Parents disagreeing on medical procedure

[gertrudemortimer]

Hi my ds (7) had two urology operations when he was a baby/toddler to fix a birth defect. Due to covid it took a while to get the post op appt where they check everything is functioning okay. We eventually got that appt and we both attended but ds dad left half way through to go to work so he didn't speak to the consultant at the end. The consultant said my ds needs a procedure as the tests done on the appt indicate a blockage and it is causing urine retention which was identified by numerous bladder scans, I told dad the outcome and he was fine with it. Ds was put on the waiting list for the procedure and I got the date through last week, it's been a two year wait.

Ds dad is now very anti-nhs and he has requested the consultants details and is saying he doesn't want ds to have the procedure. Where do I stand here, what should I do? Should I be telling the consultant that the other parent objects to it?

What does “anti NHS” mean?
Does he prefer (and can afford) to use Private medical services or is he some anti medical conspiracy nut?

@Hoppinggreen unfortunately I think it's the former! He feels like they make things worse and avoids it. He's recently got together and had a baby with a life coach, he has completely changed his views on everything and seems to be going a bit off grid/anti establishment etc.

Latter even! Sorry

Unless he specifically takes you and the hospital to court. As you have parental responsibility consent form only needs one parents signature :)

God, what a twat.

I have signed many consent forms for Dc, none asked for both parents’ signatures.

There will be proper legal advice but I would keep quiet about it til done and let him take me to court. But that is probably bad practice.

@skinnytobe I've read that but then I read on the nhs website they want all people with parental rights to agree for procedures that aren't life threatening and usually withhold treatment until all parties agree.

I do think he will ring them, he told me he's thinking about how to word it before he talks to them. If he asks for the appt to be cancelled they will do that won't they because they only need one parent to say either way?

Have you posted about this twat before?
I would just proceed until he stops you

@TakenRoot I know I feel like just not acknowledging his disagreement but then a part of me is terrified if anything goes wrong or ds is really upset he will just blame me to him! I can't believe he disagrees with it. I'm angry about how long they've left him for when he's retaining urine. It isn't a small amount he retains either!

@Hoppinggreen yes I posted in the separation section about it. 'Ex dp is driving me insane'. Everything used to be so simple and now he disagrees about such basic things.

I had a 9 day olds baby with a blockage and he developed a uromoma, was resuscitated, had one op to save his life, and as after 5 weeks, he could have a special scan to see if there was function in his 'new moon' shaped left lidney. They decided to do the op. An open pyloplasty to restructure it.

It di work but not easy for the surgeon but- he was a newborn.

I am just guessing that this is what he needs abd that it will be keyhole surgery. My boy is now a big strong 20! Looks like Action Man with his scars. I am sure he needs this. Maybe show this to your husband. My baby would have died without this intervention. Best wishes

Ps. My baby didn't have keyhole surgeries. They were both open. I think things have moved on now. ☘️

I’d go and see a solicitor. I’d want to know how far I can ignore his requests and what would happen if he doesn’t give his approval.

id involve your ds GP and/or consultant to ask them to detail what would be tte consequences of not having the surgery. And that the father is now ‘against’ the procedure. Ask them if you could have that in writing.

What is on the line here is the health of a 9yo.

Re cancelling. The dad could only do 5hat if he knows about it. I’m assuming you are the one who gets tte letters?

Sorry, 7yo….

I am not going to advise you whether or not to tell the consultant about your Ex's objections. All I will say is that it is highly unlikely that the hospital will go ahead with the surgery, in the knowledge that one person with parental responsibility objects. While it is true that they only need consent from one person with PR, they also have to weigh the views of everyone with PR equally (other than in emergency situations).

In this situation, if your Ex cannot be talked round, the hospital will seek court guidance.

@LesLavandes I'm sorry that sounds very traumatic! Luckily it isn't anything as severe as that. My ds was born with hypospadias and chordee, he had an operation as a baby which went wrong and then a repair operation as a toddler which seemed fine but after post op consultation they said he's retaining urine due to a blockage. The reason for the blockage is unknown which is why we have this procedure coming up. They're going to use a camera and find the cause of the blockage and potentially dilate the urethra if it's from scar tissue (what they suspect it's from), it should be straight forward!

My ds had surgery at 20 months with just my signature..

If your ex is planning on preventing your son from accessing essential medical care I would encourage you to contact a family solicitor and social services for further guidance

@HotPringles I've told ds dad the appt date and consultants name. I didn't think I had a choice to be honest and morally I can't take him for this without him knowing. His biggest objection is ds getting put to sleep, he thinks he's going to have serious complications from it. I'm nervous about it too of course but I've got more trust in the doctors than he does.

@MissLucyEyelesbarrow yes that is what I think they will do too. Do I also have a responsibility to inform them or is it all on ex? I told him in June the procedure will be some time in the summer holidays (hospital rang to confirm we can do any date in July/august) and he objected then. I left it alone and hoped he'd be okay when the appt was made.

Assuming that the father shares PR with you, only one parent with PR is required to consent. However if the non-consenting parent is actively opposing a medically necessary operation then that's for the hospital to sort out.

If it's in your child's best interests to have the procedure the hospital will decide whether they feel confident to proceed on the basis of your consent, notwithstanding father's opposition. In my experience this can, depending on the trust, depend how much of a fuss the oppositional parent was making.

Rather than the uncertainty of the father throwing a spanner in the works at the last minute when you and child are prepared for surgery, I suggest you take control of the situation by contacting your child's consultant (via their secretary/admin team) to inform them that (1) you consent to the procedure.(2) Child's father is telling you that he has concerns (3) if NHS trust requires both parents to sign consent it's unlikely that this will be forthcoming from the father (4) in light of the above please could they discuss with you how matters will proceed given the need for your child's health to be the paramount concern.

What should then happen is that the hospital trust will seek legal advice. The potential outcomes are that the hospital rethink the treatment plan and decide not to operate, decide to operate now regardless of the father's stance, or they make an application to court for a judge decide that treatment should proceed (this last option provides hospital and medics with protection against complaints/legal action instigated by the father.)

You don't need to pay for a lawyer at this stage - unless you choose to. The hospital would be the applicant in any legal proceedings.

My professional background is in the medical consent side, so I'm afraid I don't know if you have any legal obligation to update your Ex, as co-parent, about the procedure (though I see you have already told him some details).

I don't believe you have any legal obligation actively to inform the hospital of his objections, though obviously you should not deny them if asked. However, I think you should consider trying to arrange an opportunity for your Ex to talk through his fears, which are not uncommon, with the doctors. A planned (i.e. non-emergency) general anaesthetic on a healthy child is incredibly safe, but lots of parents are nervous about them, and the hospital should be able to arrange for you to talk to an anaesthetist, for reassurance.

I realise this is putting a burden on you, to try to address your Ex's fears, but it would be a lot less hassle than going to court for consent.

PS excellent advice from @JennyMule

Do what you need to do (legally) for your sons well being and health.
Worry about tantrums from the ex later

I haven't seen DD17's dad for years (DV). Even when we saw him regularly no medical practitioner ever asked whether I had the father's permission for anything (I didn't). Just do it. No need to even tell him afterwards unless you feel like it.

@Igmum I understand that but ds sees his dad every week and it's nearly 50:50 care and responsibility, his dad is very involved in every aspect of his life so it's harder to carry on regardless. As much as I'd like to just dismiss his comments on this issue I need to know that I can consent despite knowing his dad doesn't.