Relationship Breakup and Child Custody - help needed

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DBrother and his gf have been together around 10yrs and have 2 children together (7 and 8 years old). Not married.

Living together in a house purchased outright as tenants in common.

Relationship has broken down and they need to go their separate ways (urgently as relationshiphas got very toxic). Neither work and neither can afford to buy somewhere else with the money they would get from the sale of the house.

Gf now wants to take the children back to her home town 3+ hours away. Both parents are heavily involved and would want 50/50 custody. Can gof just up and leave with the children? DB would not be able to afford to move to her home town and contact would be very difficult (can't afford travel and hotels etc to visit)

DB is disabled and cannot deal with these issues on his own so I'm going to have to try to take him to see a solicitor ASAP (tricky with my schedule and we don't live close). He's worried about going to court as he thinks the court could order that gf and dc could stay in the house until the dc are 18 and he will have no money as the house can't be sold until then. Is this true?

I know we really really need to see a solicitor ASAP and I'm working on it but grateful for any advice/pointers in the meantime

Just seen the house is tenants in common well yes it is both of their house

is she moving to her parents/family are they stable and stepping up care? I assume given she is letting go of the house she is moving in with them

The family are in council flats so not sure what the rules are around gf and children moving in with them. Money wise they are also in benefits so not sure if they have enough to support her (they may do, i just don't know). I believe if they sell the house and have a big chunk of money in the bank that both DB and GF will lose their benefits?

Whose family?

Both families contributed equal amounts so the tenants in common is 50/50

Are social services involved because (a) they probably should be and (b) I imagine going to court to stop her moving will make them involved

So with no benefits he was living in a house bills paid by gf and food etc so yes she was supporting him before wanting to leave..If he loved his children so much he should have put pride away and also made his claims to benefit them and afford his actual petrol. Not rocket science sell house,half money if he did put some into it and they rent

I believe SS have been contacted recently so will be involved soon but have yet to make initial contact with DN and GF.

They have been poor (cash poor) but have always provided for the kids and kept them clothed, fed, housed,in school, loved etc so SS not been needed before. The DC seem kids often and do get taken for days out etc.

However I think the relationship has now become so bad that it is impacting the children so we need to get this sorted ASAP.

That is good social services need to be involved

So the issue is they can live together in which case either the house gets sold and split or she does move to where she has support or he does?

can I be honest I am not sure there is a quick fix to this

Yes I think she paid for bills but didn't pay for his food. They only have 1 car so the family relief on that 1 car but he had no money to maintain it or petrol.

Now DB is on benefits he is paying for 100% of bills. Not sure how food is split these days.

Yes I've said he'll just have to rent with the cash from the house but I'm not sure how long it will last for.

I completely agree he should have stepped up earlier and at the eve of the day he needs to start helping himself. It wasn't pride though it was deep depression and anxiety.

It would probably be a good start for him to make an appointment with citizens advice, GP/talking therapies, and look into eligibility for council housing.

If there is no domestic abuse then the step before court is mediation which again may help.

If he wants 50/50 and is prepared to go to court to get it then he will need to demonstrate he can meet his own and the children’s needs e.g. housing health finances etc.

Once the house is sold he could pay six months rent up front and have that time to sort himself out with appropriate job/benefits.

As far as I am aware the family courts don’t make orders about housing, they just want to know the children will be appropriately housed. So if he went to court without adequate housing, they won’t order 50/50 as it’s not practically possible. I think the thing you’re talking about is an occupation order which is to do with divorce, not child arrangements.

I agree there is no quick fix and I think whatever happens it's going to be a really difficult situation.

Ideal would be for them live in the same area as each other but I just can't see how that will work

Yes I think it may be an occupation order. Family members have put it in his head that it is what will happen but I had a feeling it wasn't the case in these scenarios.

That is helpful thank you.

it’s a specific issue order he would have to apply for, if you speak to a solicitor you can usually get 30 minutes free and they may give you some advice, but basically because he’s on benefits, he should be able to make an application to the court without paying a fee and get a hearing date. After this there would probably be further proceedings to thrash out a child arrangements order.

If you think about this in terms of the kids welfare, having parents with severe mental health issues is a serious adverse childhood event. I guess you have to think about that long and hard. Are they both equally unwell? Would being near family help keep her more stable? Would he really be able to cope with them?
if there’s a chance he is trying to hold onto the kids for 50% of the time so that he holds onto his housing that’s not about their best interests.

Heartbreaking situation I can imagine but the kids must come first whatever he decides to do here
highly unlikely he will get given social housing, also if he has a lump sum from the sale of a house he won’t get benefits until he has spent most of it. If he could get himself a small flat he could claim again
sorry, v tough situation:(

@KurtShirty thank you for the advice.

I genuinely believe that it wouldn't be in the children's best interests to stop the relationship with either parent. Ideal scenario would be they both live locally to each other with frequent contact but I just don't know how that's feasible.

The house is probably one of the cheapest in the country so by the time you split that in half I really don't think either will be able to buy anything but I will have a look.

I think he'll probably need to accept that contact will have to be limited due to practicalities but worried what he may do to himself if he loses the house and the children.

It's an all round shit situation.

He could also go to court to have the children returned to his care if she moves them without his consent.

He needs to apply to the court asap on a C100 form, if he’s low income the fee may be waived. The court will then get a welfare report and sort it out based on what’s in the children’s best interests.

Thank you @saltandvinegarchipsticks that's the what i want at the end of the day, whatever is in the children's best interests and I honestly don't know what that is right now.

If social services are involved (as they should be) I think this is going to be a tricky one because honestly staying with either parent without support and that includes proper family support doesn’t sound good.

i think you need to have a long hard chat with your brother about exactly what he wants and what he can cope with - particularly around the house they own 50/50 because if she stays there is every likelihood that it will need to be sold and split as well and how that will affect things.

I agree ideally both staying local and having contact would be great like you I am not sure that works

in this instance I think social services rather than court to make a plan

You said:

She previously struggled to look after the kids which is why DB did all the parenting. However she has started to step up over the last few weeks

So it sounds like DB has been the somewhat more hands-on parent? I'd normally say if there's going to be a distance then probably best to be with mum for more of the time, but possibly not the case here

It does seem a huge shame to have to sell the no-mortgage house and all go into renting.

Did you say DB could live with family? Are the family near his current house?

Is there an option he could do that, and GF and kids stay in the house (at least for now / until kids grown), on the understanding that he still owns half the house? Then he could still see the kids regularly - perhaps even at the house when GF is out

Plenty of mothers have their kids 100% of the time and never worked.

Your brother needs to fight tooth and nail for 50/50 because that level of custody will mean he can get CB for at least one of the kids, and then he becomes more eligible for social housing support. Especially as he is disabled.

That way, even if they keep the house, he will have a home where he can have them. I'd see a solicitor about stopping her moving away.

Yeah the mum could just 'live in a van'

FFS

OP is there an assumption the children live with their mother, is the father able to take the care of the children?

Kindly, this is not your problem to solve. DB needs to start acting like an adult and take responsibility for his own situation, probably starting with getting legal advice if he wants shared custody/access to his children.

You say its owned tenants in common?

What percentages?

I have a feeling that she cant be 'given a house' that isnt hers completely.

He really needs a solicitor and he does need to go to court.

Amazed at some of the responses here about a disabled parent as if he wouldnt be able to care for his own children, the responses would never be like that about a disabled mum who needs a support to care for her children. it wouldnt be assumed that the father just ups and takes the children due to her disability.

How did they buy a house outright without then working?

I think mediation is a really good idea. If they can agree some common aims e.g. both parents end up living near kids.

They will both have to compromise though.

Is it more important to them both to have a clean break and sell the house - which would probably mean using the house money on rent until it's gone and then both rely on council housing?

Or do they want to try and keep the house - for stability for the kids and because they'll then both part-own an asset - but this will mean one of them living in non-ideal accommodation (with family? room in rented house?) as there's not enough money for two proper houses.

From your brother's point of view, I totally understand him saying he doesn't want her to move his kids 3 hours away, but if he also wants her to sell the house, how does he think she should house herself and the kids? So may require a big compromise on his part if he wants her to stay nearby.

Good luck to them all