Really need advice about 11 year old "trans" DS.

[WankmasterBastardDeLaShithead]

DS has been "gender non-conforming" from a very young age (essentially since he could express a preference re: clothes, toys etc). We've tried to just let him do his thing, not deterring him from his preferences, but not making it a big thing either.

Over the last year or so, it's been getting more difficult. He's developed a friendship with a couple of girls who are very "affirmative" of him "being female". They call him "she" and they're all "sisters" to each other. The school have requested meetings with me on several occasions to ask how to support him best in certain situations. Eg they wanted to know if he should join the girls in a girls only confidence-building initiative, and then a few months later wanted to know if he should join the girls in their sex ed group (a space where they could talk on more detail about periods etc). My answer to both of these things was that he shouldn't go with the girls, and that they could perhaps have some extra chat with the boys about inclusivity, and how it's fine to be a boy and express yourself in different ways etc. Long story short, the school didn't really go along with this, and DS ended up having extra info about periods.

The school have now sent an email asking for another meeting as DS has asked to be referred to in school with female pronouns. I asked DS about this last night. Apparently the teacher had said something like "come along now, mister", and he'd said "I'm a miss".

We ended up having a long chat with DS last night, which was a bit fraught at points. He wants us to call him "she" and got really angry/upset when we wanted to actually discuss it (rather than just go along with his wishes). I'm basically very worried that if we go down this route, he will inevitably end up wanting surgery/hormones etc. We spoke about that last night, and he said that yes, that is something he wants one day (he was really upset/fraught about articulating this).

I'm really at a loss. I want to keep the lines of communication open, but I think he sees us as being the bad guys, whereas his friends and teachers are falling over themselves to "affirm" his female gender identity. I'm feeling so frustrated that he can't just wear/play with whatever he wants, without feeling like he has to "be a girl". I also want to find a counsellor for him, but I'm worried that they too will be of the strongly "affirmative" approach. I really just want him to know that he has other options, if you know what I mean?

My youngest told me they wanted to be a boy last week, it’s such a shock no matter how supportive I am of the trans community.

I have found a counsellor for them and I’m paying privately and in my initial contact I said I wanted it to be a space for exploration around gender and identity. I don’t think he feels the same but they use a psychodynamic approach which is less fluffy (I’m a person centred counsellor) and will go for exploration, but this also depends on where he wants to take it.

It’s really tough and I’m definitely in a grief cycle right now which is annoying as he’s not died. But that’s how we process.

Thank you for your reply. I too am a counsellor (person-centered and psychodynamic). I feel quite embarrassed sometimes that I'm not handling this better.

There is a support group here www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/
I would be suspicious of Mermaids. Mermaids would regard your child as having a birth abnormality (the Y chromosome and penis) and ensuing your child knew what to say to get this cosmetically improved. Mermaids are accused of coaching children to say they are suicidal to get the gnrha treatment and so on.

Thanks for that link. That's looks very helpful! And yes, I've looked into Mermaids, and find their approach concerning.

This sounds so challenging, OP. I listened to half of this podcast last night about this issue and find the advice very child-focused and clear. I wonder if you have looked up the organisation Transgender Trend for advice. filia.org.uk/podcasts/2020/11/9/stephanie-davies-arai-transgender-trend-questioning-gender-identity-teaching-in-our-culture-classroom-and-clinic

I'm sorry that the conversation with your child didn't go very well, it sounds like you're having a tough time as a family right now. It definitely sounds like they've been thinking about this in their mind for a while, and potentially the interactions with these female friends has given them to confidence to outwardly question their gender identity. This isn't necessarily a bad thing if in the long run it leads to them being more comfortable with their body.

In the right supportive environment, your child can make an informed choice on what to do, so supporting them at the moment is very important despite what your personal opinions are on the matter (I hope that doesn't sound harsh).

If they have asked to be referred to by female pronouns, do you feel that you could give this a try? See how it feels and see how your kid responds to this? It'll feel weird to you at first after thinking of them as your son for their whole life, but acceptance can go a really long way. You referring to them as 'she/her/female' isn't going to make them suddenly want gender reassignment surgery ASAP, but it will make them feel that you believe them, and that you acknowledge that they are having an internal conflict about their gender. It will give them the feeling that they can safely explore their gender identity and involve you in this process. You can have discussions later if it does come to the point where they'd like to consider full gender reassignment - saying "Yes" to referring to them as she/her right now doesn't erase the need for further conversations in the future when it comes to decisions that need making. And if it doesn't come to that, they can always change their mind about their pronouns at a later point and choose to revert back to being referred to as he/his/male, or perhaps something else like the neutral pronouns they/them/theirs.

Generally, kids have to wait a long while for any kind of surgery and there would be plenty of time for you all to figure out what your kid wants. They're only 11, so the only thing that may be considered in the near future would be puberty blockers, and the effects of this can be reversed by stopping the blockers later if they change their mind and decide that they are actually feeling more comfortable with their current gender.

A lot of parents worry that their transgender children are going through a "phase" and that supporting them will make this phase permanent. I don't believe this to be the case. I believe that supporting them, even if you think it's a phase, helps them to feel safe enough to discuss their gender identity with you further and explore it whilst not feeling rejected by their parents, (the very people in the world who should love and accept them however they identify). I think it's helpful to look at it like this: If you choose not to follow their wishes right now, and it turns out that your child still feels that they identify as female in a few years time, your unwillingness to 'go along with it' for now would cause a huge divide between you and them, and they will feel quite alone and scared. And if they don't still feel that they are female in a few years time? Well, you won't have lost anything by showing them unconditional acceptance.

I hope this makes sense and I hope it doesn't sound like I'm dismissing your worries. Good luck with everything. x

My DS has always been gender non conformist from a very young age he enjoyed playing with "girls" toys and even now as a teenager prefers girls clothes.
I have spent years wondering if he is trans but still no indication from him that he actually wants to be a girl.
Had he expressed this side of himself outside of our family, actually had female friends who accepted him as " one of the girls" at such a young and impressionable age I can see that being different. Whether he is trans or not the influence of the other girls would be huge.
Keep supporting him as he will really needs to feel he can talk to you.
It sounds as if he is set on this, professional counselling is the way forward.
Good luck

The Gender Identity (GIDS) website says “However, we don’t know the full psychological effects of the blocker or whether it alters the course of adolescent brain development”.
A social transition may even be difficult for a child to reverse from.

The Bayswater Support Group is very helpful! Thank you so much for sharing that link.

I think I just have to focus on keeping the lines of communication open just now, and it's helpful to hear that using preferred pronouns doesn't necessarily set us off on an inevitable route to hormones/surgery. I'm very dubious about puberty blockers, but am hoping that as everyone in our family has hit puberty fairly late, we have time on our side!

I'm so sorry, it's so hard.

I think the speed at which schools change gender pronouns is wrong. Putting your son in with girls for talks on periods is gross. He won't have a period do it's pointless. It is also difficult for the girls in the group who won't feel comfortable with s boy in the group. 11 is too early to make life changing decisions. Once a child goes down this route it is very hard for them to turn back. Do you think this group of girls calling him she influenced his behaviour? Has he got any close male friends? He could be doing this to feel.accepted and got in at school.if he does not have male friends. I was a teacher for 25 years before taking very early retirement. I have seen many students transgender. 2 girls who wanted to be male in Year 8 or 9 have had their breasts bound. One of these students in Year 12 told me they were unhappy but it was too late for them to be a girl again. I told them it is never too late to be who you want to be but go to see GP as on hormone blockers and about to go on to make hormones. I have noticed it is often students with not many friends who want to transgender and this always seems to raise their status among peers and they gain more friends. I have seen several boys want to transgender to girls. All unpopular boys with hardly any friends. Almost like if they are not popular with own gender become popular when transgender.

Puberty Blockers are not the harmless pause on puberty some would have you believe. I would be terrified if my child wanted to take them. They are a fantastic way to end up with an adult who is physically immature, sterile and has not been through the normal cognitive development that happens in puberty.

I would be very careful about your son's internet use. I would also complain to the school about inappropriately have him attend a talk on periods.

My personal feeling is that we have a really long way to go in understanding the best way to support children like your DS. We know from some trans adults that the way we used to manage these situations (rigidly affirming their sex over their gender identity) was for some people the wrong way to go about things, and there were horrible cases of teens’ mental health being affected negatively. Equally it’s early days with so-called ‘puberty blockers’ and we don’t yet understand the long-term impact.
All you can do as a parent is to try to stay calm and support the anxiety, whilst constantly weighing up the pros and cons. If DS is consistent and passionate about changing pronouns I would personally consider this as long as he (she??) is clear that it would be absolutely fine to change back again at any time. This doesn’t sound like a short term phase but potentially something that could last a long time, and the impact of not changing pronouns could potentially have a bigger negative impact than changing them. Puberty blockers is a much bigger deal but I don’t think I’d completely rule them out as they could end up being the lesser of two evils if he ends up profoundly distressed by puberty changes.
This is really, really hard. All you can do for now is keep channels of communication open and really listen to what he’s saying.

Ds2 has autism/Asperger's. He is now 18 and very definitely heterosexual (he says this himself) He likes boy stereotypical things too...football, politics, computer games. But when he was younger he really got on well with his twin sister and liked to hang out with girls. His sister called him a girl's name. He worked out this made him more popular than if he hung out with the boys who found him annoying, bad at games etc, uncool. He had a flamboyant side too, he liked dressing up in clo aks and crowns, pirate outfits. I think he loved the attention.

This is all a roundabout way of saying that perhaps your son might have autism, and this is coming out in a desire to be part of a safe group, to have a "role" where he is sure of attention. Also a certain fixation with things he is sure of.
It is not necessarily the case that he recognises why he wants to be a girl but there may be all sorts of reasons to do with feeling odd and alien that are to do with autism. And feeling and being reinforced in the girl role now feels the only safe logical position.

Puberty blockers won't help they will probablymake things worse in terms of not giving him the confidence to grow up as a boy/man, whether gay or heterosexual.

DS is doing incredibly well btw, no mental health issues, he has matured remarkably now at uni. Still gets on with girls though!

This must be really difficult. I agree with seeking advice on how to handle this. I don't really approve of giving any kind of puberty blocking drugs to children.

For D's the testosterone that came around 12/13 onwards went on to make him calmer more confident, more able to assess situations, deal with peers. when he was 11 he was a bit of a mess mentally, all over the place anxious insecure, very fixed and resistant to change.
Puberty can be a rocky stage but the brain benefits from it long term if you let it happen naturally and keep wise counsel in background.

I was horrified to see that the default position for so many counsellors is to explore transing, rather than remind kids that being uncomfortable in your body and yourself with your peers for that matter is a normal part of teenage range of emotions, as is anxiety feelings of rejection. It is not a green light to assume that transition is going to mAgicly cure these emotions, uncomfortable feelings. And some teens are autistic or bullied, this precedes their desire to be a "new"gender.

The thing is, boys can like pink and babies and pets and glittery things and dressing up, and disco balls and prancing around in crowns, and still be boys. They can like chatting in groups reading drawing grooming their hair. They don't have to be girls to do these things. Why on earth is your son feeling the pressure to be she?is he being ibullief for not doing boy stuff?what is boy stuff for that matter? Why is the school making him think there is boy stuff and girl stuff! There is stuff, and the people you are friends with.

the only thing that may be considered in the near future would be puberty blockers, and the effects of this can be reversed by stopping the blockers later
This advice is not what the NHS says now. The effects of puberty blockers are not known to be fully reversible.

Given that the overwhelming majority of children desist from trans ideals once they have gone through puberty then I'd be extremely cautious of any exposure to any affirmation-only pathway. You may have seen the very interesting article about Rupert Everett and how he described identifying as a girl for much of his youth, and spoke of his relief that he didn't end up on a transition pathway.

Can you do anything to limit the exposure he has to the trans influences? And try and find an outlet/hobby/any distraction to prevent self absorbed thoughts on gender identity?

Cooking classes
Dance (street dance)
Drama
Art Classes

places he can be creative without Any stereotyping and realise it makes no difference if you are male or female in those activities.

Is your DS due to go to secondary school next September? And with these girls? If so, it might be worth reconsidering as I have a strong feeling you believe the girls are influencing him. It's just a game for them, they're not going through it like your DS. I really disagree with the school including your son on the periods talk, they are for girls to discuss their bodily functions without the potential embarrassment of having boys present. I also noted the school didn't comply with your wishes which is well out of order, you're his parent, not them. I loved the idea from some posters about encouraging your DS to get involved in activities where he can express himself without having to gender conform. Wishing you all the very best @WankmasterBastardDeLaShithead

Great advice VashtaNerada.

How are you doing OP?