Mum stating she will break court order

[Sayitaintsoiwillnotgo]

Hello

Just need some advice. Will try and keep to facts and remove any emotion.

DSS mum is getting increasingly difficult to deal with re: arrangements of shared care. Court order has been in place over 2 years. Is DSS half term with DP, then return to usual arrangments so with DP until Tue morn. I do school drop offs Tue to breakfast club. Mum is stating due to not seeing her son for a week they will miss each other so she is collecting him from school Monday despite court order to contrary and DP not agreeing. She states he has educational anxiety and displays very poor behaviour towards attending school at her home and she needs to settle him on Monday. DSS does not display same behaviour here and has said he doesnt but doesnt know why that is.

What should DP do? He has replied saying he wants to stick to order as thinks it is DSS best interest to maintain his known routine. She does not agree.

Week of worry ahead!

@PaddingtonBearStareAgain would you like to not see your child for 10 days?

Mine is still a toddler but I've been his primary caregiver since birth and would I fuck be ok with this.

It doesn't seem like an unreasonable request and flexibility/kindness go a long way.

That is half the problem, this isn't about the mother. This is about the child, if the child likes routine and this is the routine this should trump the mothers feelings.

Is it kind to the child then? Why would you put the parent above the child? It's not at all evident that it would be kinder to the child.

Has anyone asked the child?
usually the most they go without seeing Mum is 3 nights but this time because of how it falls it’s 8? Well possibly that isn’t great for an anxious child. Perhaps it would be better to try and split the ‘half the holidays’ differently eg one week half terms are split half and half between mum and dad?

@BungleandGeorge your post opens a whole different can of worms. DSS displays none of the alleged anxiety when here and clearly articulates he doesn’t feel the same when he is here compared to at his Mums. He says he cries and has tummy aches at his Mums, but that he doesn't have the same feelings here and doesn't know why. We listen to him and get him to work through how he feels as best we can (Hes 10 and knows his own mind he says!) DP also suggested splitting the weeks as you suggested but DSS mum didn't want to so not how court order was written.

The vast majority of your contact time is on non school days so not too surprising he has less problem with school linked anxiety when with you though? Masking is also common. I wouldn’t read too much into it. Is he getting any help for it?
at 10 id give him the choice about the monday night. Shame she won’t split the weeks with you.

DP spoke with his teacher (he has done regularly) and he stated DSS was much improved. DP wonders if DSS is seeing his mums anxiety or this is being projected onto him which is making the issue more clear at his Mums.

DP would love to have more school days with DSS but his Mum disagreed in court and this was the compromise. DP is actively involved in his education and does everything he can not to be a part time parent. Its extremely hard for him to be away from his son but he would never tell DSS as its not appropriate.

Typically the normal term time arrangement is suspended for holidays. Therefore, immediately following the half term, the child should have been returned home (Friday evening), and have that weekend with his mother, and then resume term time contact the following weekend.

In other words, the father would have had Fri to Tues, plus the half term days to Friday (7 nights), and then return the child home.

@JustAnotherLawyer2 thank you for your post. It is DP weekend with his child this weekend, not the weekend at the start of the holidays so he collected DSS yesterday

Is the relationship between the mum and dad difficult or do they get on most times?

Indeed. Imagine being a dad who only gets EOW?

Everyone fawning over a mother not seeing their child for just over a week but the same people wouldn't bat an eyelid at a dad not seeing their children other than once every two weeks. The double standards here are ridiculous.

Op I agree the court order should be followed. That's the whole point of it surely. You don't get a court order when you're dealing with someone reasonable, so I'm presuming she isn't.

If, on the other hand he started his week on Monday with the father, then he'd return him on Tues the following week (still 7 days).

Ok the legalities of it - a court order can only not be followed if all parties agree to make alternative arrangements. If one party does not want to deviate from the order, then it must be followed.

If the mum breaches the order, your partner has the legal recourse to enforce the court order through form C79. Alternatively he can write to the court and have the breach put on the court file if he did not wish to take action this time.

You partner could speak to the school and explain how it is his day under the court order and could he have reassurance that the child will be released to him. Don't share a copy of the order or show it them though as he isn't allowed to without the courts permission (which he can apply for if he wants).

The mum would have to explain to the court why she breached the order and if there was no good reason (not wanting to follow the order is not a good reason) then the judge would not be impressed. However it is unlikely that the court would make an enforcement order for a first breach but if it kept happening then they would likely impose fines etc.

You need to do what is best for the child, and not seeing his mother for ten days is much too long. Of course it is.

Secondly you sound very invested and just looking to get her into trouble, and I am wondering why you would be like this. One day you may need her, so I personally would strive for a much more cordial and cooperative relationship with her so you can work together and do what is best for the little child in the middle of this.

I doubt the court will do much beyond reconfirm arrangements. Anxiety can happen anywhere and no doubt has its roots in such an acrimonious battle and separation. Please stop making it worse, it is totally unfair on him.

Dh should call the mother and agree, but remind her going forward it would be best to stick to the arrangements outlined in the order, then I am sure you will elicit more cooperation from her as well going forward. Poor, poor child.

If that's what's best for the child, you don't think the court order is appropriate?

Do you think it appropriate for a dad not to see their child for that long or is that ok?

Why would op ever need the ex?

@Swayingpalmtrees it will have been 7 days that the child has been with his father by the time he goes back to mums.

We don't know the background of all this. There could be very valid reasons why the mum and dad can't work together in a civil manner. Sometimes it is just the fault of one parent who simply cannot work with the other no matter how hard the other parent tries.

OP will be invested because it affects her life too.

If it's against the court order just send a copy of it to school and inform them that they are not to release the child to Mum on Monday.

You have said you want opinions on the legal aspect, but you have included details about the emotional side of things. I think that's what you're getting opinions on that.

legally she needs to stick to the court order but in practice nothing will happen if she doesn't. The best you can do is keep a log of anything like this in case it repeats and you need to go back to court.

Many children mask fears about school etc. from one parent, often the one they are less close to. Its uncomfortable for the non resident parent to acknowledge this but I wonder if your husband really truly looks at the situation if it wouldn't be in the child's interests to be with mum and settle for school/ not have to go to breakfast club?

@passport123 unfortunately that is not allowed unless the court gives permission for it to be disclosed to the school.

Could you realign the weeks so he's at mum's this monday then dad's following monday and so on alternately?

oh sorry i misread, it's every monday night

f that's what's best for the child, you don't think the court order is appropriate?

Court orders are often and mostly imperfect, the order is not always carefully thought through - it is much more of the case of sketching out roughly what will work and be acceptable to both parties, it is often to the detriment of the child.

Do you think it appropriate for a dad not to see their child for that long or is that ok?

It would largely depend on the contact your child has had with their father before hand. If the father is a full time carer of the child then the court would give great consideration and make arrangements accordingly. The person that always loses when it comes to competitive contact we see regularly is the child. The parents seem to lose all sight of what is actually important - the child.

Why would op ever need the ex?

There are many reasons why cooperative relations work better for both sides. Bereavement, illness, loss of income, divorce, miscarriage etc when one side may look to the other to alter the contact. Therefore, cordial relations work best for the child and work best for the parents. Some parents even manage outstanding cooperation, because they remain adult in their contact - keep the child at the heart of the decision making and are flexible to change. The children in the care of adults with this outlook always far much much better. Court orders that become a competitive sport are usually doomed and are very damaging.

That was a very long winded way of saying, yes, fuck dad's, wasn't it?

Depends on the contact they had before? You mean living with them in most cases. Yes, that counts for nothing, clearly.

Let's be clear, op will never need the ex. The child is not hers. I don't think refusing to follow a court order is behaving like an adult, frankly.

cat You are reading way too much into my reply.

If the father looks after the child most of the time, of course that will be considered. If he is working away for three quarters of the year and the child barely remembers him, that will also count. So too the set up, location and distance etc.

To be clear, plenty of parents find themselves in difficulty and come back to court for variations to the order, it can be a long wait especially now, so of course it is far better to be able to organise arrangements between themselves if they can in the meantime. A cooperative adult approach always works best for everyone, especially the child.

Usual double standards implying dads don't have feelings and mothers are the omnipotent ones. I have never seen any academic research/papers which suggests dads find this any less difficult. Why should dad who is having less time lose a day and pass a child back to a mum who is having more time. Doesn't make any sense.

Don't stray from the court order as it will get chipped away at over time.