Council vs Private Rent Unfair

[UnfairSociety]

Hello

I have a few friends I met in London living in a council/housing association in zone 1/2 and paying lower than the market rate. They had the apartment many years ago but now earning way above average workers' salaries, yet the rent doesn't increase at a similar rate to the private sector.

For example, there is one bedroom apartment that only pays £600 a month. Another 2-bed rooms apartment only pays roughly £700 a month. Do taxpayers have to subsidise the remaining cost of their rent? One of the couples earns a combined salary of £90k per annum and pays this much rent? Note quality of the apartments is pretty good. I hear you they would put the home as a single tenant to earn extra income from their partner and also pay council tax at a 25% discount.

I feel sorry for those in the private sector living in s*tty quality homes and dealing with rogue landlords. Housing crises are a mess in London, and those rich council tenants should pay in line with the private sector or move elsewhere to allow those in need to live there.

Also, they get a massive discount if they buy their council house.

DH works for a HA, I've worked in SH in the past and I can categorically tell you that it's not subsidised with public money. And SH rents here are pretty much the same as private ones.

Also re under occupancy - the last attempt to do something about that has caused even more hardship. Are you suggesting that the bedroom tax be extended to pensioners who have worked all their lives and paid hundreds of thousands of pounds in rent, thus paying massive sums into the housing pot over their lifetime? Are you aware of the misery the BT has caused already?

Once more, for the people at the back.

SH isn't only for those 'in need'. Those in need are a higher priority. If there's a SH shortage where you are (and there's not everywhere), campaign for more SH to be built, not to turf people out of their homes.

(Also if a threshold is set people will simply make sure they don't earn more than it - why would you work hard to get a pay rise which takes you just over the threshold if it means you'll lose your home?)

counc housing and housing associations are subsidized because they get large block grants from central government (and have done in the past to build housing stock). Even now, when social housing building is pitiful, central government is still providing billions in the housing budget. Also social housing organizations benefit from housing provided free or at low cost from developers as part of planning conditions.

I’m not saying that’s wrong- it’s not. That’s why it’s social housing. But it’s wrong to say it’s not subsidized- it is subsidized directly by central government and local government (not by any opportunity cost nonsense).

I just have one question, how I can get into the council house?

2 bed flat in zone1-2 just £700???? !!
five years ago, £700 can rent a shared room in zone 2 east London.
why! 90K income still can entitle?
why! why do other taxpayers pay the bill for them ???
oh, not only one question now.

There’s a social housing shortage pretty much everywhere in the uK. The cost of building housing in the present day is huge and so I think better allocation has to be part of the answer to the housing crisis.

@happyfishcoco as explained a hundred times taxpayers do not pay for this at all
You have to put your name on a council waiting list

You would be extremely unlikely to get social housing in London without being in extreme need or a very long wait. Income isn’t part of the application process though.

the issue is that people who currently live in social housing may have lifelong tenancies and so qualified years ago when they were not high earners.

@MsPincher they don't get them free from builders in large sites at all
Payments from goverment to build are few and far between now as well
Social housing offer good permanent houses and we should be campaigning for more government/ tax payers money to be spent helping them build it benefit all of us
Maybe houses wouldn't of gone so sky high if more affordable rent around as landlords wouldn't of been able to snap up out of first time buyers reach
Regulation should be more on private landlords and social housing encouraged, no one gets rich from social housing and they put money back into communities

@VampiresWife I know how people quote things that are untrue , like a developer just hands over 10 houses to a housing association free of charge, yes right

From the National Housing Federation.

In 2010, funding for affordable housing was reduced by 60% as part of the drive to cut the deficit. Funding for new social rented housing stopped completely and an affordable rent tenure was introduced, where homes are rented at up to 80% of market rent. The government shifted its focus to supporting first time buyers, with investment in shared ownership homes and schemes like Help to Buy.

So not funded.

There isn't a shortage where I am. Possibly because the council is building SH at a record rate, and we have lots of HAs here doing the same.

It can be done. But as usual, it's easier (for the government and many LAs) for the idea to pervade that someone somewhere is getting an easier ride than you, and to resent them for it.

@pocketvenuss why should people move though, you misunderstand what social housing and councik housing was built for , a home for life
I live in a ha house we earn better money now but I can't afford to buy and get a deposit for house and mortgage as we are too old
Would only get a 15 year mortgage
Private rent is really hard to get and much of it substandard with no security so would be crazy to give up my HA house and be worse off , what incentive is that to go and work hard all week I may as well drop to part time if I was forced out
Been in house for 20 years I have paid loads of rent in that time , decorated , carpeted done thousands of work to the garden incl fencing as HA do not always do everything
Why an I not deserving anymore because we have worked hard to better ourselves
Can you imagine if HA was only full of one type of people , I mean it has a bad enough stigma as it is as people misunderstand why council/ social housing was started in the first place
A home for life

sorry but that’s not true. I used to work in government finance and there is a yearly housing budget much of which goes to councils and housing associations to build and maintain their stock. Eg see

www.gov.uk/government/news/86-billion-for-affordable-homes-to-give-boost-onto-housing-ladder

also as I said above councils and housing associations get free and low cost properties from planning conditions when private developments are taking place.

it is true that social rents are sometimes not less or not much less than private rents (although generally they are less). There are a number of factors which probably cause this but one reason is thought to be that many social housing providers are not particularly good at getting value for money. They tend to have staff who are much better paid than the private sector equivalent. Often they are very inefficient in renovation and maintenance programs. There is evidence of corruption and favouritism in many social housing providers.

Central government found that on average they spent twice as much building the same size house as the private sector. So increasingly funds are diverted elsewhere as there is better value for money (of course there are ideological reasons for this as well).

I've genuinely never read so much twaddle in my life.

There’s no housing list where you are? I very much doubt that.

I suggest you go look it up. Facts don’t change because you don’t like them.

No. Here you bid on properties. I'm fairly sure that's the same in most places now. Housing lists haven't been a thing for years.

No, that comment was absolute tosh. I don't need to look it up - as I said, I used to work in SH and DH still does. I showed him that comment and he actually laughed. Also at your housing list comment. 'Misinformed' was the word be used.

As I pointed out above the reasons payments from central government to build are less then they used to be is because it has been determined that social housing providers are not good at building housing to a budget.

Don’t you have to be on the list to bid though? And have a priority band?

Lol - housing lists (or priority bands whatever you want to call them) are still widely used across the country together with bidding and some housing associations do have old fashioned lists. Housing is funded by central government and has been in the past probably for at least 100 years.

the fact that you work for a housing association kind of proves my point above. Also your dh should post his own opinions if he wants- it doesn’t add weight to an opinion because it’s a man saying it.

@MsPincher i don't think you actually now what you are talking about TBH
Another poster bas posted about the budgets since 2010 yet thats not good enough for you
Social housing association if which there are many will all be slightly different and I live in a relatively new SH and its better quality that my friends who just bought another new build
If your so sure then please post the payments made by goverment over the last 10 years for actually building houses

I also have a friend and another couple friend in similar situation. They live in very central council housing in Central London. My single friend earn much more than the average and has bought the ppty. She was also looking to buy elsewhere during the pandemic. The couple friend haven't bought theirs but have bought two properties outside the country and helped their 3 children buy in zone 2.

@MsPincher its not described as a housing list now
Its all a bidding process no one really describes it as a housiing list anymore

@MsPincher you posted

I used to work in government finance and there is a yearly housing budget much of which goes to councils and housing associations to build and maintain their stock

Am I right in assuming that you don't work in Government finance anymore? If not then how could you possibly know how that finance is allocated now? What you have said may have been true during your time there but things change.