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Lone parents

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Original poster

How many nights can a partner stay over if you are on benefits? I'm worried my friend is going to get into trouble.

73 replies

LucyLouLou · 12/08/2010 15:31

I'm not asking for me, I don't have a partner and I'm not on benefits (pregnant, so things might change a bit when I've had my DD, but that's neither here nor there lol).

Let me preface this by saying that I have absolutely no intention of reporting my friend for benefit fraud here, so this is not a fishing expedition for that purpose. However, I am a little bit worried that she is accidentally committing fraud because she is not aware (as such) of the rules surrounding her partner staying in the house.

She has a baby DS with her DP. They have been sort of on and off a bit since during the pregnancy (DS is now 10m old) and he has never officially lived with her and DS AFAIK. Lately though, DP has been staying with my friend most nights of the week. None of his mail is registered at the address and if you looked him up on the electoral register (if he's on it) you would find him living at his mum's house. To an outside observer though, you would think he was living with my friend.

The problem is, she does not work (does intend to get a job though, two days a week so she can still claim benefits) so she claims housing benefit, council tax benefit and the like, and does this as a single person. I haven't said as much to her, but I think she's in danger of getting caught out with her DP being there as much as he is. She thinks that because he is still registered as living at his parent's house, she isn't breaking the rules. I think she's wrong, but I don't know enough about the laws to tell her this definitively. I think I heard somewhere that she was allowed to have him stay over 3 nights a week, but I'm not sure how current or correct this might be.

I'm worried if she is in the wrong and was to get caught, she would have no way of defending herself. He is the father of the child, his name is on the birth certificate, and while I don't know what tactics investigators use to find out whether people are living the way they say they are, I'm pretty sure him leaving for work daily from her house would incriminate her.

Please someone tell me the rules. Like I said, I don't want to report her, but I do want to be able to tell her she's creating trouble for herself. I really get the impression she doesn't know she's making a mistake.

Thanks for any help and sorry for how long this is :)!

OP posts:

toccatanfudge · 16/08/2010 09:15

you know the funny thing is - that obviously you do have to inform the council for council tax purposes and the like but if you're a single women with no kids and meet a man - and things develop and he starts staying over occasionally no-one would bat an eyelid.

How come single parents are lambasted for trying to walk the fine line that is staying single for ever, and being classed as "in a couple". It's bloody hard.

I've got a new boyfriend. I think it may have long term potential. But it's still very early days. Yes he's stayed over, but there is absolutely no way I would consider officially living together yet - I have to think of my children (who have met him and like him) who have already seen their parents separate.

Of course I could never have him over to stay........but then how do you develop a relationship (long term) with someone that you've never even spent a night with?

Of course if I could ditch the kids and just be a childless single women it would be easy and no-one would care if my BF stayed over......

MrsMorgan · 16/08/2010 10:23

Totally agree Tocc, it is like they are saying that we are not allowed a life at all.

I was also told that I could only have someone stay over if I notified them first. How utterly ridiculous is that.

I did infact have someone stay over last week, but it isn't and won't be a relationship so why on earth should I tell anyone, let alone the benefits offices.

Why should we not be allowed the right to a private life.

mamatomany · 16/08/2010 19:45

"How come single parents are lambasted for trying to walk the fine line that is staying single for ever, and being classed as "in a couple". It's bloody hard."

Because you are asking others to support you, whatever the reasons behind that when you are financially beholden to anyone you are in a precarious position.

GypsyMoth · 16/08/2010 19:50

er,no,mama.....you're quite wrong there.....some of us DO work!!!

its a myth that single parents are all on benefits
its a myth that all single parents dont work

and personally i'd firstly prefer to support myself and my family....failing that i would prefer the state to,rather than gain a useless DH and end up posting about said inadequate DH on the mumsnet relationships board!!! just to get off benefits??? no thanks....

MollieO · 16/08/2010 19:54

I don't think anyone lambasts single parents for dating. It is all about being honest. If you have someone who spends several nights a week with you and whose car you are insured to drive I would think that is a serious and committed relationship. Why should someone in that position claim benefits as a 'single' person when clearly they aren't.

The alternative of course is not to claim benefits and then you are answerable to no one and can do what you like.

ValiumSingleton · 16/08/2010 19:56

I think a lot depends on whether the man is the father of one or any of the mother's children.

I have not had any romance since I left children's father, but is that really fair? tbh, I don't want that, it would complicate my life and I don't want to risk jeopardising my benefits and I certainly don't want to commit fraud for some 'randomer'. so not a problem for me, but I know that for some other people dating and romance and sex is like oxygen. I must be made of tougher stuff.

MollieO · 16/08/2010 19:57

I don't understand why the alternative to benefits is a dh. It is possible to be a single parent and not claim benefits (other than child benefit which every parent gets).

ValiumSingleton · 16/08/2010 19:58

Obviously that's just my opinion and not the legal situation! I just think that it's unrealistic to expect some guy who isn't your children's father to help you out with all the expenses. Maybe in wealthier middle-class circles where men with good salaries can afford that quite easily it is not such a big expectation, but further down the food chain, I think it is unrealistic to expect some guy whose wages aren't high to chip in for the kids of a woman he is dating.

MollieO · 16/08/2010 20:00

Valium - same here. Nothing to do with benefits (ex doesn't support either) but everything to do with not having the childcare support to be able to go out and meet anyone (even if I was ready, which 6.5 years on I don't think I am).

mamatomany · 16/08/2010 20:01

ILoveTIFFANY - so then we aren't actually talking about you or your situation at all are we ?

omnishambles · 16/08/2010 20:07

But MollieO if you are working and getting tax credits for that and housing benefit then it really matters if you are classed as single or not - and as others have said its the transitional stage thats hard.

EG I was a single parent in a 1 bed flat with ds - I started seeing someone - he was paying his own rent/council tax and all his stuff was at his house a long way away but he would be over a few times a week comtributing nothing to the household - should I immeditaly phone up and declare it, lose all my benefits and not be able to pay my rent and then what would happen if I split up with him? It would take ages to get all the benefits sorted out again and by then I would be in debt.

What actually happened is that we committed to eachother, moved into a house and stopped claiming everything obviously.

GypsyMoth · 16/08/2010 21:35

was once mama....life canges tho...and obviously if a LONE parent loses a job,then the other parent isnt thewre to fall back on....the benefit system is.....tackle the feckless fathers not the mothers! (occasionally its vice versa too)

MollieO · 16/08/2010 21:47

omni obviously there needs to be some transitional stage. I completely get that. However when the transitional stage continues several for years and a high degree of commitment is made that is the time I'd seriously query if the single parent was really a single parent and entitled to benefits.

toccatanfudge · 18/08/2010 10:09

mama - you missed my point entirely I'm afraid.

Single people on benefits who start seeing someone don't get the same level of distrust pointed towards then as a single parent on benefits who starts seeing someone.

since when did shagging someone a couple of times a week become a "serious and commited relationship"???

And to whoever said they're made of "tougher stuff" because they wanted to remain single - get a grip. I was perfectly happy single - could have carried on indefinitely like it - not an issue in the slightest if I'd remained single for the rest of my life.

However, I'm "only" 31 - and I still want to have some fun and see if I could ever do the whole relationship thing again.

I don't "need" a relationship - but I do want one and am rather enjoying having a boyfriend right now - doesn't make me soft

mamatomany · 18/08/2010 19:18

since when did shagging someone a couple of times a week become a "serious and commited relationship"???

Well that only you can decide but if it's for a year then yes it is a relationship, you can't have your cake and eat it.
And yes a single person who isn't a parent would be treated as a couple with certain situations such as being insured on each others cars, but then since a single person on benefits couldn't afford to run a car I doubt it comes up very often.

toccatanfudge · 18/08/2010 20:01

I have friends who are insured on each others cars........I can assure you that there's no "relationship" between them other than very good friends.

Problem is with the couple/single thing - you don't get a year - 1 week of having a BF over for a shag to stay a couple of night and you can have benefits down your neck accusing you of fraud!

And you're STILL missing my point entirely anyhow - how many times do you hear people saying "ooo you know that lass down the road that's on JSA right now - well she's just met a new bloke and he's staying over really regularly - perhaps I ought to report her for fraud" - it just doesn't happen.

No-one ever gives a toss unless the poor "feckless" woman happens to have children in tow as well.

mamatomany · 18/08/2010 20:17

I think you're being a bit paraniod, people do look down on anyone screwing the system, probably more so if they haven't got kids as there's no justification at all.
In your shoes I guess I'd alternate your bonking between his place and yours and twice a week is enough for anyone young lady !

toccatanfudge · 18/08/2010 20:19

hahaha - I'm not worried about me per se - if it ever crossed the line (whatever that line is ) where it was a relationship then I'd tell 'em and all that.

bonking at his is a little harder though as my ex is a twat who rarely has the kids - and still not overnight yet........

twice a week enough - you're mean

BarmyArmy · 20/08/2010 16:09

It's just so wrong that the State is paying people to live apart - to make it harder for couples to live together as a couple.

This is the counter-argument to those that object to the Tories' plan to re-introduce some form of married tax allowance - and claim that the State shouldn't be supporting one kind of relationship over any other.

Well, it already does indicate its approval, by paying people more to live apart and for children to therefore be brought up in one-parent households.

Lunacy, sheer lunacy.

toccatanfudge · 20/08/2010 21:05

Barmy - I rarely agree with you - I think you are rather Barmy - but I do agree there is definitely a disincentive for couples (that are in a stable enough relationship to live together, and who want to live together) to make that step.

I'm not sure there are many couples who are both biological parents of the children involved who are living apart because of the financial aspect. I think most such couples living apart are not ones where both parents are the biologicail parents of the children involved.

Hails123 · 25/05/2015 15:48

Hi can anyone help, my partner lives away in the army pays to live on camp he comes be some weekends to see us I claim as a single parent I work and I pay all the bills, he gives me some money to with the kids am I commenting benefit fraud here??

Jordycairns38 · 12/05/2017 15:45

Surely people who work for the government. Have friends relatives who stay over for a holiday etc. They don't go by the book.

Akire · 12/05/2017 15:50

Zombie threaD

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