Partner stage 4 cancer - what do I we need to do in terms of housekeeping

[Ginola2345]

Partner/DH has stage 4 cancer diagnosed a year ago. I think he is denial and its his way of coping day to day is to have his treatments but day today forget/pretend its not happening and he is just the same (he gets tired, is sometimes forgetful and sometimes clumsier).

We both get upset when talking about or thinking about the future. We are both late 50’s and both still working and have two kids in late teens.

I would like for us both to discuss all practicalities and our wants needs and priorities and then get on with living a full a life as possible together and when things take a turn for the worse (we have no idea of timelines) at least we know we have our house in order and we needn’t waste our time and energies thinking about any of that then.

Should we change the household bills into my name? We could look at pensions? Mortgage only has about 6 or 7 months to run should we leave things as they are or pay it off? Anything else we should be thinking about? Or where would I find a list? We have a joint will leaving everything to the kids equally.

I'm not sure how much I can help with the practicalities but I wanted to post. I am sorry you are going through this. Has your DH been given a terminal or palliative confirmation?

To be honest, I have really struggled with this with my DP. He was diagnosed stage 4, over 3 1/2 years ago. I'm not sure if age makes any difference but he was 37 when diagnosed and I had to literally force him to write a will and that took its time to convince him. His treatment has gone well, much better than expected from what we were told at the start, but it is continuing and I am sure his stubbornness and denial has helped with his progress. I have given up trying to talk about practicalities. I think until he gets told that this is definitely not going to go away, he will continue to be in denial and not really truly acknowledge what's going on. It's hard but if that's what he needs to do to keep that stubborn streak that seems to be helping, I have to just go along with it. Forcing the issue feels like I'm saying I have given up, which is also the last thing I want him to do.

I hope you have more success with these conversations than I do. X

I think I would gather together all the important documents such as the wills so you know where they all are.

Transferring utilities, car ownership, TV licence etc into your name would be a good idea. Anything that he would need to sign for basically, do it now.

Any usernames and passwords for online accounts that you don’t know - things like Amazon, Netflix etc. if he set them up.

I’m sorry this is happening to you.

When my husband's cancer was getting towards the end stage, I had all bills put in my name, and he made a will. There were other admin things too, including claiming in a health policy attached to our mortgage etc. But it wasn't too daunting.

We didn't talk about this stuff much at all. My husband really wanted life to be as normal as possible. He didn't want to discuss his illness. He had all the treatment, did everything that it involved, but otherwise just wanted to enjoy every day as though it was a normal day.

I absolutely respected that. Why should he have to spend his remaining months/weeks/days having to think about it?

Honestly, there wasn't much that needed his involvement. We had joint accounts, and general preparatory admin stuff I did quietly by myself. I recall that he had to speak very briefly to the energy firms etc to have my name as the main account holder. But otherwise there was no need for him to be aware of the things I was doing to prepare.

I may have misunderstood re the will- do you mean that when he dies his assets will go to your kids and not you? If so I would rethink that unless he has kids that are not yours. You are still young and may well need that money. It would be more usual to pass assets to surviving spouse and then to kids on death of surviving spouse.

if the estate is significant use up the IHT nil band on other bequests.

also do you own your house as joint tenants or tenants in common- that has important implications re inheritance.

Ps- sorry- just realised that was all very cold and factual- just wanted to add that I’m sorry you’re facing this. Xx

Oh yes. Passwords. The one thing I forgot was to ask him what the password was for the photo storage and sharing site that he'd uploaded many many family photos to. That was upsetting. As a non-account holder I could only see a proportion of them.

I'm really sorry you're having to do this. I hope that you're able to find it purposeful, and in some way distracting. Fortunately I did. It took my head away from the emotional stuff. I got to achieve things.

"We have a joint will leaving everything to the kids equally."

I'm sorry you are having to deal with this.

I don't think it is possible to have a "joint will". Do you mean you have mirror wills? It would be more usual for spouses to leave the house and estate to the surviving spouse - not to the children - and then to the children on the death of the surviving spouse.

Sort out the Will first as that is the most important thing. As others say wills are individual not joint but you may have mirror wills. Make sure everything is left to you in first instance and children after. Make sure you know where the will is and it may be worth checking with a solicitor that it is valid.
Wills normally also deal with who would care for children if you most passed. Worth rechecking that the person/people you picked are still suitable.
Then I would look into getting power of attorney. There are two types, one for health decisions and one for financial. It would be useful for you to make decisions on his behalf if he becomes unable to do this for himself.
Everything else like passwords can be sorted later if he isn’t prepared to spend lots of time on this sort of thing.

I would suggest setting up power of attorney for health and finance. If there is a time, temporarily or permanently, he is unable to make decisions, or is deemed not to have mental capacity, if you are named, you have legal ability to make choices for him in terms of health and finales if both are set up. Needs legal input and takes a while but doesn't come into force until as and when capacity is lost. Being next of kin is not enough legally and doesn't automatically give you rights to act in his best interest / things he has always said he would or wouldn't want.

I am so sorry you are going through this, and that your husband is struggling with the practicalities. Lots of good advice above.

Can I suggest you think forwards and imagine he dies in 5 years. What would that mean financially for you - are there insurances that would pay out? What would happen to his pension? How old would the children be and what will their needs be? Do you need to look at your wills and think whether they reflect the reality of one of you dying long before the other, possibly before pension age.

I would also consider getting Power of Attorney for each other now when you don’t need it.

Thanks @bookwormcrazy your DH sounds exactly like mine stubborn and in denial and I feel exactly like you. I don’t want to rain on his parade or crush his spirit.

I also want to do more and create memories together especially seen as our retirement is likely to be non existent or cut short. No time line but think its palliative. DH is optimistic with something he has read that he might get another six years. From what I had read I interpreted it to be more like two years was the maximum and we are one year in which is awful.

Thanks @MadamWhiteleigh that is a good starting point. I don’t want to push it too much but feel if this done and acknowledged we can forget about it this rather than it hanging over us alongside everything else.

Thanks @saraclara that is reassuring and a good way of thinking. I normally like to be as organised as possible and I am worried I will go to pieces and DH has lots. of things online and I am dreadful with passwords but I perhaps should leave it like you say.

@illiterato and @paradoxicalfrog and @LadyTemperance sorry no his assets would go to me and vice versa then after our day/days split equally between the kids. The kids are late teens so less relevant than it would have been but will executors and guardians or go to people would be SIL, BIL, my DSIS and my best friend all godparents.

Thank you @illiterato you have nothing to apologise for. I think I feel so helpless I wanted to do something proactive but maybe I should leave well alone. DH has passwords set for every mortal thing he is quite the it whizz and I am more old school and always forget passwords.

Thanks @LadyTemperance @Mummyofdoggies and @LadyGardenersQuestionTime yes power of attorney would be good and it was something I was thinking of but I haven’t broached it with DH at all yet. As he can get quite tearful if I want to talk. He has briefly talked about pensions and I think I would be ok but I prefer to see things written down and have every thing in one place incase I need to refer back to it.

I am sorry for your situation but I am concerned about his will; I hope that you are to be left your home and the joint savings etc you've built up - why would they go to your teenage children? You need to take advice and ensure you are going to be okay.

I can see why the power of attorney might be difficult for him to involve himself in. It's not something that occurred to us, and fortunately I never had cause to need one. After he died, I got one sorted for myself though, only too aware that it would be my young adult children who would have all this to worry about in the future. I wanted to make it easier for them.

If your DH is reluctant to consider one, that's a very good reason for you to be addressing things now, while he's still able to sign off on them. Like I said, I did these things quietly in my own, without any real discussion or involvement on my DH's part. He knew I was working these things out, but again, he didn't need his nose rubbing in what was going to happen to him.

Luckily I'd always been the admin/financial half of the partnership, so it was nothing unusual or underhand. But hopefully there's a lot you can investigate and put in place without your DH having to be involved.

Do you have a joint current account or savings accounts? Again, fortunately we mostly did. My DH had a savings account of his own (not deliberately but historically) so that money was simply transferred to one of our joint accounts via internet banking and without him needing to sign anything. When he died the only action I had to take was to take his death certificate to the bank, and all they needed to do was issue a new cheque book with only my name on 😥

Doing these very simple things that didn't disturb him, and taking over the utilities accounts in plenty of time, made life very very much easier at the hardest point.

It’s awful to have to talk about these things but equally awful to have to experience what happens if he dies without them being sorted… if you have a Maggies centre nearby they can support you through difficult conversations…

I think you need to sit down and say “it’s shitty but we need to have one week of shitty stuff in order to have this and that sorted. Then we can pretend it’s not happening if you want AFTER that.

Will
power of attorney
DNA CPR
List all assets like shares and pensions and stuff you might not know exist or how to find them…
Passwords and funeral preferences (both of you can document your preferences)

These would be my key areas to sort out. In fact we really ALL should do them as we don’t know what’s round the corner for any of us. My good friend was recently and devastatingly widowed and had no idea how much many of her direct debits were and how to organise them as they had separate accounts…

@kweeble the will is ok sorry I explained it badly everything would go to me and after my day our DC equally.

@saraclara unfortunately DH takes care of all our family finances and household bills etc, (I do all or the lions share of the mundane cleaning, cooking and have started sneakily taking on mowing the lawn) and booking holidays and organising the family calendar. So its mainly DH’s name on bills and I think both cars might be in his name or one maybe in my name.

I set up POA just for finances for my father and for my mum which was quite easy to do. Just before dads dementia kicked in but my parents both still had to each sign to say they agreed to it, so I don’t know how your DH didn’t know unless it was when his health was deteriorating and he wasn’t bothered.

Its such a minefield unfortunately DH and I didn’t get married until our mid thirties and I just thought we would have more time. We are also one of those sad couples who do almost everything together as well.

If you are UK based, I believe any pensions should have a nominated beneficiary now.

Also, is it worth having someone to come in and advise on financial aspects, do Macmillan have any services like this?

5 weeks before my DH died of cancer, when the oncology team told us they were stopping treatment and passed us over to the hospice team, we sat down together and sorted stuff out. His Will was already in order, but we spent one day transferring any utilities, direct debits, bills, house insurance etc which were in his name or joint names into my sole name. Mostly this involved phone calls where we both had to speak to the company involved. He handed over ownership of his car to me so I became registered keeper.

We went through some other paperwork so that I knew where to find any accounts, cards or savings just in his name for dealing with later. He closed some things himself like subscriptions to hobbies and magazines he had and standing orders from his account to charity etc.

He didn't really want to talk about funerals except to say that he preferred cremation. I wish we'd talked about that a bit more because me and his best friend ended up having to guess what pieces of music he would have liked at the service and what to do with his ashes.
He also wrote some letters and cards for the future for our DDs (15 and 12 at the time).
I think we only spent about 1 day sorting out transfers of paperwork but it really helped later when I was wading through all the death paperwork, it was less stuff to sort out.

So sorry you are in this position too, OP, it is a shit club to join and I wish you all the best for your remaining time together. My DH lived for 2.5 years after being diagnosed with stage 4 cancer. He died 4 years ago, can't believe it's that long already.

I'm very sorry, I've been in your shoes and it's not a nice place to be. My husband also veered between optimism, denial and reality and so one thing that helped me was to set up my own book of important information and a folder so that as things evolved, I'd have the stuff handy. This meant to a large extent he didn't need to deal with it but when he did need to sign stuff, then I was firm we had to address it so as not to leave me in the lurch- you could always say in 6 years time so you aren't taking any hope away from him.

I had POA, transferred all bills/nothing joint, permission to access/share his medical records (need a letter), all financial details of loans, accounts etc, passwords on important accounts, make the beneficiary yourself on his pension. I even included funeral directors later on so I'd have it all there when the time came, and it was very useful. Another thing we did that was hard was downloading and printing out all of his contacts on his phone, especially useful if he has colleagues or friends you might not have the numbers for. Facebook account? I posted on there after his death to reach those who were abroad/more distant.

Hugs, this is a hard thing to do but some prep on your part will help, just tell him it's necessary however long he lives which

Sorry you're facing this OP.

We have bills mostly in joint names but also have a book where passwords etc are written down. I wouldn't transfer to your name but add you on to accounts if that makes sense. There are just no guarantees in life, an accident can happen (hopefully not but for this bit of admin I'd approach it as something that would make you feel more comfortable for the sake of the children, to have everything in order in case anything we're to happen to either or both of you.

Not sure if your kids are late enough teens for this point to be irrelevant but in general had you talked to someone who would have taken them if you'd both died? We have sorted that especially as a few of our siblings have children but some of them there's no way I'd want them to bring up our DC.

Funeral stuff again, both do it, don't just get DH to do it. Look at it as necessary admin you both need to do, not singling him out.

As @Takeitonthechin says Macmillan and other charities do offer specific financial advice.

Thanks @TappingTed @TheMadGardener and @Highdaysandholidays1 big hugs to you all. I feel all your pain coming through.

We have a joint bank account, both have our own current accounts with very little in, joint credit card (in DH’s name, I can’t even see the online statement) and a joint savings account (again I don’t have access to it). We both have insurance and both have company pensions (both are beneficiaries to each others).

I also worry about things like the funeral music, prayers, cars etc. DH’s DB and SIL (his wife) and his DSIS have plenty of money and a much better standard of living than us.

When FIL passed away a few years ago in a different city DB and SIL steered grieving MIL away from a bog standard funeral tea in an average priced place towards a posh hotel with a full meal choice for everyone (it cost a fortune). They also had a car for FIL and two family funeral cars. MIL is still alive and although less mobile than she once was she can still be quite vocal and opinionated and would side with DBIL, DSIL and his sis.

I know when the time comes I will have enough on coping with keeping going with my own feelings and supporting DH till the end and supporting our teens who like dad also both seem to be in denial (but we all cope differently).

A small point, bou mention that you have a joint credit card in your DHs name, it would be well worth having a card in your own name, or you may find you can't easily pay for things just when you most need to.

A close family member had just passed away, and didn't get affairs in order and things escalated unexpectedly. What would have helped...

Clear, unambiguous expression of wishes for funeral - type of service, carrying of coffin, readings, where to hold wake, dress code, who should be involved, all of that. If he'd like a humanist service, could meet celebrants now.

Agreement and understanding of wishes re final days. Hospice v being at home, visitors, that kind of thing.

MacMillan offer advice on financial matters - use them, they understand the things that need to be done.

Sharing of passwords. Does he have social media accounts, if so should they be deleted or changed to memorial accounts? Does he have photos on his phone you don't have, if he had iPhone/iCloud account, set up a legacy thing so you can access accounts.

Transfer accounts to your name. Set up POA. If he's working, are his nominated beneficiaries for death in service and pensions up to date?

I know it's hard to do all of this. But easier now then have to figure it all out when you're grieving. I'm so very sorry that you're going through this, it's incredibly shit and awful.

I set up POA just for finances for my father and for my mum which was quite easy to do. Just before dads dementia kicked in but my parents both still had to each sign to say they agreed to it, so I don’t know how your DH didn’t know unless it was when his health was deteriorating and he wasn’t bothered.

Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear. He/we didn't set up a power of attorney for him. I only did one for myself, nominating my daughters, after he died.

@Beachhutgirl yes its been like that for years and @WhatWouldTheDoctorDo yes thank you these are all excellent points and I don’t want to be stressing or worrying about all or any of this. Also if its written down I don’t have to worry about DH’s family trying to overrule his wishes and pressurising me into having something flashy that they would want and afford to pay for etc and not what DH would have wanted.

Are you married OP? (You say partner/DH and I wasn't sure which). If you're not, and there might be inheritance tax considerations, you might want to think about getting married. Sorry to hear you're having to think about all this.