Going home to give birth

[Throughthenetcurtains]

Hi, I have been trying to find an answer about this but haven't found another post that is very clear.

Does anyone have experience of living abroad but going back to U.K. to give birth - but without having to pay?

We still have a house in the U.K. and I am still tax resident there. I am still registered with my GP. I don't work where we live in Switzerland. I have been going back to the U.K. every 1-2 months for a week or so, so I haven't been out of the country for more than 3 months at any one time (I read this was relevant?)

I may be able to attend some antenatal appointments in the U.K. but not all of them and I will need to have some of my care over here. The timing of when the baby is due (near Xmas) means I really do need to give birth in the U.K. if possible and I would go back a month before my EDD.

Does anyone have any experience with making this work? Will the NHS be alright with it? TIA

Could your family not come to Switzerland for Christmas. If you had the baby in the UK, how long would it take to get it a passport to go back to Switzerland? Lots of bank holidays etc around Christmas.

We moved over to CH while I was pg and had private cover for antenatal care and the birth. The birth certificate was issued very quickly. You are not habitually resident in UK now (presumably you have registered locally as resident) even if you pay tax or visit.

And you have 6+ months to make friends, many of whom will have been in similar circumstances re. Childcare and no family locally. Is your elder dc attending school or activity groups, will you have language lessons, meet dh colleagues etc.

You describe yourself in your first post as 'living abroad'. You know that you're not just visiting your husband there. It would be dishonest to claim otherwise to the NHS.

If you were living somewhere without access to good, safe healthcare I would be sympathetic, but that's clearly not the case in Switzerland.

I, DH (and now DC) live in the UK. Our families don't. I still gave birth here. Lots of people give birth 'abroad'/away from their parents.

Very underhand thing to do.

There are extremely good reasons for wanting to give birth in the country of the parents’ nationality.

There are good reasons for wanting many, many things, but we are not entitled to all of them free gratis.

What a lot of planning when you've likely just got your bfp

It really is highly inadvisable to be born in a random country to which you have no ties just because your parents happen to be working there at the time.

Living there, Maria?

People can live in countries on a short term, non settled basis because their work has taken them there. That does not mean they have any ties to the country, nor that they even chose to live there - it is more often the choice of an employer.

As someone who has family members who are unable to pass on their British nationality (despite being British and having gone to school and university in the U.K.) due to the whims of employers, I am acutely aware of the issues!

The NHS guidance specifically states "free NHS hospital treatment is provided on the basis of someone being ‘ordinarily resident’. It is not dependent upon nationality, payment of UK taxes, national insurance contributions, being registered with a GP, having an NHS number or owning property in the UK."

www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-the-nhs-charges-overseas-visitors-for-nhs-hospital-care/how-the-nhs-charges-overseas-visitors-for-nhs-hospital-care

In your first post you describe yourself as "living abroad". No matter how you try to "frame it" I think the answer here is fairly clear.

Maria surely the issue isn't whether the OP's child is born in the UK, but whether the OP will have to pay to allow that to happen.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/expat-health/11571256/British-expats-from-outside-Europe-must-pay-for-NHS-hospital-care.html

Actually, no, because the citizenship/nationality rules require the mother to be ordinarily resident...

It’s not necessarily straightforward.

I don't think that's true Maria.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/701672/British-citizenship-automatic-acquisition-v2.0.pdf

But I'm happy to be corrected if you can can point me to any sources.

That document explains my point.

So your older child is at school in the UK although you live in Switzerland, and you want to be here to spend Christmas with them? That doesn't make it sound as though you are habitually resident here.

Or is your older child at school in Switzerland? That definitely doesn't sound as though you're habitually resident here.

Yes exactly @juneybean - very recent news and lots of stressful decisions to make. Of course, as it's so early the pregnancy may not work out and so this would all be moot.

Thank you everyone for your thoughts, both supportive and challenging (less keen on swearing) - I will be taking them all into account.

Maria The document outlines the difference between citizenship "by descent" and "otherwise than by descent". Assuming OP is a British citizen, if she gives birth in the UK her child will be a citizen other than by descent and will therefore be able to pass on their citizenship to their own child even if that child is born outside the UK.

Whether the OP is "ordinarily resident" in the UK at the time she gives birth here makes no difference at all. The document literally doesn't contain the phrase "ordinarily resident".

If the OP isn't British then whether she is "settled" in the UK becomes of relevance. However "settled status" is a legal term of art that does not just mean "ordinarily resident".

Taking them all into account? You're not ordinarily resident in the UK, therefore NHS care will not be free.

You 'framing' it as just being overseas to visit your DH is fraudulent.

Whilst I think all the posters telling you you aren't legally entitled to use the NHS are technically correct I think you will be fine.

I can't bring myself to get up in arms about your 'playing the system' if you have been a taxpayer for years and only just left. I know someone who did this last year. Compared with the waste of resources that goes on with actual residents who don't contribute...

Don't overthink the NHS side of things. I tried very hard to use my DDs EHIC and private health insurance from our country of residence when visiting the UK and the staff had no idea how to process us. I eventually gave in and just used my dad's address so she could get seen. The way you intend to frame it sounds fine.

For what it's worth though I think you are mad to want to give birth in the UK when you have the option of a private Swiss hospital. I had two lovely births in Europe, outstanding care, same obstetrician for all appointments and delivery, private room, pretty nice food etc and you want to be on an NHS ward? If you can't get a family member to come over then I have no doubt that you can find a friend or colleague who will take your older DC when you go into labour. Best of luck.

I completely agree with anotherexpatteacher, especially regarding NHS care at the moment. They're broke and it shows.

I honestly think you will get better care here in Switzerland. Go and see your gynie in Switzerland. Explain your concerns. I’m sure they will help. There are lots of options here - hospital, Private hospital, birthing unit. Some depend on insurance. But from what i understand you will be well looked after. I had two children in the Uk. Listening to Mums who’ve had babies here it sounds good compared to the nhs. Wishing you a happy stress free pregnancy

Ps some insurance providers provide help for new Mums. This can even include cleaning etc. worth looking into. Are you in any local Facebook groups?