UK University Fees - Residence Requirement

[JessieMcJessie]

I've been working in Hong Kong for 5 years and just recently started looking into returning to the UK and maybe doing a Masters or postgrad diploma.

I was a bit shocked to discover that even if you are a British citizen you will not count as a "home" student if you have not been living in the UK for three years prior to the start of the course.

This means that I'd have to pay international level fees and also that I would be competing for places allocated to international students (of which there are generally fewer).

I see that the same rule applies to British teenagers applying to do their undergrad degree: if they have lived abroad for three years or more due to parents' job, they have to pay full fees. I imagine that some of you must have had to take this into account when planning your children's education?

I know that you can possiby be assessed as a home student if you can show that the employment abroad was only temporary. However I am on a permanent contract here that specifically states they don't have to give me a job in our London office if I decide to go back to the UK. I also sold my flat before I left and don't pay UK tax, and 5 years is quite a long time away I suppose. I always intended to go back though.

Has anyone been successful in convincing the UK authorities for this purpose that their time abroad was only temporary? If so, how long had you been living out of the UK?

Also, can anyone shed any light on WHY they impose this requirement? I know I can't change it, but I think if I understood the policy reason behind it I might be able to accept it with better grace.

I can think of two reasons:

1. you need to have paid UK tax for a few years if you want to get the benefit of the UK education system at home rates. (but I paid higher rate tax for 10 years before I left...)

1. You might bugger off abroad again as soon as you finish the course, so the 3 years is to show commitment to the UK if you are someone with a history of working outside it.

The course I want to do results in an NHS qualification and we'd be moving my DH's job back to the UK permanently too, so I could easily show that commitment in other ways. Plus the very fact that I have been abroad for so long means I have got it out of my system!

Interested to hear your stories/opinions.

Just out of interest HERE ARE THE GUIDELINES on eligibility for home status fees.

We were expats for a long while, had sold our UK house and had a work contract that was based overseas but we were still able to get home fee status by showing we were on a temporary work permit in the country we were in, that we always intended to return to the UK (pensions etc were based in the UK), that we regularly visited the UK, that DHs employers were based in the UK and that they paid us an expat 'type' package in the country we were in. We only moved back to the UK 2 years before DS wanted to go to university.

We thought we were a borderline case but despite being 100% upfront we were awarded home fee status. I found it strange that the decision was not made by a central organisation and that each individual university was able to decide for itself. I was told that some students have been awarded home fee status by some Unis but overseas fee status by others as there is some variation as to how the universities interpret the criteria.

I also found some universities to be far more helpful than others. Some would not give any indication as to how they would catogorise DS until after he had applied while others were happy to confirm it one way or another before he had applied.

OP, you are correct in thinking that you sound like an overseas fee status student but I would double (and triple check) with the Universities that you are hoping to apply to. It sounds very unlikely that you meet the criteria but it wouldn't do any harm to be certain.

As our case proves it doesn't automatically make you ineligible to be awarded home fee status just because you don't pay tax in the UK and/or because you don't have a house in the UK and/or because you haven't lived in the UK for the three years before going to University.

hello Jessie,
Perhaps this is too simple. Wait until you are back home in the UK and then apply. This might mean missing a start this year but surely then you will be a home student. Yes I know it says you have to be resident in the UK for three years but who is to know if you just tick the right box? You are not applying for a student loan where there might be background checks involved.
Your intentions are honest and it is a means to an end.
Too simple?

I don't think that would work as it would be hard to fabricate the details of what the OP was doing during the 3 years they were claiming to be in the UK. Plus it's fraudulent and dishonest. In my experience Universities send out fee assessment forms if there is the smallest hint that an applicant may be an overseas fee payer. It's not just a matter of ticking a box.

So I am too British to self fund but too overseas to qualify for NHS funding. If I were not British I would be able to fund myself.
OK now that is unreasonable - if international students are allowed (albeit with fewer places available) then the University really should either consider you as a Home/EU student OR as an international student - it isn't remotely fair to say that you can't be either! that is something reasonable and logical to fight against, and I think you'd have a reasonable chance of winning such a fight if you solely focused on getting a place on the course as an international student without trying to get them to rewrite the rule book to be considered a Home/EU student.

gfplux thanks for the suggestion but it's actually a crime so best not. In any event the application process involves an interview and employer references so it would be obvious I was lying. And I've also already contacted several Universities using my own name to enquire about my particular circumstances!

Fish thanks. The University's international students co-ordinator is making further enquiries for me as maybe it was a misunderstanding by admissions. I'm also waiting to hear from 2 other institutions as to their policy.

jijiijijiji thanks for all the detail that you have given, that's a helpful comparison.

My dd is now back in the UK on Home status. We left the UK when she was 11.
It is not a NHS funded degree so it would appear the rules are different, but the key for us was proving our status here is temporary rather than permanent and dh was on a temp work permit (renewed annually), ie if he lost his job here, we have no right of abode anywhere than the UK (or EU). The only property we own is in the UK. We could also show that we travel back to the UK regularly, and maintain UK Bank accounts/credit cards, and pay an annual tax bill (so we are in the taxation system)

Many long term expats now take extended long visas or Permanent resident status - this counts against you. So many expats said to me, "oh we are are just going to buy a flat and use that address"- not that simple!

Thanks fatowl

dh was on a temp work permit (renewed annually), ie if he lost his job here, we have no right of abode anywhere than the UK (or EU).

That is precisely my situation.

It's interesting, looking at what others have said about how cases are assessed. There is no definitive public statement as to what constitutes "temporary". So if the assessment is indeed a "box ticking" exercise, the problem is that only those assessing (NHS Bursaries in my case, the Universities themselves in others) know what the boxes are. I bet you were never told which of the various factors you cite were actually relevant to the decision.

Did you look through the link I gave earlier? It refers to relevent case studies that they have helped determine how they assess home fee status etc the link is. HERE
It's unweildy to read but not that complicated. The Universities are not coming up with completely random requirements - they are all based on the same things.

I'd have thought you were in with a chance if your DH was on a temporary work permit. I presume it's in his passport - does it have an end date or is it automatically renewed?

Have you bought somewhere in HK?
Is DH company providing temp housing?
Do you have details of all your flights to the UK (passport stamps)
Were any of your visits to the UK extended visits?
Do you have any financial links to the UK - not tax, (savings, accounts etc)
Do both you and DH have British passports?
Can you show you lived in the UK for the rest of your life apart from the last 5 years?

The fee assessment forms vary a lot but are similar. We had to provide proof of everything we claimed (we were totally honest so not a problem)

I'd be curious to know how you get on.

Thanks jijijiij. I had seen that guidance page before, it was very helpful and I even got the full case judgements and read them (I am actually a lawyer!). The Huddlestone case is very relevant-even relates to Hong Kong- but they found against her. One of the factors cited was that 13 years away was so long that it was hard to see the move as anything bit permanent, but the judge did not comment on the maximum number of years one might spend away and still be considered only away temporarily. That was why I asked for people's experience of their own success stories.

Btw, when I said my situation was the same as yours I meant that I was not on a permanent work permit, not that DH wasn't on one. As it happens, DH isn't either, but I didn't even know him when I moved here, we met in HK and only got married 6 months ago, so I wouldn't expect his situation to have any bearing on whether my own decision to move abroad was a permanent one. My visa is issued for 2 years at a time (used to be 1 year) and doesn't automatically renew. However they pretty much rubber stamp it as long as there is proof I am still employed. If I left my job I would have no right to stay here unless DH (also British) applied for me to be a dependent on his visa.

I've sent you a pm - I don't like to put too much personal info online.

I just spoke to the student finance people and my tuition fee application has been approved. Am so thrilled. I've not gone for any sort of living grant or childcare help etc. I just wanted to NOT have to pay the course fees back until I'm working...

They told me "we do accept that sometimes people are overseas temporarily"...

Pupsie that's great news, you must be very relieved. Thanks for updating. Hope you enjoy the course and it leads to a good job for you.

On the teenagers issue I have a friend who moved with her husband abroad (another EU state). They sent all 3 sons to an English boarding school for sixth form only and then those boys went on to English universities. I don't know what fee basis that was then on - international or home student but perhaps boarding school in the UK equals residence in the UK and then home fees apply after that?

EU same as home fees.

Being domiciled in UK or EU for educational purposes only, including boarding school, does not usually entitle someone to be regarded as a home fee payer.

So Xenia's Flowerfairy's friends' dc's would have paid home fees anyway even if they'd followed their parents.

Excuse rogue apostrophe!

Flower. Unless the legislation has changed in the last couple of years sending your DC to the UK for educational purposes does not count towards the three year residency requirement. However it was probably irrelevent for your friends as they were still in the Euroupe and so wouldn't have to pay 'international' fees anyhow.

Good point. I expect they also sent them to a UK school for sixth form to make the adjustment to UK universities easier too.

I went to the ombudsman when the university I applied forbilled me as an international student due to the three year's residence requirement, because I had been POSTED OVERSEAS AS A SERVING MEMBER OF THE ROYAL AIR FORCE.

The government tell me I have to live overseas, then tell me I don't fill the residence requirements? Right. I was having none of that bollocks.

I did of course win that little tiff, but they really aren't pissing about with this residence requirement. And it took me six months of letter writing and the ombudsman to rule in my favour before they were willing to admit me, British military personnel, as a home student. You couldn't make it up, really.

We are in this situation now as have subsequently emigrated, and our kids will fall foul of the requirement if they want to study in the UK. And currently, can't receive full funding here as we are not citizens.

This is one of the many pitfalls of moving overseas that you don't quite realise when you fill in the paperwork. Don't start me on pensions, either

Expats talk about sending the kids back to board for A levels. I have seen it many times. 2 years of A levels + a gap year working in the UK and visiting the parents abroad = home student.

Hi Jessie - if you have a national insurance number, passport and were born in the UK then you can exercise your "right to roam" and still be classed as a UK student with full Home Student status. Hope this helps - though someone may have more direct experience.