trans daughter / gender dysporia - how to support without affirming?

[whoshouldItalkto]

For the last year my 13-year-old daughter has been saying she is trans and has gender dysphoria. She says she does not feel her body and voice belong to her, and she should have a male physique.

I want to take a watchful waiting approach and do not want an affirmative approach or for her to socially or medically transition at this stage. However, her distress is real, and she needs support. There seems to be a real gap for this. I have read helpful advice from the Bayswater group and Transgender Trend, but there seem very few professionals that will work with a child without affirming - I was recommended one but they were £200 / hour and made it clear it was a long term commitment! She spoke to a non-specialist counsellor for a while but did not find it useful.

I keep the lines of communication open, talk to her, discuss things, try to build her confidence etc. but really feel she needs more. She's not particularly unhappy a lot of the time (has good friends, we have a good relationship, doing well at school etc.) but the gender dysphoria is definitely bubbling under and can cause her acute distress.

Has anyone got any other ideas of how I can support her, or could suggest a more affordable counselling option that would be suitable? Does anyone acknowledge and support gender dysphoria without the assumption that the treatment is transitioning?

moomoo If she is 13 that is a misinterpretation of the law. There is nothing in law obliging schools to affirm children as the opposite sex (and I have that in writing from ScotGov though would also be applicable in England if useful) and plenty of case law supporting parents rights re affirming without parental permission: www.thetimes.co.uk/article/35e99aa2-b038-11eb-b844-593e41a4a1a5?shareToken=75e519239ebe8b391578ec660817c470

@rogdmum thanks. She is 14 now. The letter would be very useful

Can anyone advise next steps?

Hi. My DD is 11 and says she's now Non binary... she's always been quiet but now is dressing like a boy and very vocal to everyone about her wishes not to be gender identified. I think she's been influenced by a girl in school. At 11 is this peer pressure a phase or could this be for real? I'm really struggling with her

My dd and I are just coming out the other side after a long four years. For me I bought her the clothes she wanted, called her the name she wanted, gently challenged and asked questions. I went through Tribunal to get her into an independent specialist school that has counselling (ASD specific) and Art and Music therapy. She started to learn who she was and what she needed to be happy and to accept that she is a geeky autistic female. I think that was half the problem she didn't fit in her old school and so because she didn't fit she went looking online for others that didn't fit. Now she has found a place where she can be who she is and where she fits in so doesn't need to be somebody else.

moomoo If you DM a an email address to you I’ll forward the letter to you (don’t mind an anonymous email account as I’ll be sending it to you from one 😂)

Help! My Dd has announced she's non binary she's 11... I am trying to be supportive but can't use they them when referring to her. She's dressing like a boy and refuses to wear a bra or vest... I think she's been influenced by a girl in school who she seems be idolise. I've read messages between them and can see she's quite controlling over who my DD hangs out with. Please help, hope its a phase and will pass but, I'm at the end of my tether with her.

Pm'd you @rogdmum

@SHA501 sorry to hear its happening to you too. Lots of advice on this thread. I've been through this before with my eldest dd and did a watchful waiting approach without affirming. Turns out she is autistic. She desisted after 3 or 4 long years. I want to use this approach with my other dd but it seems the school have other ideas!

What are the school saying. My DD school is being quite supportive to me to be fair

Moomoo do you want my email?

Hello. I am posting here in a bit of a flap. My 13 year old DS has told me he is trans. He thinks he is a girl. I don't, tbh, and I think he's probably gay but what do I know?

He doesn't have any mental health issues currently and generally seems happy in school but we live in a very white working class area where there is only one way to be a boy.

I want to get him some counselling as he is very buttoned up when talking about it (I had this discussion with him via WhatsApp as that was his preferred way of talking about it). I just want someone who can draw his feelings out and discuss things with him, rather than someone who is going to say "Yay! Let's get you some blockers and a frock".

Any advice? I am ridiculously anxious about this.

Be a tad careful as the vast majority of counsellors will 'affirm' him as a girl. Due misinterpretation of ethical standards, they are very scared of exploring why our kids are feeling this way. It's taken as fact because no-one can argue with someone's internal sense of self... you have to trust your gut as a caring parent that this doesn't feel right.

There are exploratory counsellors out there but they are difficult to find. Maybe try somewhere like Bayswater Support Group for recommendations.

Mines non binary apparently. Its such a fine line between supporting and not encouraging them with something you think just needs to pass.
Ive been clear with mine that I will not be supporting anything that has long term effects or irreversible, but I do go along with the name, and I try and remember the pronouns.
Ive told them how I feel. Im fully supportive of all the gay stuff, but I have issues with all sorts of things about transgenderism and children and rewriting reality etc. I have told them that I am always on their side, but there are always going to be things we dont agree on and thats ok. If they want to believe this, then they can, but they cant force me to believe something I dont and vice versa.

I guess what I mean is im trying to do damage limitation.

Youre absolutely right that there is not much real support out there. A lot of the GC feminist movement just think its the parents "fault" and that we can just ban the internet for teenagers, or tell them its nonsense and it will thats that. A lot of the trans stuff will be affirmation only. Autistic groups are all mega woke.
I think we just have to find our own way really.
I havent told the school not to affirm, but I have told them i am doing watch and wait.

I think they have to find their own path in lots of ways. Im also quite conscious of not alienating gay kids from their own community either.

Ive also unfollowed lots of my GC stuff online, because it was making me quite anxious to read about it all the time, and I need to feel more balanced if this is gonna happen anyway. I just hope they come out the other side undamaged really, but ive had to let go of some control.
Keep lines of communication open. Push healthy discussion. Push the fact that you dont have to agree on everything but it doesnt mean you dont support. Speak out against the cancel culture stuff, and be careful not to push kids into the arms of glitter families by criticising too much.
Thats all I can think of really

That's it. I know my son is spending too much time online but we've been stuck at home for a year, pretty much. It's not like there's been a wealth of other things for him to do. I also feel like taking his phone away at this stage would be cruel. I think he spends a lot of time pretending to be a girl online though. I feel desperately sad at the thought of him taking hormones or having surgery. I think I probably also need to speak to someone about it, to sort my own head out.

moomoo I'm sorry to hear that about school. I'm dreading the same. Camhs are insisting on it instead of helping with the trauma/depression/asd issue they seem to be clinging on to this as the problem not a symptom of it. I need to find a decent counsellor fast as we've only got a year till he's an adult and out of our hands.

Imo your daughter's experience is common enough and a stage most young women pass through.

So sorry you are going through this OP 💐 🍷 🍫 you sound like a brilliant mum.

I have a DD16 with a dyslexia diagnosis. I am thinking she feels similar to your DD but she won’t talk to us about it. Also thinking maybe autism. She is very tall walks with her arms shoulders sticking out more like a male than a female, wears her hair scraped back in a ponytail at all times, refuses to wear skirts a dress or make up and has some photos of her with a male filter so facial hair looking more masculine etc.

I think in DD’s case she has always been quite immature and got left behind by her peers around year 6. As she is very tall she probably wonders where she fits in when comparing herself with the very petite pouting tanned very short skirt wearing girls at her school. She says most of the people in her year group at school are Chavs, Slags or total weirdos. But her and her best friend (who we think she probably has an obsessive crush on which may or may not be reciprocated) are normal.

I keep telling her I am hear if she wants to talk but she seems so angry, frustrated and almost depressed the majority of the time at home. School have been next to useless on other matters and she won’t hear about seeing a GP or a counsellor.

@oxalisRed would you mind passing on therapist details please? I'm happy to PM you with my username history so you can see I'm legit.

@oxalisRed and @Shizuku please be aware that the 2016 study co-authored by Kristina Olson was the subject of a paper by Schumm and Crawford in 2020. Olson shared her data with them and they re-ran the analysis and came to v different conclusions. Here's the summary:

"Dr Kristina Olson of the Department of Psychology at the University of Seattle was the first scholar to have studied groups of transgender children who were being supported by their parents and to have compared them to a control group of children and to siblings of the same transgender children. Her conclusion was that there were minimal, if any, differences in anxiety, depression, and self-worth among the groups of children: her research has since been cited extensively as having found just that. We reanalyzed her raw data and found that, to the contrary, the transgender children, even when supported by their parents, had significantly lower average scores on anxiety and self-worth. Often, a significantly higher percentage of transgender children, compared to controls, featured preclinical or clinical levels of anxiety. Parental support of transgender children may temporarily reduce levels of poor mental health for some transgender children, but it does not appear to eliminate those problems for all transgender children. Our findings should serve as a warning against accepting research at a surface level, which can lead to acceptance of invalid information and pursuit of ineffective interventions."

There have been two more recent studies on social transition since Olson. Firstly Wong et al 2019 concluded that "There was little evidence that psychosocial well-being varied in relation to gender transition status… only poor peer relations predicted lower psychological well-being… Socially transitioned children appear to experience similar levels of psychosocial challenges as CGV [cisgender gender-variant] children”.

Secondly Sievert et al 2020 concluded that “claims that gender affirmation through transitioning socially is beneficial for children with GD could not be supported”.

Sievert et al is in Clinical Child Psychology and Psychiatry, Wong et al is in Clinical Practice in Pediatrict Psychology, and Schumm is Linacre Quarterly.

My daughter has been non-binary for a while, but she has now told us that she is trans and that she wants to transition. I'm really struggling. She is only 16, she is far too young to make such a decision. I feel so pressurised into affirming, but all my parenting instincts are shouting against it. We have a good relationship and she trusts our input. I know my husband and I need to talk this through with her pretty soon. I'm just so scared of pushing her away. How do I deal with this? I don't want to take her to a councilor that will just affirm her current feelings.

I'm more likely to ignore the opinion of someone who finds this so funny, when parents are in need of support.

Hello. Is this thread still going as it's been on here a while? I was just wondering how your daughter is dealing with the gender dysphoria now? My 12yr old daughter announced last week that she is transgender and is a boy. Wants us to use he/him and a change of name. This came out of the blue for us parents but she has been thinking about it for a while.
I don't want to affirm, but want to support. Her feelings are genuine, but how can she ever be a bit?! It's so heartbreaking. Am lost.

I'm going through the same. My daughter says she's non binary. I'm basically just carrying on as normal and hoping it's just a phase at the moment

Well said inspectorhastings