where's best to live in nz,and what do we need to know?

[AngryBeaver]

My dh has been on at me for a year to move from the uk.He wanted Quebec,which looked gorgeous and romantic,but i wasn't sold on the winters and coudn't leave my mum.
He recentley said he wanted to move to NZ and i thought ,yeah if it's warm and a better life than here,let's do it.
So we've got fuck all money and 3 kids under 4.5 ...but we want to do it.
I don't know what's changed in me for me to agree ,but I hear th schools and hospitals are fab,and just want the best life for my lovely children.
I'm worrying though because I've read the houses are crap and cold.
We want sun,space and not too expensive (don't we all!)
We thought Tauranga,but that seems quite busy and we've read about boy racers.
We don't want Wellington as we've heard it's windy and weather not great.
Does anyone know about Nelson?Heard it's nice weather,but what's the reality?
We are going to put the house on the market this week,I am shitting myself,but I feel it's now or never.
Any help or advice,gratefully recieved

btw did you see it on the news tonight with the flooding. We were having dinner there a few nights ago and walking on the beach. We're about 15 mins drive away - how about you?

Hey, just found this thread so apologies for adding my two-pennorth so late in the day.

Been in Wellington on and off since 2007 (back in the UK for a bit too). Really great city, more than 2000 sunshine hours per year, fab beaches, although definitely a tad chillier than Auckland. But Auckland is too sprawling for me - feels a bit like America.

AngryBeaver - re journalism, don't want to dampen your fire but there are only 4m people here so national press is limited. Mainly Dom Post (Wellington based) and Herald (Auckland) plus a range of small local papers and radio. There aren't that many journos as a result. So you'll need to think hard about where you might get a job.

FWIW, I have a well paid job out here (6 figures) but am far from being awash with cash. Rents are high, food costs a fortune and power bills keep rising... I love NZ, love Wellington, love my job (incredibly flexible, reasonable hours, great work, great colleagues), love my friends but totally underestimated how much I would miss my family back home. I hate that my 2yo doesn't know his grandparents (he hides from them on Skype ), miss having the helping hands to take him for an occasional day so I can have a break and am frustrated that despite my salary I still can't afford the plane tickets home. It's in the back of my mind to go back to the UK to be nearer family - but I know that whatever I do, I'll be torn.

What am I trying to say? Just don't bank on your decisions in the future being easy ones. It's very easy to find your heart split across two hemispheres. But, if you do lose your heart out here, I don't think you will regret it.

If you don't mind me asking,beenbeta,are you selling your uk home?

scroobious have heard about the expense,but surely there are alternatives if you look around? I saw on a price comparison site that a lettuce was $4,but someone came on and said that they can be expensive,but her shop sold them for $1.50 ish. Someone else said the meat is cheap and better than uk, and that fruit and veg is much cheaper buying from the roadside stalls.

We also found a Woolworths(nz shop?) website and the food looked reasonable on there,especially own brand.
We don't buy convenience foods here,I make everything from scratch and make my own bread...so surely it wouldn't be too bad?

for you about your little boy and your parents.I am tearful even thinking about how hard it will be.I feel very down at the moment.My mum absoloutely lives for my children and they worship her.
It's the most difficult decision I've ever made..I hope to God it's the right one.

Re the gang thing,obviously it's not great,but nowhere is going to be crime-free,and at least it's kind of contained to within the gangs.
As kiwifarfromhome said,she was never a vicim of crime there.I think there's less street crime and violent crime there.I know there's a lot of theft from cars,but I'd rather that than being mugged or worse.
I just don't feel safe in the Uk anymore.

Even in our tiny rural village it's creeping in ...first the hiking shop was bloody ram-raided and then our little co-op was held up by armed men

I'm trying not to be naive,but I'm hoping nz is a safer bet for my family.

AngryBeaver - we have never owned a house so we are lucky in being able to just move whenever we want. Our current tenancy ends in July so that is another reason we are going then along with the fact it is the end of the UK school year.

Our poor DSs will be back in a NZ school only 3 weeks later - but half way through the NZ school year. Hope they cope.

beenbeta,oooh,poor boys! I bet you're popular!
They'll be fine,it won't seem so much like hard work when they arrive because they'll be busy making new friends and acclimatising..more like an adventure

I typed a really long post earlier but then deleted it.
I guess with the lettuce thing it depends on the shops, we have little choice and our nearest road side stall is ?maybe 1/2 hour away I'm not doing that every time I need a banana

surely you found woolworths exepnsive? I think it's considered fairly low end in NZ
maybe I just ate really cheap food in the UK?

when we went to Nelson recently we wondered what everyone does for a living we asked our rellies and got the distince impression that they either had money, were retired, or what? a few obviously live there to service the rest of them, it has a bit artistic community but I do wonder how a bit of pot making or painting etc can bring in enough to service a 600k mortgage? so I guess that backs up what delphine says

the other thing I found surprising is that there were loads of subdivisions and new housing going up near our rellies really loads now I would expect that to bring down the price of houses but no every single one of them was about 560,000K!

(please tell me.....)

uhhh
the please tell me was supposed to follow the comment about making a pot and paying your mortgage?

Nelson does sound lovely,but there'd be no work opportunities for dh there.
No,I don't blame you for not going 30 mins for a 'nana ,where are you again? I'm sure you've said,but I can't be faffed trawling through to find it!
Just had a quuick look at woolworths,but wasn't horrified at prices? We buy lots of own brand stuff,except beans and ketchup,obviously ...whar do you mean by low end?socially,pricewise or bad quality?

I think generally food is/can be the same price as the UK especially if you are able to shop around for bargains/specials. Just remember there is much less competition in NZ so some things can be very expensive. It's not really the like for like price you have to watch, it's the % of your wages for food that is higher overall.

www.emigratenz.org/cost-of-living-in-new-zealand.HTML

This is an excellent cost of living calculator that goes into quite a bit of detail. You need to realistically know how much your DH would earn and work out your budget (esp as it doesn't sound like you will take any capital over there).

ScroobiousPip that is exactly how I feel living in UK, I really miss the hands on help and support, and it makes me really sad that DD is missing out on getting to know her kiwi family

Supermarkets - Woolworths, Countdown and Foodtown are all owned by the same company and are all being renamed as Countdown, they basically sell exactly the same stuff and I would say they are mid-range, not low. I've been out of the uk too long to know who to compare them with, maybe Tesco? But smaller! They have 2 own brand ranges "Home Brand" is the very cheap one and "Signature Range" is the slightly more expensive one. Less BOGOFs and stuff here but you can still find good specials sometimes.

Also, if you're used to huge uk supermarkets, the ones here don't do clothes, household goods etc as much as the uk ones do, they are much smaller than a big UK Tesco. The other "mid" supermarket is New World, similar prices and range to Foodtown/Countdown/Woolworths I think.

The only other supermarket chain is Pak n Save which is def at the lower end of the market, like Aldi or Netto I guess? P n S and New World not online though so you can't look at them from UK.

Sibble re floods, we went to a birthday party in Mission Bay on Saturday afternoon, just as well it wasn't on Sunday as Tamaki Drive was closed due to flooding and people were kayaking down it!

I've just returned from 10yrs living in the UK, back to Auckland. I live in an area with lots of british people (devonport) and most people I meet tell me how expensive they find it here. We find food especially a lot more expensive, as there just isnt the competition between supermarkets. I still buy my clothes from the UK and get them sent to NZ.

I think most people are happy to trade lower wages and a high cost of living for the lifestyle though.

We'll have to see what wage dh gets offered.I'm not prepared to jump from the frying pan into the fire.
My brother rang earlier to tell me my mum went round to see him and broke down when talking of us leaving.He told me I should think of her,that she is devastated,and cannot think of life without us.
He thinks I am being impulsive,immature,and romantic.
When I said we wanted adventure,he said I was being childish.
He said I was too old for adventure (we are 31 and 32)and I have to be realistic.
I cried and tried to explain for over an hour our reasons for wanting to go,but he thionks it's unrealistic.
What's the alternative?that I say,"ok,we'll stay" and forever wonder,What If?
beenbeta,I know that leaving family isn't a problem for you (as it isn't for my dh,he doesn't care if he never sees his again)but,has anyone faced this?
I'm so torn

Poor you Angry Beaver. The family thing is so hard. It does sound like your brother is being a bit unreasonable though. Its your life. You ARE taking your mother into consideration. Does he have an agenda wanting you to stay? My brother was extremely angry (still is) that I lived abroad for so long. But I think it was because it didn't validate his decisions to stay put and NOT be adventurous.

Sibble/WhatsheSaid and other Aucklanders - you all ok? Sounds pretty awful. Has been raining non stop in Wellington but no flooding.

AngryBeaver,

1. have you considered putting your belongings and car etc into storage before you go? Shipping is a fair cost and it is cheaper to store stuff for a couple of years than to ship. You could give it a go out here and then decide to ship stuff out later if you stay. It's reasonably easy here to get secondhand stuff off TradeMe or Gumtree, especially from Kiwis heading overseas.

1. Permanent residency is expensive to obtain and you need to meet all the points criteria etc - a big outlay if you change your mind later. If you are only 31 and 32 then, although you are no longer eligible for the normal working holiday visa, you can apply through Bunac (up to 35) for a 12 month visa. It's about a third of the cost. Once you have been there for 12 months, and have a job, it's a lot easier to meet the points criteria for residency. Bunac itself looks a bit 'Gap Year'ish but you can just get the visa through them and leave the rest.

www.bunac.org.uk/uk/worknewzealand/

Yes,I think he would like to do something like this,but has lots of excuses reasons why he can't.

Is everyone alright in aukland? Didn't realise it was so bad x

Meant to add, agree with Kiwifarfromhome re food - it's not that food is expensive per se - it's about the same as in the UK but wages are only around half what they are in the UK and yet rent isn't much lower (depends where you live, to be fair) so your overall budget gets squeezed.

Kiwifarfromhome - perhaps there's an opportunity for an 'granny swap' scheme? Must be hundreds of Brits and Kiwis missing their GPs!

Oh we're fine re the flooding, wellI can't speak for everyone else , there was just a lot of heavy rain in a very short time and some of the houses and roads near the sea got flooded - but not a millionth as much as Australia has suffered recently.

Some photos here , the road the man is kayaking down is one we drove along on Saturday!

Not1, there does need to be more housing stock added all the time, after all net migration to NZ is about 30,000 per annum and they all need somewhere to live! Communities like Tauranga and Nelson are also experiencing a population surge mostly due to baby boomers retiring to sunnier climes.

I was talking to my Mum yesterday about relocating to Napier and she commented that a friend of her's did this a year ago. Friend is a professor at the local polytechnic and has found it very frustrating that her staff apparently have low work ethic compared to what she's used to in Wellington. I said that I'd want to leave work at 4.30pm too if I could go home to a swim in the pool, but Wellington's climate is not condusive to such after work activities so I guess people tend to stay at work longer!

I don't think it's true that rents are just as high as the UK. In Wellington most rentals are less than $600pw for a decent detached house with garden. It is true however that you will tend to end up with less discretionary income out of the undoubtedly lower salaries after paying rent, food, utilities, cellphone etc. The tradeoff is that there are a lot of free things available here that make the lifestyle much nicer so the discretionary income can be stretched further unless you want to travel overseas a lot.

We're fine too, we live quite high but photo 69 is where we parked our car when we had dinner Thursday night in the cafe that is now flooded

Angrybeaver - leaving family and old friends was the hardest thing about moving here. My mum said when we came 'if you go don't ever expect me to visit' and 8 years later my parents still havn't been (she won't let my Dad come either and he's too weak to stand up to her). My sister has been once and we met her in Oz the other year. Initially I took the boys back every year (don't even think about the expense and the logistics of traveling with 2 babies/toddler on your own long haul ). I last went 18 months ago and we are going again later this year. It makes me incredibly sad that my boys don't have any family to spoil them, help take care of them and spend time with them. It also makes me angry that my family won't come. It causes problems with dh as if he comes to UK it uses up all his holiday seeing my family, if he doesn't come we then have to find money for us to have 2 holidays (another with him), I also have to work remotely when away on both holidays etc etc...... None of my family came to the airport to see us off, my oldest friend came . I missed my Grandmother's funeral as I couldn't afford to go home. I missed my neice's birth and first 5 years (apart from the odd visit). I have also missed many other family events and gatherings..............

On the flip side there are people who live in the UK who are far enough away that they don't have regular contact either. DHs sister, brother and extended family all live here and we see them annually if we make the drive up North or fly to Wellington - they don't come to see us. It does get easier. Skype helps. When we do go back they get very indulged and I return with 2 obnoxious brats until I can calm them down - put that in the plus or minus as you see fit .

I came because I thought I didn't want to spend the rest of my life thinking 'what if'. I found adjusting very hard - dh went to work the week after we arrived and I was left to find somewhere to live, set up bank accounts, find GPs etc etc... I stayed because I wanted to give it 2 years - I stayed a third because I agreed with dh I hadn't given it a fair chance - I'm still here because I love it. I don't miss England - I miss family, friends and familiarity.

This isn't intended to be a moan but you asked for honesty about leaving family - for me it has been the hardest part of being here. I wasn't prepared for the impact guilt would have on me settling and enjoying it here.

Sibble you can't be too far from me. We're on the Pohutukawa Coast. Love living here. Love the fact that it is a 35 minute ferry ride into the city (if we ever want to go) and the beach is a few minutes stroll away. Everyone knows everyone around here, lovely community.

I grew up in NZ, but left in my early twenties, came back married with 2 kids, 8 years later. Took me nearly 3 years to stop pining for the UK and my life/friends there. I'm pretty blessed here though, have amazing friends and a great support network.

Kiwis are a funny breed though. We portray ourselves as quite carefree and relaxed, invite people into our homes, but they don't get into our hearts that quickly. Poms, in my experience, are a little slower to warm up, will invite you out to the pub, not so much to their homes, but once you're mates, it is golden. (Obviously a gross stereotype)

BBQwidow - no I'm not far at all. I'm in Brookby. I have friends in Beachlands and we have looked at moving there many times for the ease of using the ferry. I used to take the ds's to the park by the beach when they were younger. Small world - I thought I was the only one out here although I did use to see Ghosty who doesn't seem to post on here any more who lived in Howick - now Melbourne.

Thought some on this thread might be interested in this article in today's NZ Herald.

"Auckland and Tauranga homes less affordable than New York"

This is all really interesting, especially the family stuff. I know I will miss family and friends dreadfully, and DS will miss his GPs who he has a great relationship with. But we do think they will visit. One of the reasons for doing this now is that they are all fit enough to travel, and that might not be the case in 10 years.

Family is the reason we are not planning to go for good. We are lucky though with DH's job and the help we are getting relocating. If we had to fork out for the whole lot both ways and couldn't rely on getting work I don't think we'd do it.

Re rents- I live in London and the costs in New Plymouth look much lower for more space. But we need to find somewhere with decent heating!

pavlova - interesting article.

Me and DW talk about the network of Global cities or 'alpha cities'. that now span the globe. There is a ful list of them in the wiki link. Places like London and New York are well known but also Sydney and to a lesser extent Auckland are in that list and are based on financial services and international capital flows. More people live there with an international and multinational outlook and are often non domiciled and non resident for tax purposes.

In effect, these cites sit outside their own local pysical economy and therefore house prices and other goods and services in those cities reflect the high growth and high wage end of the wider global economy. They have good international communication systems, both in terms of airports, mobile telephony and broadband.

One of the specific reasons we chose Auckland was because it was on that global network - while offering us access to and experience of a region we had not lived before and without the downside of large mage city. In the long term, if we stay, our hope is that our children will have greater opportunities than if they only had UK passports and UK outlook.