Would it worry you if your partner didn't see his other kids?

[jenrose29]

When I met my partner almost 3 years ago, he had two kids aged 1 and 2 and my daughter was 2 years old. He had been seperated for a few months, as had I. He had his children over 50% of the time and my daughter and his kids got on great and we were all very happy. After a year of this, his ex wife stopped contact altogether (she met someone else who she was trying to introduce as daddy.) We could see that this was going to happen a mile off and I regularly urged him to get a contact order while he was having so much contact so that it would continue. He left it...and left it...and had no contact whatsoever for 6 months, when his ex needed a baby sitter. Once it resumed, contact was once per 3/4/5/6 weeks as and when she deemed to allow it. Again, I suggested he seek a contact order so that he could have reliable contact (she would often cancel with no notice/he would arrive to collect the children and they wouldn't be home/she moved house without telling him etc etc) but he didn't. Since Christmas he has seen them twice and the last time was over two months ago. He has said that he will seek a contact order. However, he already has a defeatist attitude that she will not turn up at court etc. She may well not, but I know that if I hadn't seen my kids for over two months I'd be willing to try anything - much less would I have left it so long to sort out altogether.

We are due to have our first baby together in a few weeks and his lack of action with regard to his previous children - when he has my full support and encouragement in seeing them - leaves me worried. As it is we are having to continue to live seperately as his lack of action sorting out his divorce, debts and children mean he cannot afford to support DD, baby and I (he promised to sort divorce and hadn't so many debts when I fell pregnant) and the longer he leaves things, the longer the living apart situation is going to continue. He keeps feeling sorry for himself and asking me if he is a bad dad for not seeing his kids, and as much as his wife is a b*tch and hasn't made things easy, I do think he hasn't made nearly enough effort to sort it and is continuing to not make enough effort so that he can live with and be involved with our baby. What do you think?

Additionally it is not cheaper to maintain two houses between you. So if he has debts and is serious about your future he needs to clear the way to join forces and be together fully - then you only have one house to run not two which is a waste of money.

Instead of decorating the extra nursery at his house for the new baby he expects to visit at great hassle and frustration for you, he should be ironing out all these bloody massive wrinkles he has got in his life!!

Ginpalace Agreed that even if he'd dragged his feet before, that the moment I said I was pregnant and he had the prospect of being 100% involved in his childs life that he should have been straight into action sorting his stuff out to make sure that was the case. He has finally instructed a solicitor, sent a couple of letters...not what I'd class as major action. Particularly as he only did this a few weeks ago when I spelled out for him that DD, baby and I would not be moving in and how much he is going to miss out on. It is frustrating that he needs to be directed in which actions to take when they seem so clear from the outside. He spends his time thinking how great things could be - but unless he acts, they won't ever be that way. I am starting to feel like his bloody life coach and just wish he'd take some initiative.

PigletUnrepentant No I would never give up. I know technically being a father is slightly different but he had them for over 50% of the time...to allow that to slip is unthinkable in my mind. Like I said above, he keeps looking to the future, believing that one day his kids will choose to come and live with us, that we will have more babies after this one and all live happily ever after - but how will that ever happen if he continues as he is? I've been incredibly patient - no doubt many of you are thinking a complete mug :) - and yes, I do see that our future could be fantastic. But the point is, our present isn't. And it isn't going to improve unless he makes it.

I know, tell me about it! The nursery thing is ridiculous. He is living in a dream world.

Hard to see how the future can be fantastic if it is all daydreams and one half of the team is not up to making that fantastic future happen.

At some point it has to stop been a nice idea and the grit and grind of the plan has to be mobilised. Not sure he's the chap to do it from what you have said here.

I really hope you don't just end up spending a lot of time in the vision and waiting stage only to finally discover that's all it's ever going to be.

Myabe he'll pull his socks up at some point. Maybe he will get through it with you standing over him all the way. Either way it sounds like a tedious road ahead. Hope you have some good support.

Do you think this is what his character is like or is this out of character and he is depressed or something? Or not sure?

Jenrose, one of the beauties about British family law is that if your ex wants a divorce, you are not allowed to say "no". Nobody is forced by law to continue to be married against their will in this country.

Your ex could have asked for an amicable divorce after being separated from his wife for 2 years, but he could have done it quicker if: there was unreasonable behaviour from either or both parts, or... if either partner was already in another relationship, as it is the case with you.

It is simple, he applies for the divorce decree nissi and 3 months and one day later, he applies for a decree absolute. And that's the end of the marriage. Arrangements for the care of children and separation of assets can be dealt with separately at a later or earlier date.

Yes I understand he may want to avoid getting into further trouble with the ex wife about the children by applying for the divorce, but he doesn't see the children anyway so what's stopping him? As for the separation of assets (and debts), the sooner you are divorced the sooner you are released from any responsibility if the other person gets in debt. Having said that... the court would be happy to make the exwife responsible for the debt if it was incurred such a long time after the split, however, it may feel sympathetic towards her if the debt was incurred to cover basic expenses to provide for the children in absence of adequate child maintenance.

I really want to say 'arrggghhhh run for the hills!' but seems cruel in your situation to be so blunt when it's a bit late for that.

However, it would be my honest reaction and I only say it in the hope that it reinforces for you that your concern is not misguided, maybe you can enlighten him by getting very very blunt yourself and maybe rope in some extra support to shore up this situation.

Can only imagine a carrot and stick approach is needed with this guy, nice encouragement isn't going to give him the gumption he's lacking. :(

So, he's dragged his heels getting a contact order in place, sorting out the debt, and implementing the divorce. Sorry but he's spineless and irresponsible. I would be preparing to be a long term single parent if I were you.

No, I didn't trap him. The baby was planned pre-debts, when he was seeing kids and about to have a simple divorce. Or so we thought.

The problem is the longer he takes to do anything the more it's making me resent him which is only going to cause problems in the future anyway. I'm dreading the prospect of explaining to people that he and I don't live together. Not sure if I'm in the right or wrong but I don't stand over him or tell him what to do - if he asks for advice, I give it. If he needs support, I give it. However, I believe that his decisions need to be his own and that I shouldn't have to tell him how to run his life. I have no family support and moved to a different area to live near him so don't have any friends either. To be honest, I don't feel I can make friends as it means explaining the whole ridiculous situation to them. It is definitely what his character is like, he avoids confrontation at all costs. He isn't depressed, he just spends his time wishing things were simple. I'm more of a realist and believe in making your own fate rather than letting others determine it for you. Couldn't be more opposite in that way, really!

He is waiting for a copy of the marriage certificate to apply for the divorce as they got married abroad and neither of them have a copy.

Ginpalace I have spoken to his parents before about how much of an idiot he was allowing his wife to treat him as and they agreed and are paying for the divorce to try and encourage him to sort it. However, they take a softly softly approach with him and pity him that he isn't seeing the kids rather than telling him to sort it out.

He is a bit of a dreamer - wishes things were plain and simple... but they aren't.

He isn't a realist. OK - can't hang him for that.

But he is in a pickle and still being a dreamer - not ideal. At all.

His nearest and dearest are either being gentle-softly or I'm-sure-you'll-shoulder-the-responsibility-in-your-own-way-and-just-need-a-good-person-to-stand-shoulder-to-shoulder-with-you. Hardly going to get the dreamer moving though is it - no wonder his ex was able to abuse his trust - he accepts things lying down. Life happens to him, but you have a more central locus of control and think you can shape life and life is what you make it. Oh dear.

Add to that, you find the whole thing so unpalatable / embarrassing that it is preventing you from branching out and getting a network of other support around you and making the best of your new life. I notice you moved to be near him - bet you'd have been waiting a while for it to happen the other way round. :(

However while I think guiding/advising him if he asks is fine if you are dealing with someone like yourself, so you aren't wrong for not supervising/breathing down his neck in that sense.

The fact is that you are not dealing with a practical realist, at all. So unless you are prepared to push him along, you can only sit back and wait. It is hard to see how that isn't going to put great strain on you, especially when you will be a new mum again soon.

You already don't like what is going on, it goes against the grain to drift and even the best relationship can get squeezed by resentment. So unless you want to donate to him some of your get up and go, or can stomach a good deal more of the drift and dream approach, this isn't going to get any easier.

No, to try for a baby was a joint decision. She took out loans during the marriage which he also signed for. She is paying off £1 per month...

It's just he ended up in the situation he is in now by being pushed along by his wife - pushed into debts, pushed into being downtrodden and walked all over. I don't want to be like her and tell him how to live his life. There has to be a point where he (for want of a better phrase) grows a pair and sorts his own stuff out.

It is well known by recruiters far and wide that the best indication of future performance is past performance.

I think this is true of life generally not just the work environment. Which is why when someone lies, trust is lost and it is so hard to get back - once you have behaved a certain way it is pretty sure you can/will do that again.

If you think he is going to change now you are possibly kidding yourself.

Some people are just never going to be a leader. Some people will always be a sheep.

This guy may well be far more at home in the being told what to do role. Maybe he doesn't want to have take the bull by the horns, or face up to hard facts, or grasp the nettle (insert metaphor of choice here) That is not him. In terms of his character he might be far more at home with someone else wearing the trousers and taking the lead. OK so you would prefer him to be a man and grow a pair - but maybe he is just a drifter figuratively speaking and incapable of getting on with it. Or at any sensible pace that has any practical or useful meaning.

Whilst it is admirable that you are not going to treat him like a doormat as his ex did, and give him room to grow up. It doesn't account for the fact that is totally against his character! He is what he is. He ain't going to be a person who moves mountains. That ain't him.

I agree with latemates - he may fear making things worse for the DC's (or you) by confronting his ex - although if that was the case, I would expect him to know a lot more about the system - it won't all go away if his ex doesn't show up at court, for instance.

But, for me this has always been a deal breaker. DP is currently estranged from his DD, and if I thought for one moment that he had given up on her, then I would lose respect for him and our relationship would be over.

I accept that he and I may not always agree on how he approaches the issue, but defeatism/playing the victim is very different and something I cannot bear

Sweetie, I think you are a bit better than this, you're obviously a strong woman and you deserve to be treated well. I'm not suggesting you leave him although alarm bells are ringing but he does sound as though he needs to be pulled into action. Please sweetheart, no more excuses for him, he needs to step up and do his bit which means providing a home for all his children. Fast.

Time for some tough talking about what what you want and need. You are owed it.

I think you should take action to the extent you can. You sound backed into a corner by his fecklessness - you moved away from your support base, you are hanging around waiting to for him to provide a family home, etc.

Where are you living? You should be living in a place you want to call home with your DC, and if he can join the party later, great. The plan seems to be that you will move into his place eventually, when (if) he sorts his shit out? That's totally backwards.

Make yourself a home with your children. He should be contributing to that (he will soon be legally required to do so). Possibly this will mean he needs to move into a smaller place, in order to provide your new family with a proper home. (Supporting two families, neither of which he lives with, is an expensive business.)

As to his other two children, yes, it's a big waving red flag that he's just allowed them to be taken away without a fight. There's nothing you can do about this at all, except be aware of it. You have been supportive of his children in the past, and let it be known you will be again. But that's his problem to sort out and not yours.

Maybe it will someday becomes your DC he's too feckless to see. But right now all you can do is provide the best home you can for your children, with or without him.

Yes, it would worry me I'm afraid .

A very good friend of mine is in a similar situation - apart from she does live with her DP & their children together - but the issues/patterns for contact with his previous child have been pretty much the same. It always seems to be my friend pushing her DP to get regular contact sorted out & asking when he'll next be visiting - rather than the child's actual father making any effort.

In their case 50/50 care has dwindled to one evening a fortnight between 4.30 and 7.00pm (the child's bedtime).

Hmmm it would worry me. I had those kind of doubts about my now Ex. He has now left me in a lot of debt, trying to get himself removed from mortgage knowing I can't get a mortgage in my own name right now and just picks and chooses when he sees DS. Be very wary and prepared for him to treat you in the same way. My ex did.

OP - he sounds like an organisational disaster in every shape and form. I doubt his exW is a bitch - I expect she thinks he is completely unreliable. And she's right.

In all my years as a laywer I could never understand the apathy by so many parnets towards seeing and supporting their DC.

I know in my very core that I would do whatever I needed to in order to remain in my DC's lives.

NotaDisneyMum At the moment he isn't seeing the children at all and they are being told it's because he is choosing not to. I don't see how it can get much worse than that...? In my opinion, to sort it while the kids are still young is SO important. It is no good leaving it and expecting them to feel sorry for him when they are older and leave their mum and come and live with us - that's completely unrealistic.

TheSecondComing He knows what I want and need but seems to think I'll wait forever. He keeps worrying that he'll 'lose this baby too' and blames everything on his wife but the only person that'll cause him to lose me/DD/the baby is him.

quiplite I live in a rented house, he cannot move in here as he needs to live closer to work. He has a 3 bedroomed house via work on the basis that he has a family...! I was very supportive of him and his children but (and please tell me if this is wrong) I'm not prepared to forever put up with crap because of it all. The way I see it, if he'd listened to everyone and got a contact order when he was having them over 50% of the time (he may even have got residency as his wife is a disaster) then we would all be a happy settled family. His children were nasty and horrible to my daughter, they flitted in and out of her life (because of him allowing his ex to dictate contact) and she now hasn't seen them since Christmas. He allows them to have different rules when we do have them because he never knows when he'll see them again etc. They tell him that Mummy says this and that about him, my daughter and I and he does nothing to refute anything. His lack of action is just going to cause more and more upset if something concrete isn't set up. I'm not prepared to allow my baby and daughter to think of them as their brother and sister and get close only for DP to allow them to be taken away again. It isn't fair on the kids and DD is very perceptive and asks why he doesn't do more to see them. He is going to end up getting the blame all round.

Bonsoir She is definitely a bitch - for so many more reasons than I can list! But I do see her point about wanting more regular contact for her kids.

Jen, reading your last post you sound really angry and I would be too! Yes his ex is horrible but the situation he is in is his fault. He could have got a divorce and a contact order but I think he didn't for two reasons : a) he can't be arsed, no one who actually wanted to see their kids would handle it like this; and, b) he likes being the victim - this "woe is me" routine has everyone running round after him and pitying him. If he did anything he wouldn't get that treatment anymore.

You sound really strong and sorted so why not decide what you want and lay it out for him with a time frame?

Life with this man will be one long make-over project with no happy ending where Gok shows nudey photos to his ma and his boss.