Thinking of moving to France. But I know nothing about it - help

[Flighttattendant]

Hello,

this is a sudden thing that came upon me the other day when ds1 started asking about living elsewhere. He mentioned America, then France.

I suddenly thought 'why not?'

I've only been a few times but am very fond of the place. I have A level French, am a fairly good linguist though obv would need to get back into it.

I'm thinking pragmatically...when is the best time to uproot the kids? Ds1 likes his school, he is just 7. Ds2 hasn't started anything yet and is just 3...he begins preschool in sept.

I am looking to go back to work, not sure what as, but something. But currently we have help from the state.

I am worried about 3 things. 1, how easy is it to live there if you don't have the capital to buy a house? 2, is it possible to work part time, is there any kind of subsidy available for a single parent? and 3, what is health care like, including dentists...is it all private?

I think it might just be a dream given that we have literally no money and not a lot of support. But I would like to consider it in the future, anyway - if not quite yet.

Thanks for any advice or thoughts.

Oh yes - the other thing - can you home educate there? I know it's illegal in Germany.

You cannot home educate freely, as far I understand it - you have to use the French NC at home.

1. it is easy to rent property but if you don't have payslips you will need to pay one year's rent in advance as a deposit

1. it is quite hard to find part-time jobs but full time jobs are 35 hours per week and there is very good childcare provision and good tax provision for families

1. health care is run on an entirely different model to the UK. Everyone must contribute to social security and gets basic health care reimbursed, but you would do best to find an employer with good private health insurance

What sort of work can you do? English speaking secretaries can earn good money doing quite routine (ie not too taxing) jobs in Paris.

Many, many thanks Bonsoir

That's very helpful indeed. I am fairly good on a clerical footing, but have never had a high ranking job before.

The education thing would not bother me too much - ds1 likes school anyway. Though I wonder what their system is like compared to ours.

The 35 hours thing sounds brilliant and would work very well I think.

I am not sure about the year's rent though. I might need to think about that a bit more.

The education system is different - more old-fashioned, quite sound on basics and on discipline but lower on creativity than English schools.

You would need to research jobs and home location before making decisions as you definitely want to ensure your local state school (which you will have choice over - you will be allocated to a school according to your home address) is decent as well as that your transport to work is good before making a decision.

People tend to live much closer to their jobs here than in England - there isn't a lot of childcare provision for long commutes/early starts.

It sounds as though I will need to treat it very seriously - as you would, obviously, with a big move like this.

I'm really grateful for all the info. I think it might be easier to do once I am with someone. Hoping this will come about, before too long - but I am going to factor in their willingness to emigrate I think. I will always wonder what could have been if I don't try living in France, at least for a while.

Have you been there many years Anna?

Yes, coming up for 19 years - with a couple of years break...

can i hijack and ask about best stage to move at? We have a dd age 11 and are contemplating move to france in one year's time maybe two. What happens at that age ? Bac or what? Thanks

The usual age to take the BAC is 18 or though some children take it earlier or later if they have skipped a year or repeated a year earlier on.

If you move when your child is 13, she will be in 'college' and will have a couple of more years of secondary school before starting to study for the BAC or a more vocational qualification.

hi, assume you live in france? So at that age is their any specialisation? Like us here for gcse's?

My children are still in primary, but from what I understand, there isn't much choice about what you study in the first four years of secondary, except perhaps which languages you choose.

hi, assume you live in france? So at that age is their any specialisation? Like us here for gcse's?

Hi overthemill

I lived in France from age 13-18. Assuming the system remains broadly the same as then, any "options" are taken aged 15, after the Brevet des Colleges (which is the closest thing to GCSEs, only taken a year earlier).

Assuming you took the academic rather than vocational route at 15, you could then choose which path to take: literary BAC, scientific BAC, etc. This then determined how many hours of each compulsory subject you took, and any additional subjects (e.g. extra languages). Nowhere near as much room for choice as here though - as an example, 4 hours a week PE was part of the core curriculum at 18 .

The system was very traditional and assessment was continuous throughout the year (but also had final exams) - you needed an average of 10/20 or above to move into the next year. I managed perfectly well, but I was the eldest of 5... my younger siblings struggled a bit, especially in primary (more with the testing, they were just not used to it!).

HTH a bit!

thanks, sorry so busy.
what i'd like an idea of then is the 'best' age to transfer - she is 11 at the moment about to go into yr 7 and we are thinking next year at the earliest. would she be at any disadvantage moving at any particular year point, eg in terms of choosing options?
does that make sense?

I think anyone considering moving their child to a country where the child doesn't speak the language should think VERY HARD about it if the child is over 8.

If you brought a child of 12 to France they would almost definately be kept down a year to try and help catch up with the language. Extra help is available in some areas but by no means all. If the move is to be a temporary one then I would definately consider an international school, where the language barrier wouldn't be an issue.

I don't think I can stress enough how difficult it is to learn a forieng language up to the level required, and a child of 12 has the same language learning capacity of an adult.

We have been here 7 years now and in that time have seen numerous families come and then go again because the language barrier is simply too difficult to break.

To the OP, work may be available to you in city areas, but rural France is quite different. Unless you are completely fluent jobs are very difficult to find, and you would get little state help as a foreigner who hasn't paid into the French system.

I am not being deliberately negative, if you have very young children, and enough money to buy your own house and set up a business then you can have a good life here, but for older children and those with no capital behind them it can be very hard.

our kids are all gifted at langs, like dh and ds has been learning french since 4 but is by no means fluent. My experience of friend who had to move to switzerland was 12 yr old learned quickly with no more than 1 yr prev of french lessons. So i'm opti istic tho totally understand your pov.

overthemill - which calendar year was your DD born in? Children born in a calendar year make up the intake for a school year (starting in September) in France; so she may or may not be in the same academic year in France as in England.

Basically in France there is much, much less in the way of specialisation than in the UK. College, which is a sort of junior high school, is identical for everyone bar choice of foreign languages and Latin/Greek (which are add-ons). And most bright children do the Bac S (maths and sciences concentration). It is very, very different to the English system which lets children play to their individual strengths. In France, all children are basically assessed on the same topics and ranked.

ok think i understand. she was born 1999 (so just ending yr 6 here). She is across the board at all subjects and at the moment wants to be a vet! So science and maths important.

it isn't 100% yet - we have much to think about. One dd will be at uni by then and ds will stay in uk term time. but it is a long wanted and talked about desire.

1999 - so would be entering college in France this September.

Be aware that you cannot go to vet school in England directly from France with the French bac. She would need additional A levels on top.

wouldnt Int Bac be ok though? I thought that was ok? But anyway thanks. Will look into it to make sure we have full picture.

French schools don't do the IB - if you want your DC to do the IB, it will be in an international school and cost lots of money

I think moving a child of high school age within the UK is difficult. Ask your Adult friends if they moved when they were young and how it affected them, don't ask them about their chidlren the effects aren't necessarily there yet.

Then take that difficulty and times it by 10. You take a child from an environment they know with friends and activities, and you move them somewhere they no no-one and have to start all over. No add to that the fact that they can't communicate with these strangers, that they have to sit in class rooms all day, from 8 in the morning until 5 at night not understanding what is going on then you may start to have some understanding as to how hard it would be on your dd.

frenchfancy, i'm at a bit of a loss to understand why you think I haven't thought of these issues myself already? Apart from the fact that many children are moved around from schools for reasons of economic necessity, to move to a 'better' school area, for work reasons (like forces children) and survive pretty much ok - I would not contemplate a move abroad if we hadn't already considered the emotional implications for our entire family.

However what I had asked the helpful MN community was a bit more information about the french schooling system in order to make an informed decision about when a move would be best from an education perspective.

ASAP is best from an education perspective, both in terms of language acquisition/adapating to the French system and methods and moving at a point when other children move.

Clearly it's not going to be doable for September but the next break is at 14/15 (depending on the birth month) for Lycee which is too late unless you're a fluent French speaker and have a level across the board equivalent to the brevet.

One of my best friends here moved at 12 and said that any later would have been virtually impossible to catch up for her (but she's not particularly gifted at languages). As it was she was advised not take the Bac but to go to a Lycee professionel which would make vet school impossible.

The differences become quite pronounced early on IME. If you are serious then try getting some materials from the CNED to see what she should/would be doing. Bear in mind too that some things are taught and/or expressed differently (e.g. maths) so it's not just the obvious languages/history/civics that are different.

IB might/might not be okay for vet science. Depends on the university and what the school that you're at's timetabling is like - whether bio and chem can be taken at HL etc.

We have a second home in France and have many friends who have uprooted their family and moved over the water. Sometimes the children were kept down a year (but tended to be teenagers - younger children seemed to adapt very quickly) and all learned the language very quickly. Some friends of ours moved when their DD was 13 - she met a French boyfriend quickly and was totally bilingual within 18 months.

I suppose you'd need to research which area of the country you'd want to go to. Our house is in the middle of rural Normandy and lots of Brits come over looking for the good life, then get disillusioned when they realise how hard it is to live in the countryside, isolated from friends, having to deal in a different language etc. Also, if you can find employment, then great, but if you wanted to start a business etc, then the bureaucracy is a nightmare.

thanks to you both, that's really helpful. Dd s gifted at languages and is extremely keen to make the move but she does want to be a vet tho obviously could study in france! We want to move next summer probably as that works with eldest going to university, to take french. We think dh will work in uk initially and we hope to take over existing gite business in charente which we know very well and love.
Will check out that website!