My employer are threatening legal because I'm refusing to work my notice. How screwed am I?

[confusedlady10]

I know I am being a CF but have no choice, so this is NOT about morals and more about where I stand legally.

I've worked for my job for over 8 years (dead end call centre job) but leaving in a week as I got an offer elsewhere. The notice period is 3 months and didn't realise when I told my new employer because I didn't check my contract. Regardless 3 months notice for an entry level poor paid job is excessive, so it wouldn't have made much difference had I been aware as my new employer need me to start ASAP and wouldn't wait 3 months. I took the risk of my employer suing me as they are a multi-billion pound bank that can easily afford to replace me (and are actively hiring now anyway).

I've accrued 100 hours of holiday, and tried to use it up by booking on our work app but every date got declined due to them being short staffed. My manager called me and said they’d try and get around me leaving early by seeing if they can use my holiday or take it out of my final pay. However they said that after speaking to HR if they can’t then I’ll have to work my notice otherwise HR may go down the legal route and refuse to give me my p45 in order to start my new job. I emailed my manager later to tell them I’ve checked ACAS (after having second thoughts) which says they cannot legally use my holiday pay or pay to offset me breaking my contract and would have to sue me instead which I would have to accept them doing as I really need the money.

They haven’t replied so shall see what they say tomorrow (and I still have time to edit my message as it's out of hours and they haven't read it yet). Can HR legally refuse to give me my p45 for this or take my pay from me or refuse to pay me my owed holiday? And if they do take me to court which I cannot afford what is the likely-hood of me messing up my new job and references and do I have any legal help? I’m scared but don’t have a choice as my new job cannot wait 3 months for me to start so have no choice and only got my contract now to give my employer notice.

Many thanks!

Well if people read contracts and believed them how much less pressure would that place on courts?

And we wonder why Britain is so broken... this attitude stinks.

We have people leave without proper notice a few times a year and if a manager asks what we can do I always say nothing, we can’t go to the house and drag them into work!

@Elektra1

Your "slightly different case" is "slightly different" it massively different.
Stealing company property is massively different then not working your notice.

As I said in my post, the employee had also not worked his notice. That wasn’t the main issue, but it was in the claim. And he lost on that too.

The more general point is that employers absolutely do sue former employees.

So how much “damages” do the courts award against a low paid worker who hasn’t worked their 3 months notice?

Years ago the company I work for made a big deal of taking a senior manager to court who hadn’t worked their 3 month notice - they’ve never done it again as although it was initially a deterrent/warning to others it cost them way too much time and money.

Surely most people are paid monthly irrespective of their notice period.

No.

I’ve set out my thoughts on the measure of damages in an earlier post

@ChillBarrog @MrsEMR so people with a 3 month notice period are only paid every 3 months?
I run payroll and that would result in lost NI allowances.

No. Wtf?

@ChillBarrog the poster I quoted said “Unless you are in a senior position I would expect your notice period to align with your salary period. So if you’re paid monthly. Then your notice period is 1 month.”

This implies anyone paid monthly has a 1 month period whereas I know lots of people with 3 months notice periods who are still paid monthly.

I responded to "surely most people are paid monthly".
No. Many people are not paid monthly.

But the point I was making is that the payment frequency does not bear any relationship to the notice period.

Plus without wanting to be sent to pedants corner I said most are paid monthly. Which does not exclude many not being.

They haven't got a leg to stand on trying to enforce 3 months notice. For an entry level job that period is excessive and is likely to be considered so by an employment tribunal if it ever got that far.
Tbh you have a significant amount of holiday-which you should be able to use before leaving.. unless your contract states that any unused holiday will be taken as pay instead?
Personally I'd call their bluff.. I think they are trying to intimidate you into staying for 3 months. It they attempt to sue you it'll cost them a LOT more than 2 months worth of your salary.

Jeez - really ?

I initially replied to someone who claimed references were not mandatory and was pointed to as a factual source, I gave an example where they were so the "factual source" was actually wrong - that is all. The rest of your comments are irrelevant as I never mentioned them, even when I pointed this out you still managed to mention things which I didn't.

I do wonder at some who are unable to actually engage in conversation, it any is actually needed, as opposed to simply trying to make an - often irrelevant - point but then having watched this forum for years I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

I’m not asking for your thoughts on the measure of damages, I’m asking how much the courts actually fined or penalised the minimum wage defendant?

You say numerous employers take the employees to court so you must have some figures/percentages?

Civil courts award damages, not fines or penalties. The sum of damages is the loss occasioned to the employer. As set out in my earlier post.

Nonsense. You can have two employments overlapping if you are on holiday with the Er you are leaving and start with the new Er whilst on that holiday. I've done it.
If that were the case how do people ever have two jobs at the same time?
Ex chartered CIPD.

Yes but if the old employer found out that you had started a new job whilst "on holiday" they could terminate your employment for gross misconduct. So it would be extremely foolish to do it without express consent from the first employer. Whilst you remain employed you are not supposed to work another job during the hours you are contracted to work for another employer.

Surely this thread has run its course. There is a lot of bickering going on.

Those of us who are lawyers have informed the OP of her position. There are lots of people who don't really know but who make assertions and claim they are fact just because they've heard that it once happened that way to a colleague. It's just misleading to the OP and others who might be reading the thread to get information for themselves.

so nothing then in the case of the OP

the employer has to prove hiring a temp to do the job cost them extra or training a new employee cost extra - neither of which is going to be worth pursuing for a call centre job

I already covered this in a previous post