Going home to give birth

[Throughthenetcurtains]

Hi, I have been trying to find an answer about this but haven't found another post that is very clear.

Does anyone have experience of living abroad but going back to U.K. to give birth - but without having to pay?

We still have a house in the U.K. and I am still tax resident there. I am still registered with my GP. I don't work where we live in Switzerland. I have been going back to the U.K. every 1-2 months for a week or so, so I haven't been out of the country for more than 3 months at any one time (I read this was relevant?)

I may be able to attend some antenatal appointments in the U.K. but not all of them and I will need to have some of my care over here. The timing of when the baby is due (near Xmas) means I really do need to give birth in the U.K. if possible and I would go back a month before my EDD.

Does anyone have any experience with making this work? Will the NHS be alright with it? TIA

As a Brit that gave birth in Europe (albeit not Switzerland) I would seriously urge you to consider giving birth in Switzerland. I was guaranteed an epidural. Middle of night on a Sunday at 7cm dilated and my request for an epidural wasn't even questioned - in the UK it's likely I would've been told it wasn't possible.

Aftercare was amazing - 4 days in hospital to have stitches cleaned twice daily and help with breastfeeding. In the UK I could've been discharged after a few hours.

Nevermind the moral aspect - you're not actually eligible for free NHS care unless you're ordinarily resident. If you're white and English mother tongue you'll get away with it. I have a white British friend who now lives in Africa but came back to give birth and wasn't questioned at all - wonder if that would've been the case if she was black or had a foreign accent? So it's possible but hardly a good moral choice.

"Ordinarily resident" in the eyes of EU law is 180 days in the calendar year. So, if you are resident more than that in Switzerland, you will have a hard time proving your residency is anywhere but there.

I genuinely don't understand why you wouldn't just have the baby in Switzerland. I live abroad, have had all of my kids here, as have my expat friends, because healthcare here is much better and more reliable than in the UK. Getting a first overseas passport takes about 4 weeks.

On the citizenship issue, if your child is born outside the UK, they get your British nationality "by descent". This means that if your child then stays outside the UK and has their own children, they would not be able to pass on their British citizenship. However, if your child moves back to the UK at any time and has children there, her children would be entitled to British citizenship.

The only difference is that if you have the child in the UK, and you're British or have settled status there, your child would get British citizenship by birth. This would mean they could pass on their British nationality to any future children regardless of whether they were living in the UK or not. Frankly, I would have thought that right now if was better to have a half chance of getting another nationality (i.e. Swiss)!

No chance of Swiss nationality unless they live there for 12 (iirc) years.

**”However, if your child moves back to the UK at any time and has children there, her children would be entitled to British citizenship. The only difference is that if you have the child in the UK, and you're British or have settled status there, your child would get British citizenship by birth.”

This is too naïvely put. In real life it is not that simple ! All that child needs is for their work to take them on secondment abroad - or for their partner’s work - just at that moment of the birth.... and no British nationality. This is a horribly unfair rule and should be changed.

Contrast this with domicile for tax reasons, which is thrust back upon you if born in Britain after being overseas for years, even if you come back temporarily. It is not coherent. “Sorry, your descents loose their right, child is “British by descent” forever, but for tax, well sorry you’re through and through British, so domicile” 😬

This is too naïvely put. In real life it is not that simple ! All that child needs is for their work to take them on secondment abroad - or for their partner’s work - just at that moment of the birth.... and no British nationality. This is a horribly unfair rule and should be changed.

But while this horrible rule exists it is best to do everything possible to have one’s DC in the U.K.

Well, paying for the privilege is perfectly possible...

You think it is a «privilege» to have to take precautions to ensure your grandchildren can have British nationality?

Isn't it obligatory to have health insurance in Switzerland
I lived there and I had to have it to have my resident permit
I would love to have a baby in Switzerland it's such a great country

Get your parents to come to you.
Don't have the baby in England honestly it's so stretched

As in the moral aspect aside it's just going to be much better Care in Switzerland, honestly when I moved to the UK I got a nasty nasty shock with the state of things here

Don’t be obtuse, Maria, please. Your arguments are quite tedious, actually.
I’m just pointing out that if there’s a price tag attached to getting what you want, sometimes you’ve just got to bite the bullet and pay it.
Op isn’t entitled to the treatment for free. Wanting something doesn’t make it yours.

I’m not being obtuse. I am describing the risks associated with the OP giving birth outside her home country.

. Why would the risks have any bearing on her entitlement to free hospital care?

None at all. I am merely pointing out that there are more complex issues to consider here than entitlement to free health care alone. The issue of entitlement to free health care is rather minor.

Fair enough.

Her grandchildren will be entitled to British citizenship if she gives birth in Switzerland. The only reason they wouldn't be is if they themselves are born outside of the UK.

Not true prometheus. As someone else explained already children born outside UK (unless forces or diplomatic status) are "British by descent". Makes no difference to the children until they have children but they cannot pass it on to the OPs grandchildren automatically.

No prometheus is right. If the her grandchildren are born in the UK they would be entitled to British citizenship. If her child has children outside the UK, then no, they wouldn't be entitled to British citizenship.

In any case, as several people have pointed out, it's more of a moral issue. As a permanent resident in another country, you're not entitled to free NHS care. If the OP feels comfortable lying about it then fine, but personally I wouldn't.

There is a route called the S2 route which enables EU and EEA nationals to access NHS treatment for ongoing medical conditions (including pregnancy) when in UK. You need to get the form from the Swiss authorities.

In practice though, given that you are still registered with a UK GP and still have a home in the UK, you can also access NHS treatment directly and get the S2 to cover you for your care in Switzerland - though that will not be in a private hospital.

The NHS is a residence based system and those resident in UK qualify for free treatment. The fact that you and your DH are British, have paid NI contributions and still pay tax in UK does not entitle you to treatment.

www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/healthcare-abroad/going-abroad-for-treatment/giving-birth-outside-the-uk/

This is the UK end of the S2. Switzerland will have its own equivalent.

.....which is also called S2

I’ve given birth in the UK and Switzerland. I much preferred the Swiss experience personally.

I’m British by decent, not birth (as is DH) but DC2 born in CH did qualify for British citizenship, though we were initially led to believe they wouldn’t. We just had to jump through extra hoops.

May I ask was it because you had any diplomatic or forces link ? Was it several years ago ? If not, what documents did you have to provide and what part of the Act was it under (specified on certificate) ?