9 year old daughter kissing her female friend

[JoeCrackers]

I’m not sure where to even start with this so apologies if it’s muddled, I’m still trying to get my head around it.

DD is good friends with a girl in her class, I’ll call her A and seems to look up to her and copy her a bit. Just harmless stuff really like she asked for black nail varnish and a choker as A wears these and is a goth apparently. DD has always worn uniform skirt/ cardigan but recently refused to wear these and and said she wanted trousers and jumper like A wears. As I said fairly harmless, we’ve all had friends we admired/ copied when young. I just said if she liked these things too that’s fine but just to remember she didn’t have to do the exact same things as A to be friends with her and left it at that. DD uses my iPad which is linked to my phone to FaceTime her friends and last week I saw some messages they had been sending which were very mean towards another girl in their class. I spoke to DD about it and confiscated the iPad. Also spoke to A’s mum
Just to let her know and then left it at that.

Tonight as I was leaving for work I went into her room to say bye and she looked really shifty and hid her own tablet behind her back. I asked what she was doing and she wouldn’t show me, starting to get upset and saying she wasn’t allowed. Eventually she showed me and she was on some drawing app drawing the Pride flag. I asked why she was drawing it and she said it was for A. I questioned her further and she started crying said it was a secret and she couldn’t tell me and A told her not to tell me. Then she just blurted out that she was bi. I asked her what she thought that meant and she said they she liked boys and girls. Told her that was fine she had lots of friends of both sexes but she said no she likes likes them.

I was really shocked, then she said she knew because she had kissed A at school on the lips and cheek and another girl had covered them with her coat. She alternated between crying and getting angry saying you don’t support me.

I was already really late for work so I had to leave but I don’t know what to do. How seriously should I take this. Line this is a child who 100% believes that an elf is getting off the shelf and moving around our house by himself. She believes in Santa and the tooth fairy, an hour before she was playing with teddies with DS.

She begged me not to tell her Dad or A’s mum amd I don’t want to destroy her trust as I’m afraid she won’t talk to me. I know I need to have a proper talk with her but should I talk to the school as well?

Sorry it’s so long appreciate any help

My eldest was about 9 when she started saying she liked girls and then ‘came out’ as bi. I just said ok. The entire class were talking about being gay and bi at the time. Most of them no longer talk that way (3 years later) but my daughter is bi (I’m guessing she’s actually gay but that is difficult for a young girl these days) I’ve no idea if she’s kissed anyone as it’s not really my business. We’ve spoken about consent and safety and she knows sex isn’t something for children but she’ll do what she does whether I approve or know or not, as long as she’s armed with the right info. I was kissing boys at 9, not full on Frenchie just an innocent peck on lips or cheek. There was nothing sexual about it.

You need to reassure her that it’s okay. Give her the talks about consent by her but also sought by her, allow her the space to change her mind or not, about her orientation. Remember that a crush at 9 isn’t usually about sex and it’s better she’s open and allowed to be open than forbidden and doing it all in secret anyway.

we’re in Scotland so she’s in P5, she was 9 in June. I’d probably say she’s youngish and definitely since lockdown i felt that she’d even regressed a bit, just becoming more cling to me and even a bit babyish sometimes. That’s why this has shocked me so much.

She's only a little bit older than my 9 yo (I'm Scottish but live in England). I think most kids regressed a bit during lockdown, I was quite glad my older two got the chance to hold onto childhood for a bit longer but lockdown definitely had the biggest effect on the 9yo, feel like they've missed out of an important growing up year, I remember my older two seemed to suddenly grow in maturity at 8 and were much more aware of the wider world at that age whereas our current 9 yos world shrank when they were 8.

I'd not ban her friendship with A but continue with the clear boundaries around screens and maybe have some other friends round as well.

Tell her of course you support her, and you never want her to be upset and think she can't tell you things again because she can tell you anything because you are her mum and you're there to help and support her no matter what.
This is just kids messing around and repeating stuff they hear from others. I remember being that age and people sneaking off behind school buildings to kiss, and being boyfriend and girlfriend etc. She did get rather worked up though. Maybe this isn't how she actually feels and doesn't know how to get out of the situation so she's taking ut out on you?

Thanks to everyone who took the time to reply it’s been really helpful.

This morning she just got up as normal and didn’t mention anything. I didn’t want to get into anything heavy before school so I just told her that I loved her and always would no matter what but that she was far too young to be kissing anyone boy or girl and that it was not to happen in school or anywhere else again and left it at that.

Wheh she gets home I will have a proper chat with her, I want to dig a bit deeper as to how it came about and what things they may have been watching or searching online. Also to see how much she actually understands. I don't think I will involve the school for now, they've only got a week or so left until the holidays. We are going away over Christmas so hopefully a bit of distance between her and A will be good. I’ll encourage meet-up with other friends when we get back

I would be speaking to the safeguarding lead at school.

9yos kissing is probably a bit of silly experimentation & kids of that age do experiment, but it sounds like A is a fair bit ahead of your dd in developmental terms & also quite dominating. I'd be very concerned about her telling dd to keep it secret, tbh. & getting another child to shield them with a coat...it's a bit performative.

It's quite possible that poor A is being exposed to, & acting out with your dd, some inappropriate media. Or worse, sadly. Behaviour is communication!

Safeguarding is a jigsaw - if it is just 2 young girls having an explorative kiss to see what it feels like, fine, but maybe best they wait for a few years before making a habit of it - but if there are concerns about A, then the school need to be able to form a clear picture.

I'd absolutely be saying all of this if A, your dd, or both, were boys, too. It's not about whether either of them might be gay or bisexual, it's about both the power imbalance in the friendship, & also concern for what might be going on with A's welfare in the background.

My first step would be calling the school. I have a 9yo, she knows about same-sex relationships and sees them as normal, but the language your DD is using would worry me. I also wouldn't let her have any unsupervised access to the iPad or social media.
She can say she's bi if she wants to, but personally I'd be saying "That's something for you to decide when you're older." I would also tell her that she shouldn't be kissing her friends at school.

Whatever will be, will be, but crying and hiding things from you are all worrying signs.

@CorvusPurpureus @MeltedWax

Thank you that’s all good advice. A always seemed to me like very quite shy girl but that has changed in the last year. I do agree about the power imbalance in the friendship , DD seems to be copying the things A wears and does and really seems to look up to her.

I need to speak to her properly again and get more information. Would you tell her mother first? Even just in a you should maybe take a look at what she’s searching for on social media kind of way. I don’t imagine she has any idea.

I think you've been really condescending about this, 'I asked her what she thought that meant' if she had said she was straight you wouldn't have asked her this? 'Told her that was fine she had lots of friends of both sexes but she said no she likes likes them.' I feel like this was really dismissive of you, you knew what she meant I'm sure it was obvious what she was implying you need to make her feel heard.

'How seriously should I take this.' I think if your child is nervous and sobbing to tell you something that's important to them you should take it seriously

'should I talk to the school as well?' Why on earth would you

@trumpisagit

What parental restrictions do you have on her tablet etc? I would be concerned that maybe she is getting ideas from tik tok etc, as she seems too young to fully understand what she is saying. However I think you need to make sure your message to DD is kind, supportive and tell her it doesn't matter to you whether she is straight, bi or gay.

She's not too young to know who she likes and you wouldn't say that if she said she liked a boy.

@User9911

Hmm I’m not sure. I have a 10 year old boy and can’t imagine him behaving in this way but he’s still in the mindset that there is no way he would have a girlfriend and finds kissing disgusting.

I think it’s different for our children compared to how it was for us growing up. Apparently gay/bi/trans is soo much more acceptable in teenagers and almost cool (from what I’ve heard). Back in my day I don’t know of anyone openly gay or bi in school.

That is because back in your day people would be attacked and harassed for openly being gay!

@trumpisagit
She's not too young to know who she likes and you wouldn't say that if she said she liked a boy.

Er, aye I would. She's 9.

I wouldn't allow her on tiktok, I wouldn't allow her unsupervised access to the internet or to be communicating online with other children, it's the equivalent of giving her a phone and I wouldn't give a 9 year old that either.

She's too young, she's too easily influenced hence the copying everything this kid is doing, what she is coming out with isn't normal for a child of her age.
I agree with the PP I would also contact the safeguarding lead as this other child sounds like they are being exposed to stuff they are too young to be exposed to.

Safeguarding is really important when it comes to young children, keeping secrets and kissing at that age is far too young whatever the sex of the child.
As is unsupervised access to the internet.
Parents really need to keep an eye on what their kids are being exposed to online.

[quote SometimesIwalksideways]@trumpisagit
She's not too young to know who she likes and you wouldn't say that if she said she liked a boy.

Er, aye I would. She's 9.[/quote]
Children have innocent crushes at 9, how is this any different?

@Greenfields124

I wouldn't allow her on tiktok, I wouldn't allow her unsupervised access to the internet or to be communicating online with other children, it's the equivalent of giving her a phone and I wouldn't give a 9 year old that either.

She's too young, she's too easily influenced hence the copying everything this kid is doing, what she is coming out with isn't normal for a child of her age.
I agree with the PP I would also contact the safeguarding lead as this other child sounds like they are being exposed to stuff they are too young to be exposed to.

Safeguarding is really important when it comes to young children, keeping secrets and kissing at that age is far too young whatever the sex of the child.
As is unsupervised access to the internet.
Parents really need to keep an eye on what their kids are being exposed to online.

'She's too easily influenced' or maybe she does like girls! 'What she's coming out with isn't appropriate for her age' is liking girls not appropriate for her age?

@ThePlantsitter

You don't need to do anything except maybe reassure your daughter that you're pleased she talked to you. This is just kids messing about with kissing and sexual feelings and really absolutely nothing to worry about. The only think I would say to her is that no one should tell her to keep secrets from you in general just from a safety point of view - but in this case it doesn't sound like that's an issue. Make sure you don't give her a reason to keep them!

This.

Kids at that age are trying things out and working out who they are. Just reassure her that you love her no matter what and she's allowed to decide for herself what/who she likes and that she is allowed to change her mind whenever she wants too. Keep it open and free and easy. The more you stress about this and make it a big deal the more she will.

@LadyMonicaBaddingham

The 'you don't support me' stands out for me; that's quite an abstract phrase for a 9 year old. I would be gently trying to find out if she is hearing these words elsewhere. Hope you can get to the bottom of things 👍

This

@greenlynx

And I’ve meant that she’s too young for kissing and clearly upset about it so it looks like something going on.

This. She's obviously upset and this is not on whether the child she is kissing is male or female. The other girl sounds much more mature (possibly a red flag). She knows she shouldn't be kissing other children at school hence the hiding. Your DD is likely again doing what the other girl says to get her to like her. I would be talking to school.

What she's coming out with isn't appropriate for her age'
No, but kissing other children on the lips is not appropriate for her age.

Sounds like A has unrestricted internet access, always a danger with children, and is learning things she doesn't need to know.

Hope you were able to have a close supportive chat with your DD, Op

@drspouse

What she's coming out with isn't appropriate for her age' No, but kissing other children on the lips is not appropriate for her age.

Perhaps not but I remember being in school and a girl and boy who were 'boyfriend and girlfriend' kissing and I don't see it as any different?

@Masdintle

Sounds like A has unrestricted internet access, always a danger with children, and is learning things she doesn't need to know.

Hope you were able to have a close supportive chat with your DD, Op

Do you think that children don't need to know that it's possible to like girls?

"'She's too easily influenced' or maybe she does like girls! 'What she's coming out with isn't appropriate for her age' is liking girls not appropriate for her age?"

If you read what I said @terranovaa PROPERLY it should clear things up..
If it's too difficult for you to scroll up here it is
"Safeguarding is really important when it comes to young children, keeping secrets and kissing at that age is far too young WHATEVER THE SEX OF THE CHILD."

So no it's nothing to do with the fact 'she might like girls' it's that at 9 she is too young to be kissing other children.
She's a CHILD.🤦🏼‍♀️

@Greenfields124

"'She's too easily influenced' or maybe she does like girls! 'What she's coming out with isn't appropriate for her age' is liking girls not appropriate for her age?"

If you read what I said @terranovaa PROPERLY it should clear things up..
If it's too difficult for you to scroll up here it is
"Safeguarding is really important when it comes to young children, keeping secrets and kissing at that age is far too young WHATEVER THE SEX OF THE CHILD."

So no it's nothing to do with the fact 'she might like girls' it's that at 9 she is too young to be kissing other children.
She's a CHILD.🤦🏼‍♀️

I believe that having crushes and kissing (in the sense of 'pecking') is somewhat normal for children 9 and over though? It was normal when I was in school for some people to like to have 'boyfriends' and sometimes they would 'kiss' which was normally a peck and nothing more inappropriate than that.

It's not the liking girls that's the problem It's the drawing Pride flags in secret, unusual language about mum not being supportive, being told not to tell parents stuff (keeping secrets she's uncomfortable with). It's kissing on the lips at the age of 9 and being told it is a secret.

Just seems shes a bit out of her depth at 9 with such an intense friendship. They are children. They may well be approaching puberty but they are still children.

@Masdintle

It's not the liking girls that's the problem It's the drawing Pride flags in secret, unusual language about mum not being supportive, being told not to tell parents stuff (keeping secrets she's uncomfortable with). It's kissing on the lips at the age of 9 and being told it is a secret.

Just seems shes a bit out of her depth at 9 with such an intense friendship. They are children. They may well be approaching puberty but they are still children.

Why would drawing the pride flag be a problem? What do you think the pride flag represents? It's not sinister. She probably drew it in secret because she was afraid of her mums reaction.

'unusual language about mum not being supportive' is that a joke? Children love to say their parents don't support them.

'being told not to tell parents stuff (keeping secrets she's uncomfortable with)' it isn't an adult who told her to keep it a secret though she kept it a secret presumably because she was scared how her mother would react? You really don't know that she was uncomfortable with it.

'Just seems shes a bit out of her depth at 9 with such an intense friendship' Why are people unable to accept that at 9 you can just as much like girls as you can like boys? Really patronising.

'They are children.' Exactly! They're kids who might like each other and pecked, it's really no more sinister than that.