Self repping in court for residency and specific issue orders

[BeTheChangeYouWantToSee]

Hi

Has anyone had any experience in self repping in court? I can't afford a solicitor and not entitled to legal aid despite DV.

I've just downloaded c100 forms and feeling totally overwhelmed.

Tia x

I have. Its very very daunting at first but not as bad as you think it will be . Post with some more information about your case and what your issues are x

can you afford an hour with a decent solicitor? I did just to get an outline of what I could expect and what I needed to do-it cost about £140.

Hi

Thanks for replying! I could maybe maybe borrow some money for an hour with a solicitor. Do you think it's worth having one look over the court forms before sending them in? The thing I'm most worried about is not having someone reading his reply to court Before i do. Pretty certain he will try twist things and will most certainly lie :-( not feeling entirely strong enough to go through that.

I'm not sure what I should be going for. I know I need a contact order (he refused to tell me when he'd return children last night and was extremely hostile to punish me, eventually got them home and hour past their bedtime and they were overtired and tearful) I have welfare concerns about his parents house where's he's living but that only really takes priority in winter months (no central heating in the house for over 2 years he failed to tell me that last winter and my dcs were ill for 5 months and couldn't shake it off, now I know why! Didn't stop him calling my hv to say I'm neglecting kids and they're always ill because I don't vacuum!!! Obvs not true and hv is outraged by him)

I also need a specific issue order so I can go visit my mom abroad in the country I was born in, he won't let me take them. I did go there earlier this year. On advice from police, hv, Dom abuse support worker and doctor I didn't tell him till we arrived for safety reasons. He called police to accuse me of abduction but they didn't take action due to knowing him as a perpetrator and a bit of a dick!

I'm not entirely sure whether to go for residency. He always contradicts every decision for dcs and its usually only to cause trouble. I'm not wacky in my parenting or choices for dcs bit he always knows better even if its in their best interest. Eg my ds is 3 and he doesn't want him to go to preschool but I do. Was advised to get grommets for dd and he went to dr to put on record his disagreement to me trying to get her referred. He's just a bored, controlling twunt and enjoys making my life miserable and difficult.

Ahhhhhhh

X

I felt abit better knowing I had a solicitor for the first few times. I think in regards to correspondence, it's best to have one. And maybe the first once or twice going to court as it can be very daunting. If cafcass are there you may feel you don't need a solicitor at all.
Ensure your solicitor who attends understands what you want. And make sure you speak to cafcass (if they are there) and go with their advice. Bring up the residency in regards to how they feel. But be prepared if cafcass don't attend.
Now I would go without one.

I'm confused who do the dc currently live with?
You can take the children abroad if it's less than a month without any kind of court order
A prohibitive steps order would be something to stop him or you taking them away
Do you know your section 8 law? you need to know the children's act in relation to your case
Have you done a position statement do you know what his objections are likely to be can you give us a vague outline?
Sorry for lack of punctuation Siri

Dc live with me (he doesn't have then overnight due to not having room/beds for them.) They've had a couple of sleepovers with him to give me a break but he wants to start having them more regularly overnight.if the kids don't have beds at his would a court order this? I don't object to overnights if he arranges suitable sleep solutions which won't happen whilst he resides with his parents.

He quoted children's act 89 to be saying our holiday was abduction as I didn't have his permission and that he won't grant me permission.

I don't know section 8 at all... Ill look it up. Thank you
X

His objections to holidays abroad is that my family and I are too irresponsible and the wildlife is dangerous. Born are absurd reasons!! I'm just aiming to formalise contact so he stops using children as a weapon and returns them on time. He currently has them when I work part time but has said when he gets a job (a huge almighty if!) he only wants them every second weekend I originally offered one day/night a week and every second weekend as I wanted him to have involvement in their education when they get older. To be honest I think he struggles with them so that's why he's reducing times. When he first walked out he was screaming 50-50 so you can already tell how he's not invested in them 100%

You don't need permission from him to take the dc abroad if you have pr and you are the resident parent. It is not abduction. You don't need a contact order either - that is what the non resident parent needs to apply for if contact is not willingly offered.

Offer of overnights was conditional on him having suitable places for them to sleep*

There's only a small section of law that covers family breakdown. Section 8 covers residency, contact and specific issues which are also known as prohibitive steps.

Pm'd you

I have and it was def not as scary as I thought it would be.

Can you take a Mckenzie friend who can go in with you.

Is it that you don't have evidence of the DV?

Have a look at www.rightsofwomen.org.uk

This is a charity with a helpline and lots of guides on their website.

Good luck.

Rights of women were excellent when I rang them! Really reassuring!

Definitely go with a solicitor though if you can afford one.

I have evidence of DV, police reports and health visitor has been documenting everything on our behalf for 2 years now. No legal aid due to working :-( at least one of their parents should work and he will never get a job!

What's a Mackenzie friend? I've heard DV support workers can attend is this true? Would cafcass definitely get involved? That scares me after seeing my friend having a horrific time with them.

Relieved I don't need to contact order, how do I get him to stick to agreed times?

X

Thanks for the link btw

Bethechange - speaking from experience, I would strongly advise you as the resident parent NOT to go to court. Keep things out of court, unless you have compelling reasons and absolutely have to go ie. abduction, or abuse. See the many threads on here about the way women have been overridden by the courts. Sorry to be blunt, but the courts will NOT grant residency on him being an hour late. They will be unlikely to prevent contact due to no heating. So you are wasting your time, and yet they will formalise something that you will then have to abide by.

I did have compelling reasons, yet it was still very much biased towards the father. Read the many appals threads on here and you will see the horror stories other women have had in court.
You will not get residency unless he has abducted the children. I had strong reasons to apply for residency but still they didnt give it.
You said yourself - you are not sure what you are going for, so realistically in that case you will be unlikely to convince a judge! It is not easy.

You really don't need to go to court. Simply send him an email stipulating the time they are to be returned. If he does not return them or answer phone etc call the police.

If you are not happy with the accommodation, put it in an email. Ask him if there is somewhere else he can take them. Would you be able to offer him your place (then you know they'll be back)?

And if you go on holiday simply inform him, by email, that you are taking them to wherever on whenever. If he has PR you do need to inform him.

If he doesn't like these arrangements, let him take you to court. You will have the email evidence that you have been very reasonable and accommodating.

Keep it away from court as long as you can. You really will not do yourself, or your children, any favours if you don't. Be strong, be firm, be assertive and be reasonable. But don't let him bully you! Best of luck.

Despite his general behaviour as you have described as he has PR in the absence of a court order officially you DO have to get his permission to take your children abroad. However, as you said you've done it before. In any case he would be made to look foolish for denying his kids to spend time with their maternal family, unless of course you're going to Damascus.

If you had a residence order you wouldn't need his permission for holidays abroad for up to 28 days.

If he had the wherewithal he could try to apply for a Prohibited Steps Order dependant on your your situations, it would be up to him to prove the potential of abduction.

Interested to know what calling the Police will achieve - what is their intended role? There's no court order, he has PR, he is the father.

I agree with some of Lioness's points. Don't apply to court in the heat of the moment, take a good long time to think about it and find out as much as you can.

Firstly, the courts operate on a no-order principle - which means they don't make orders unless they have to. The DC's live with you currently and ex does not dispute this, so you would have to have a reason for an order; eg threatened abduction. You could argue that an RO would allow you to go on holiday without having to ask for permission (and being threatened/harassed) but as you've already been, it would be hard to convince a judge of the need.

Secondly, if you object to overnights on the grounds that in your opinion the sleeping arrangements provided aren't suitable, you'll have to explain why they are sometimes. People say that courts are biased towards fathers but I haven't found that - but then again they aren't in the business of 'judging' who is the 'better' parent or whose views on childcare are the 'correct' ones, (unless, obvs, in cases or abuse & harm). My GP's didn't have central heating - my DB and I spent many happy weekends at their house when we were kids. I'm not sure the courts would see this as a valid reason to refuse overnights.

And finally - is it really a great idea to be reliant on him for childcare when you work?

Thank you for the excellent advice on here.

I won't pursue the court route and will just let him know via email when things adversely effect the children. Think the terror of them not coming home when I was expecting them made me react!

When DC stay its in his bed and he sleeps on the floor beside them. Not exactly terrible but DCs are terrible sleepers and when they come back it results in a 3 day battle to get them to self settle in their beds (we co slept for 2.5 years so it was a long slog to sleep train without doing controlled crying) incidentally after Thursdays drama I've had an absolute nightmare getting them down and they've been quite emotional about going to bed.

Maybe being in the thick of it with minimal support around me I get lost in it.

I do feel desperately sad for the mothers who have to go through the family courts. It's a terrible place to be a woman and finding it hard to understand how things got so ridiculous in family law. Oh that's right a few Pollocks stood on a building in superhero costumes. Don't get me wrong i firmly believe and live our lives by fully including ex in DCs lives, would never stop contact and rarely agree with reasons why a parent does (obvs not abuse/substance misuse reasons)

Sorry rambling now, it's been a horrible weekend and had patronising texts from him about what I should be capable of doing (where does he get off!) just feeling meh about it all but haven't got it as bad as other families so really shouldn't complain.

Thank you all for your time

It gets better, honest! Here this helps.

And family court is a pretty terrible place to be a man, too.

Hamwidge,

If she has no residence order and he does have PR then yes she does need his consent.

The only exceptions for not needing the other parents consent to take a child out of the uk for up to a month are...

If he does not have PR
Or if the resident parent has a residency order.

However if he refuses and you go to court the courts will rarely refuse providing no risk of abduction exists. Its actually bloody hard to get courts to refuse either parent such a request even when very legit reasons to prevent the holiday exist.

My Ex was very controlling and wanted to see my son only to control me ..no real interest in him...

As residential parent you are required to offer Access...You can offer this and state what time your children need to be returned...not for him to dictate...

I also recommend you don't let him know how much he had upset you as this only giving this information will only lead to more late arrivals...

I also stopped trying to have conversations with Ex..found he lost interst once he realise I wasn't interested in his lies and crap anymore

I've tried the minimal contact thing. It just results in grand displays of control and drama which is nigh impossible to ignore as DCs are used to hammer his point home. It's just so frustrating.

Socks- so do I need to get a specific issue order then? If I just go in for one if those will I find it hard/courts make life difficult? I really need to move on this as we want to go out for Christmas. He's stopped us travelling for Christmas for the last 2 years and I just can't bear to spend Christmas Day alone with the dcs again though last Christmas was hilarious with the meat not arriving so roasted tofu instead ( he had them in the afternoon last Christmas so I'm not attempting to stop holiday contact. He also sees kids on their birthdays (as hard as that is for me you to suck it up for the DCs)

Or do I email him, tell him of plans and if he wishes to stop us to go to court for a prohibitive steps order? That way it's him taking me to court? Because we travelled earlier this year with no repercussions I know I can go safely 'without express consent' and that police are not going to enforce anything without a court order.

I can almost certainly guess if I try go and he had knowledge of it he will stop kids coming home to me and prevent travel that way (one of the many reasons professionals advised us not to tell him of plans earlier this year) so Id feel safer knowing there was an order in place but after all the warnings of not going court route I just don't know what to do. He's also violent with me if I piss him off, when we got back from holiday he assaulted my brother in the street whilst trying to approach me and DCs he frightens me and I do worry a lot about what's coming round the corner.

No chance of me abducting children. I lead a happy simple life here (bar ex) and if I did move it would most certainly follow the correct procedures as I couldn't live with myself if I didn't.

Go easy on them if they unsettled. If they want to co sleep then do it. If it makes them feel more secure.

Coming back an hour late isn't grounds for an order.... And a court order won't make him be on time !!

As you have no problems with him taking care of them despite dv towards you then I don't see much grounds for applying for residence order.

The heating or lack of isn't necessarily a big issue (do they have any heating at all ? Eg fires ? Electirc heaters ? ) unless the house is full of mould etc and deemed an environmental hazard...

Relying On him for child care while you work mighty not be good thing, better get childminder for those days so you not dependent on him.

If he objects to you going abroad then either him or you could apply for specific issue order for that particular issue I think. Ask a solicitor

Tho readin your last post how much do you really trust him with your dc ? I would not want mine around someone that violent , except supervised...