that it will be ages until that happens and the court will actually listen to your son. I'm sorry, it's shit, beyond shit, but your son is not going to be able to stand up to this and will eventually back down to keep the peace.

You need to be strong for your son here. He is old enough to make his own choice.

My ds was in a similar position at 15. His elder brother gave him a few scripted answers that he found worked.

"Sorry, I have my own plans that day"

"Sorry, that doesn't work for me"

Etc etc. Ds then had immediate answers to use without having to think.

No you tell your son to tell his father he asked you and you have said NO.

Your son cannot manage this dreadful pathetic bully on his own

I would not even send my child to a monster like that!

I think I have been too diplomatic over the last few years, worried of being accussed of parental alienatianation. I should have been more honest with them about what their Dad was/is like, behaviours etc. He doesn't have much patience with 11 year old DD as he can't cope with her hormonal mood swings ( I think he thinks any issues are due to my parenting approach), he has a great relationship with our youngest. He hasn't really been emotionally abusive to him

I think ut us a really good idea to contact the pastoral support at DS's school through the office or his form tutor if you don't have contact details. Explain to them what is going on and how it us affecting your DS.

My DD has had a couple of 'courses' of counselling at school and it has really helped her find her voice.

I suggested counselling to DS but he was adamant he didn't want to talk to anyone. I think it would help him though. I have made an appointment to speak to the school pastoral team next week

Oh, and I know that it is wrong to bad mouth thier dad, but I am strongly of the opinion that you have to let your ds have a voice and support it.

So, if he is saying he doesn't want to spend more time with his dad, stop in and email your ex, telling him that it's not going to happen and stop guilt tripping ds.

Thank you @Workawayxx , they are good phrases for him to practise, a really good idea thank you

Also what I would add your Ds is approaching his GCSE years . He needs stability at this time . I would also use this in the argument for his dad .

@HelloMyNameIsElderSmurf i think you're right. Standing up to him will be the only way and I have told my son I will do everything I can to support him and what he wants/needs. I know how he feels with his Dad as I spent 20 years feeling like I have no voice around him and backing down to keep the peace.

I think this is a great idea and would really help him as I think he gets out on the spot and panics. Thank you

Thank you. I am going in to see the school next week. DS is adamant he doesn't want counselling unfortunately. DD has had some play therapy at school and it really helped her.

In the early days I had to step in with things a lot and put everything in writing by email. I think I will need to get back to doing this again.

I help him a lot with his homework and revision for tests etc. Ex has never placed any emphasis on schooling and grades and I'm sure DS's progress would slip. It is a really important few years coming up and I know it would be best for DS to be settled and have the stability of a calm home with me and his brother and sister.

What happens at the moment after school. Would your ex be around for him when he comes home from school or would he be going to an empty house?

I think the GCSEs are a good point. He could say 'I am going to be needing to do a lot of work over the coming few years and if I live here 50:50 I will need to work quite hard here when actually I really like being able to come here and mainly relax and put the work to one side.' This is true but might also appeal to your ex that he is seen as the fun one.

Good point - mum = boring, dad = fun might appeal to Exs ego.

@Unexpecteddrivinginstructor at the moment DS walks home from school with a friend and they play computer at mine for 45 minutes until I get in from work and bring the younger two home from after school club. It's then the evening routine is homework, dinner, family time, sometimes there are after school clubs etc. Often my weekends with them and Sunday evenings when they get back from their Dad's are mainly taken up with finishing off homework, rowing in their bigger projects etc as they never do anything like that whilst at their Dad's.

Dad would see them once midweek (he comes over for dinner one night a week, which I hate, but it works ok for the kids
no. That is not ok. Atop that now. That is no good for anyone except the dad. Are you the one making dinner too?

Once I have moved from the former marital home which should only be a few months away now, I'm going to suggest they have dinner at his once a week instead as I need a few more boundaries in place)
you need significantly more boundaries in place. Stop showing the children youre bending over backwards for an abuser. Theyll think they have to do the same dont suggest it, say it. Confidently.

Unfortunately as he has reminded me on numerous occasions (as has his solicitor) when I have tried to put boundaries in place, it is legally his house still and he can come and go as and when he pleases. I can't legally change the locks, he's been here when I've been away or at work. I can't wait to move.

He was threatening to move back in earlier this year when I got stricter about boundaries, then his solicitor was wanting me to move out at weekends and for him to move in as apparently that would be the easy solution for everyone and best for the kids. I quickly told him it was the most ridiculous idea and he was only thinking of himself.