Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Legal matters

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you have any legal concerns we suggest you consult a solicitor.

Original poster

ex boyfriend tried to take 9 week old baby last night is that legal?

38 replies

BeverleyJane · 23/02/2010 10:26

My ex says he has equal rights which entitles him to take our son whenever and wherever he pleases. I take the baby for visits monday wednesday and saturdays, it is my brothers birthday so we had the visit at my mums so he could see baby too. My ex wanted to take the baby to his for an hour, so far I havent felt comfortable letting him have the baby alone and Im breastfeeding so I said no but had not asked him to leave. a little later he just stood up and walked out with the baby. I got to the front dooir first so he went to the kitchen and out the back door but couldnt get the gate open so after waiting in the garden agreed to come in as it was cold an icy and baby was not in a snowsuit. We had to get the police out as he would not give baby back and even tried telling the officer he wouldnt let go of baby as he doesnt trust me and thinks I may hurt the baby. I dont know what to do

OP posts:
GypsyMoth · 23/02/2010 10:28

solicitors offer a free first half hour session,get legal advice

is he on birth certificate?

JollyPirate · 23/02/2010 10:33

Hi there, don't want to let this go unanswered. Is his name on the birth certificate?
If not then he has no rights. If he IS on the birth certificate then this entitles him to have equal say in matters relating to the baby. It does not entitle him to act like an arse and try to remove the baby when he knows that your DS is still being breastfed. What was he planning to do at feed time I wonder?
It does not entitle him to take your DS whenever and wherever he pleases.

Am sure someone more knowledgable than me will be along.

ShinyAndNew · 23/02/2010 10:33

Solicitors asap. If he is saying things like that to police he will possibly make a similar report to SS?

After that go to court to get proper visiting arrangements set up. BUt on the whole, yes he is right. If he is on the BC he has a right to see the baby alone in his own home. There is not much you can do about that.

JollyPirate · 23/02/2010 10:33

Oh and would echo getting some legal advice.

Sassa · 23/02/2010 10:34

Hi

If his name is on the birth certificate he has parental responsibility. HOWEVER, that does not entitle him to do what he did. It is totally unreasonable to take the 9wk old baby out in the cold for an hour without any prior discussion or agreement.

My advice - sit down with him and agree a contact scehdule that you can both stick to. Try to explain how taking the child like that at that time of night is not fair on the child.

Hopefully, you can agree something and work it out. If not, try mediation or contact your solicitor.

Harjit Sarang

JollyPirate · 23/02/2010 10:36

Also try talking to your HV (if she is the supportive kind). She should be able to support the fact that you are caring for your baby well. Might even be worth talking to social services and getting some advice from them.

Original poster
BeverleyJane · 23/02/2010 10:41

thanks. He is on birth certificate. Ive tried to make this work I did arrange for visits monday, wednesdays and saturdays and I thought it was going well but now I just cant trust him. He has family in Germany and im worried he'll try and run off with our son. I feel like he's crossed a line and will just keep trying to bully me into things and just react this way when he doesnt get what he wants.

OP posts:
Sassa · 23/02/2010 10:41

Actually I would think twice about getting SS involved at this stage. Be careful what you ask for! Get a copy of the police report and try to talk to him. If he is not 'reasonble' tell him to go away until contact is agreed by way of agreement or court order. You need peace at this stage and the baby needs Mommy to be fit and stress free. You are not denying him contact you are just encouraging him to stop being silly and selfish. I hope the police warned him to stay away if he was upseting you. If he comes around again and is unreasonable, call the police and ask them to warn him to keep away.

Best regards

Harjit

ilovesprouts · 23/02/2010 10:43

go to cab for advice asap

Sassa · 23/02/2010 10:44

threat of taking baby abroad - keep passport with you at all time is you already have one that is. If child goes missing alert police immediately and they will issue a PORT ALERT stopping babies removal out of the country. Him taking the child abroad without your consent is Child Abduction, it is a crime. Don't worry, just keep your wits about you.

Original poster
BeverleyJane · 23/02/2010 10:47

the policeman didnt know what the rules were, he wasnt even sure if he could stop my ex taking the baby. But he did say that I can call the polie any time. I wish I knew what my ex is doing now as last night he told me to get a lawyer, that he'd be talking to a solicitor and social services and told my mother he might go for full custody.

OP posts:
Lymond · 23/02/2010 10:47

If you haven't applied for a passport for your baby already then please do so now (so that he can't).

Got to a solicitor, to arrange Child Support payments and access.

GypsyMoth · 23/02/2010 10:50

leave him to take you to court....in meantime,let him have supervised contact. keep to the schedule you arranged and he agreed to

contact should be little and often at this age

is there someone you trust who can supervise?

Original poster
BeverleyJane · 23/02/2010 10:50

my mum suggested I get baby a passport in case my ex tries to get him one. my ex said he asked a solicitor an they said as the father he can take baby to germany as long as he dont stay more than a month and thats perfectly legal, is this true?

OP posts:
GypsyMoth · 23/02/2010 10:51

28 days i believe

but not at this stage!

Original poster
BeverleyJane · 23/02/2010 10:52

i cant even trust him with supervised contact, my mum, stepdad and I were all in the house when he tried to take baby.

OP posts:
JollyPirate · 23/02/2010 10:56

I think the fact that the policeman said you coukd call them anytime suggests that they knew he was being an arse. It will be noted by them anyway and likelihood is that your HV will get a copy and so will social services (don't panic it's just standard procedure for them to do this). SS are not likely to do anything except file it but your HV might make contact to see if she can help. This could be some way off though as it takes up to 4 weeks for them to filter through. If a report is made it will be a domestic violence one with you as victim and him as perpetrator because trying to remove the baby in the way he did IS abusive to both you and your son.

sungirltan · 23/02/2010 10:56

sigh.

right ok. personally i would cease contact for now and find a solicitor. if you in receipt of benefits you should be able to get legal aid.

if your exdp goes to a solicitor don't be scared - they will have to help the two of you work out a contact agreement which, if you have reasonable grounds to suspect he may abduct the child can be at a contact centre and be what is called 'supervised contact'.

re parental responsibilty look here for definition and also here for residence/contact court order which might be what you end up with if this situation escaltes.

in the meantime if he is rational and you could talk to him over the phone the bf might be a really useful tool in keeping his ocntact with ds supervised (you can explain that you need to be with ds at all time until 6 months because of the nature of bf) - this could buy you a few months iyswim then when ds is more than 6 months stituation might have improved in which case you might feel comfortable in letting exdp have him sometimes - sorry bit rambly

will check thread later - hope that was helpful

KwanYin · 23/02/2010 10:59

Could you just put yourself in his shoes for a minute? How would you feel to be told you couldn't be trusted to look after your own baby for an hour?

I bet he's wondering why the hell it should be up to you and only you to call the shots about when he can see his own child.

And in a way by saying he doesn't trust you and thinks you may hurt the baby, he's just reflecting back to you the exact same thing that you are saying about him.

If it was going so well, why don't you sit down with him and make a plan about how things are going to work long term that you are both happy with. He may feel more reassured then.

PureAsTheColdDrivenSnow · 23/02/2010 11:03

don't know if anybody else has suggested this, but does your baby have a passport?

It's worth applying for one, and keeping it somewhere safe, then your ex won't be able to apply for one. Keep the birth cert somewhere safe too.

get legal advice now.

ShauntheSheep · 23/02/2010 11:05

KwanYin she is brestfeeding a small baby and as such needs to be around for when the baby is hungry. In addition to this he has shown that he is NOT being responsible by taking hte baby out into the cold without appropriate clothing because HE wants to.

This isnt about HIM or indeed abotu the OP this is about what is best for a small baby and what is best for this child is to be near the person that is providing his food.

beautifulgirls · 23/02/2010 11:05

Solicitor now.....the sooner you act the sooner this can get sorted.

Sassa · 23/02/2010 11:07

To clarify, if he does not have a RESIDENCE ORDER, he can not take the child without your consent or it is child abduction. Physically he can try but he will be breaking the law.

I like your thinking KwanYin but only mother knows what type of person she is dealing with and dare I say anyone who tries to take a baby out of the house at night for an hour in the cold when mother is distressed is not being very sensible.

Harjit Sarang

Original poster
BeverleyJane · 23/02/2010 11:09

Kwan thats exactly what he says but standing out in the cold holding the baby with one arm and pointing and shouting at my stepdad whilst trying to take the baby does not build my confidence. while I was pregnant the police were called out to his house twice as he was beating his brother and smashed a glass door, a few days after babys birth he was shouting at him to shut up when he was crying so hes not entirely stable. He stopped taking his anti depressants and behaving this way, 'reflecting back to me' as you say is not only childish but is not in the best interests of our breastfed baby its just to hurt me. the baby is not a weapon and I have NEVER stopped him from seeing the baby apart from saying I dont want him to stay overnight at my flat.

OP posts:
ilovemydogandmrobama · 23/02/2010 11:13

He can't just take the baby when he wants. He is treating the baby like a possession, and not thinking about what's best for the baby. The fact that he would try and assert his 'rights' so physically is of deep concern.

However, the problem is that since contact is not defined, then it makes the issue difficult.

What he doesn't seem to understand is that if he won't keep to the informal arrangement, which is very fair, him seeing the baby 3 times a week, then it will need to be a court order. This actually may be beneficial for you to have contact defined, as there are some very serious consequences if he takes the baby, without your agreement, outside the defined contact arrangements.

A contact center would be ideal as you would be able to be in a room close by, and could feed if needed.