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Original poster

Advice! Exes holiday contact with DS

32 replies

JoJo2106 · 11/08/2019 10:08

Hi,

Just wondering if anyone could perhaps help me with something.

There is a child arrangement order in place for my Ds, he is almost 2. Finished in court in January. There are arrangements in place regarding holiday contact for this year and it states it's to be 7 consecutive nights. The thing is my ex is trying to make it longer which would end up making it 9 days in total. My ex and I do not meet or communicate in any way other than via a communication book due to past DV. So this is now getting into a tit for tat back and forward thing in the book which is very difficult and becoming stressful for me.

The thing I would like to know is am i in my rights to stick to just what the order says. It doesnt say anything other than I've to make child available for 7 consecutive nights. Ds is already going to struggle with the 7 nights let alone any longer due to how he is just after 2 nights away from me.

I'm not willing to argue any longer in the book so would just like to know that I'm.doing the right thing by sticking to.what the order says? He seems to think he can do what he likes basically and has no regard for ds and how he would react been away from home and me that long. He just says 9 days is not too long. It is too long for ds because he doesn't see him once he gets home. Ds has also started to show signs of been withdrawn and not wanting to go at handovers so the less time it is the better.

The order says 7 consecutive nights not 8 nights and 9 days. The reason it would end up that long is once they return it would go onto his normal contact weekend which will make it longer, I have tried to say go on a midweek day and come back on a midweek day that way it will be 7 nights. It says nothing in the order about it going into any usual contact time just that hes to have 7 consecutive nights in summer 2019.

Thank you.

OP posts:

carly2803 · 11/08/2019 21:57

It isnt specific, sorry to say i think your x will get 9 nights - if the 7 is court ordered, there is nothing in there to say it cannot be on the back of regular contact (i assume?)

Turn it around - would you book a holiday and make your contact after to have more time with your child?

it absolutely sucks,that i agree with and its not fair but justtrying to put it fromanother POV

RandomMess · 11/08/2019 22:02

I think there is no harm in saying to him that the contact is 7 consecutive night only and if he wants more consecutive nights then to go back to court.

SlowMoFuckingToes · 11/08/2019 22:30

I think he's likely to get the 9 nights if it's tacked on to regular contact. That wouldn't be in breach of the order.

angell84 · 11/08/2019 23:25

Is an extra two days, really worth all this hassle and argument. It is two days! I think seven days holiday contact and two days regular contact is fine. Again - it is two days , I am not sure why you are so upset about two days?

Phillipa12 · 13/08/2019 07:06

Does your ex have every other weekend contact? If so, why cant he take him away starting on his weekend for 7 nights and then it wouldnt roll into 9 nights. Is he deliberately trying to up the nights, but in accordance with the court order so he can get the court order increased in the future?

Parent999 · 13/08/2019 07:26

On the other hand, Dad and son arent going to form a parenting bond and be ok with extended periods together if youre trying to limit it.
From my own experience, if you were to be a bit more flexible, your ex might reciprocate. Then you could negotiate keeping in contact and maybe you could have some facetime contact while dc is with his Dad.

youarenotkiddingme · 13/08/2019 07:36

The court order isn't clear.

But if it says 7 consecutive nights and also has weekend contact then I can't see how they can't be consecutive.

And children often struggle with contact at first. But they need it regularly to build up the routine.

Emma861 · 14/08/2019 01:39

Ultamately, court orders are for people who are not able to reason with one another, in this case I think it would be on your part.

Do you really need to fight about 2 extra days? Its nice that his dad wants to take care of him for that long, many do not.

Its always rubbish being away from your child for long periods but his dad will feel that too.

RandomMess · 14/08/2019 07:39

I can't believe posters are overlooking that the OP has endured DV and is likely to still be controlling towards her.

He has 7 consecutive nights including his EOW awarded by the courts, the DC is very young to be away from his primary carer and distressed by it

Parent999 · 14/08/2019 08:01

@randomMess
Nice try, lets assume that the courts arent biased against men and have looked at the evidence with CAFCASS and awarded 7 consecutive days contact based on both parents being capable of caring for that amount of time.
How can anyone one logically say this amount of time is ok but two days extra is suddenly detrimental.

Controlling? who is trying to limit the other parents time? and who is simply looking for a 9 day holiday with their child?

RandomMess · 14/08/2019 08:14

If course let's just ignore the fact courts rarely rule in the best interests of the child 🤷🏽‍♀️

None of us know "the truth" I just think it's sad everyone has assumed the Op is lying that her DC is struggling with contact and the OP and her DC are unaffected by DV.

Parent999 · 14/08/2019 08:29

This thread is about the difference between 7 days or 9 days. Once again, assuming that CAFCASS and the court has seen evidence that both parents are capable and awarded appropriately. What other excuses can be made for the difference between 7 days or 9?

If mothers carry on trying to limit and control the fathers time then the child may well struggle with extended contact. If the parents were able to co-parent effectively then there wouldnt have been the need for a court order to ensure their parenting time in the first place.

GeorgiaGirl52 · 14/08/2019 08:46

This is a 2-year-old child! Even seven consecutive nights away from his mother seems extreme. He will not understand a court order. He will be in a strange place, not on his regular schedule, and will feel abandoned by his mother.
In my area of the USA, non-custodial parents do not get more than one night overnight visit until the child is four. This is for the best interests of the child.

Parent999 · 14/08/2019 09:02

Righto, with that logic all widowers, custodial fathers with small children and homosexual couples should have their children immediately removed and given to a woman. The child wont be in a strange place, wont be with a stranger, wont have a schedule if father isnt "allowed" to form the parenting bond and care for their children in the same way mother is.

Unfortunately it seems to be the desirable effect of custodial parents that the child feel abandoned by the father.

Original poster

JoJo2106 · 14/08/2019 09:37

Can I just say I am not trying to limit contact, I am trying to stick to the court order. If the court meant for him to have longer they could have awarded 10 nights, because he did ask for 14 originally but they said 7. So why not meet in the middle and give 10 nights? It was because they said 7 nights was enough for ds age.

Also for people saying what's the difference between another 2 days. A very good reason is because one week ds stays with his dad from Fri 5pm until Saturday at 1pm. He is perfectly ok when he comes home after this. The second week he stays Fri 5pm until Sunday 6pm. There is a massive difference in how ds is when he comes home after a 2 night contact, and he clings to me and wont let me out of his sight and just seems very different in general compared to just the 1 overnight contact the previous week. So for people who think 1 extra night or 2 extra nights dont make a difference, I can say from my experience at least that it does make a big difference.

We have a court order for a reason and so everyone knows where they stand and it should be stuck to. And again if the court wanted to give longer they could have awarded 10 days. But they did not.

OP posts:

Parent999 · 14/08/2019 09:50

Fair enough OP, youre the parent and you know best. Im just horrendously defensive because my daughter displayed very similar behaviour. Until court she had never been out of my care for more than 24 hours whilst the ex had been away for 7 days on a girly holiday But the court ordered a schedule that means she is out of my care for four days every other week and the ex claimed 7 days was too long?????? wheres the logic in that?
. Absolutely no one, judges, solicitors, CAFCASS or my ex gave two hoots about the effect this had on my daughter. Im just so sick and tired of people assuming my ex was the primary care simply because she is a woman. Even now my daughter is unsettled when she returns from her mothers, takes me 24 hours to settle her down to our routine.

Anyway Im just pissed at the logic of the ex going to Portugal for a week and then saying 7 days was too long away from Mum.

Crazycrazylady · 14/08/2019 09:54

Op
I think if he goes to court on this , he will win. You would possibly come off looking very unreasonable. I understand your reluctance but I wouldn't make this the hill to make your stand on. You'll likely have bigger battles ahead.

Original poster

JoJo2106 · 14/08/2019 10:08

@Parent999 I can understand the frustration in your situation. I am also having the same problem as in it takes me ages to settle ds and get him back into his usual routine of been back home. This I'd after only a 2 night contact, so you can understand why I think the 7 nights the court ordered is enough. I dont know how ds will react or how he'll be once home after so long away, he isn't talking fully yet either so not like he can even say anything

I'm just putting ds first here judging by how he reacts after just 1 extra night contact. He is still so very young and overnight contact only began in March.

@Crazycrazylady we have to attempt mediation if we have any disagreements so that might be what we have to do and I can explain my reasons. Would have to be shuttle mediation we do because of DV, we have no contact whatsoever and handovers are done by my mum.

OP posts:

angell84 · 14/08/2019 12:51

@GeorgiaGirl52 that way of thinking is saying that the mother is more important than the father and she is not! "If he spends time with his father - he will feel abandoned by his mother" - not true at all.

I am a woman and I will say this - the BIG thing that needs to change in society, is women thinking that mother's are more important than father's. It is selfish and damaging and is not true at all

angell84 · 14/08/2019 12:54

@JoJo2106 your child will be fine away from you. He will be with his parent. If you are being really honest - you are thinking that YOU will not be fine being away from him for so long. He is fine, he is safe. What csn you do to keep your time busy to make the time easier for you? Keep yourself busy amd take care of yourself

SlowMoFuckingToes · 14/08/2019 14:27

At some point you're going to have to coparent without the court or it's going to be a very long 16 years. In all honesty DS will probably settle better with the longer stretch and the difference seen between 1 night and 2 won't be the difference between 7 and 9 because he will have had a chance to properly settle. My advice would be to agree to the 9 nights but let your ex know you'll be around if DS becomes upset and you'll happily have him back early. Show a bit of flex and goodwill. I honestly don't think the 7vs9 will make any difference to DS anyway.

Nesssie · 14/08/2019 14:33

Agree with @SlowMoFuckingToes

Pick your battles. Hes not breaking the court order, he gets 7 consecutive nights holiday and his weekend contact.

cupoftea84 · 14/08/2019 19:36

It depends exactly what the order says. If you only have to make him available for 7 consecutive days then surely you can pick which days you make him available?

I'm surprised you're not getting more support OP. Sorry you've been a dv victim and he's still trying to control you. Bigs hugs xx

Original poster

JoJo2106 · 14/08/2019 20:31

@cupoftea84 the order says exactly: In respect of summer 2019 the mother will make the child available to spend a period of 7 consecutive nights with the father. This to not take place prior to September 2019 but before the end of 2019.

Thank you for that, yes he has just sent a very long and nasty reply back tonight in the communication book. Sick of the abuse. He is now contacting a solicitor even though it says if we have any disagreements in relation to child arrangements we are to attempt to solve these issues at mediation.

OP posts:

cupoftea84 · 14/08/2019 20:38

At least it's all recorded in the book. I suggest you take photos of every page as a habit in case he destroys it to get rid of the evidence.

It's horrible. I hope you have support IRL.

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