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Will social services get involved again?

92 replies

Beardkfux · 21/10/2021 23:08

I fell pregnant with our daughter 3 months into our relationship. At the time I had been diagnosed with depression and anxiety a year prior to this and I was on medication. My GP advised that the medication I was taking posed risk to the development of babies heart and other organs so I stopped taking it immediately. Hormones hit hard after this and I really struggled with my emotions during pregnancy. My partner and I would argue often over the silliest things, and on a couple of occasions I phoned the police when our arguments got too much. This is how social services initially got involved and they would come and do little assessments and check in on us to make sure everything was going ok. Then when our daughter was born, even though both of us completely fell in love with her, the sleepless nights and stress of adjusting to being a new mum and dad took its tole on us. My partner told me to pack mine and our baby’s things and said he wanted us out of the house as soon as he returned from work. I called my mum in tears and I was so angry, there wasn’t enough room for me to move back in with my parents now so I was left with nowhere to go. In an act of spite, I called the social worker and police and told them he had assaulted me which was obviously a lie. The social worker said that she could no longer let me live in this house anyway with the baby and if I chose to stay then she’d have to take her. At the same time the police arrived and took a statement from me. After that my mum and I packed up all our things and I moved into her house again sleeping in the living room with our baby. I quickly regretted and realised what I had done and he and I were texting none stop and talking on the phone just desperately wanting to sort things out. 2 weeks later I’d found a new place for me and my daughter to rent and the same night we moved in he came and met us there. I’d dropped my statement with the police against him too and it was never taken to court! Another couple of weeks later, without social services knowing we’d been in contact, they closed the case. I can’t exactly remember what the letter said but I think he was supposed to have had supervised contact. We’ve been together the full time and now our daughter is now 5 years old and I have fallen pregnant for the second time. I have my booking appointment in two weeks and I’m terrified that when I tell my midwife who the father is she will refer to social services again and they will get back involved and take my daughter away and my baby when it’s born! Please can anyone help me I’m absolutely beside myself. I don’t know where else to turn. I just wish they could see how we are as a family and how happy our little girl is with us and how well she is cared for.

OP posts:
TheEvilPea · 23/10/2021 23:38

[quote mummatomason]@CloseYourEyesAndSee this is the best answer!
Theres so many judgemental people on here. People make mistakes, people can work hard and make themselves better people.... Not everyone but some can[/quote]
Yep. Of course they can change. As was said by a PP who is a social worker though, most abusive ones do not change, so there also needs to be a robust system in place to make sure that they have in fact changed and any children left with them are safe and properly cared for and clearly that is not happening.

TheEvilPea · 23/10/2021 23:43

@CloseYourEyesAndSee

Also shocking that SS are so underfunded that they wouldn't even do an in person assessment when a tiny baby is being born into a volatile situation like that.

An in person assessment when a baby is born into a relationship where 5 years ago a domestic abuse incident took place? No, this would not meet the threshold if there was no evidence of anything since. Not about funding, but about legal threshold. We have to operate within the law when meddling in other people's private lives.

It's not that "a domestic abuse incident took place".

The situation that the OP described is a very volatile relationship that would be damaging to a child involving multiple calls to police, a threat of making the child homeless, and then a false crime report for a serious offence indicating that both parents are far from being stable and able to care and provide even an adequate environment for children to grow up in without the risk of serious physical or emotional harm. The OP stated that SS considered taking her child into care so clearly there were very serious causes for concern. No child deserves an upbringing like that and to bring a newborn into that kind of situation, with two volatile parents, is appalling.

Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:00

@Stevieknicks80

Sorry, but as someone who fled horrific domestic violence last year with my toddler daughter with literally the shirt off my back, I'm absolutely appalled you did such a disgraceful thing and lied about him assaulting you. I really am. I absolutely had to say that. With regards to your query regarding children's services, even if they do get involved it'll be an open and shut formality.
Totally agree with you, and so sorry you went through that, and so glad you got out!
Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:02

@Coronawireless

For all those shocked that OP accused him falsely of assault - he wanted to throw her out knowing she would be homeless.
Yes true, but aside from wanting to get her own back on him. What did OP hope to achieve by making that allegation?
Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:11

@girlmom21

Social workers can't follow up every closed case forever!!

That's my point - it shouldn't have immediately been closed.

Not okay of course, but in some boroughs they only want to take on and carry on with the most important/risky cases, also because of time and money, and workload. So they won't leave things open to come back to.
Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:16

@CloseYourEyesAndSee Is that in general or with the situation like OP is in, in terms of any SS involvement through her seeing the MW and what she tells them.

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 24/10/2021 08:18

[quote Redruby2020]@CloseYourEyesAndSee Is that in general or with the situation like OP is in, in terms of any SS involvement through her seeing the MW and what she tells them.[/quote]
What are you asking specifically?
Happy to answer but I'm not clear on the question.

Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:32

@CloseYourEyesAndSee

Also shocking that SS are so underfunded that they wouldn't even do an in person assessment when a tiny baby is being born into a volatile situation like that.

An in person assessment when a baby is born into a relationship where 5 years ago a domestic abuse incident took place? No, this would not meet the threshold if there was no evidence of anything since. Not about funding, but about legal threshold. We have to operate within the law when meddling in other people's private lives.

I understand that, about procedures and legalities etc. But I find it strange if that goes out on the radar and there is zero contact etc from SS. I wasn't told it's okay by them, despite everything they knew and what they would like to see happen. That in 5 years time as long as the police have not been involved, that it is okay to have a baby with my ex partner, and they wouldn't come down on me like a ton of bricks! So what if there is no police involvement, that doesn't mean something might not have been going on, and if there has been and you lie, that could go badly, and if you say there have been things happening, you would be asked why you have not reported them, again, would go against you.
Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:38

@CloseYourEyesAndSee

More likely that if SS had enough funding to stay in touch in the interim, they would have seen more evidence.

Social workers can't just 'stay in touch'
If the threshold isn't met for a child protection plan then engagement with social workers is voluntary and if the family refuse to engage they cannot be forced.
Social services only have the legal remit to get involved in families' lives when the threshold is met to do so. Lots of children live with less than optimal parenting and home conditions but that doesn't mean they reach the legal threshold for intervention.

To answer your question it's highly unusual for abusive men to magically change and stop being abusive. However mental health conditions can improve over time, people can move through periods of stress and out the other end, people can stop using substances and alcohol in problematic ways. Just because a family was in dysfunction at one point doesn't mean they will continue to be 5 years later.

Not completely voluntary, I know they do say things to make you worried etc about further action, so in a way almost a bit of manipulation etc to get you to do what they want. But prior to SS coming to see me, when I asked Children’s Services who dealt with me first, what if I didn't want SS to get involved etc, they said then they would take that seriously and question why I wouldn't want to work with them etc, what were my reasons and obviously it would show that I have maybe gone along with things, and also concern them if they think you don't seem to see what is right and wrong.
Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:42

@TheEvilPea Exactly! Sorry I couldn't tag what you said as you'd already tagged another post, so it doesn't allow it apparently!

But yeah, if the OP is worried about what to say, what not to say, to MW, it should be because they do check things and do contact SS, who then check things because there is a new baby on the way! I've certainly heard of this happening with other people, but not sure if some of that was to do with the fact they had already lost a child to the care system etc, it would be a bigger factor i think.

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 24/10/2021 08:44

I think you're talking about a specific situation that happened to you? I was talking generally. However;
If the situation is as the OP described, with one reported incident 5 years ago and nothing since, this would not meet the threshold for a new assessment.
If that one incident was extremely serious for example, if the man had tried to kill her or seriously injured her, it would be a different matter. However, social services just cannot insist on assessing a family based on one reported incident 5 years ago. It's not proportionate.

Child in need is voluntary. If you don't engage it depends on how serious the concerns are. It might warrant a child protection conference based on not being able to work on a child in need plan. However if the threshold for child protection isn't met, they have to close the case.

There is also the matter of patterns - if they have tried to support you several times under child in need for example and you keep disengaging but nothing changes that may trigger threshold for child protection to be met due to the ongoing pattern that increases the risk for the children in the future.

Hope that helps a bit?

Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:46

@CloseYourEyesAndSee In terms of you dealing with SS, that it's purely voluntary unless Child protection plan is in place.
As I, and I'm sure others have felt, with SS, that you couldn't say no once they came in and got involved.

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 24/10/2021 08:46

I've certainly heard of this happening with other people, but not sure if some of that was to do with the fact they had already lost a child to the care system etc, it would be a bigger factor i think.

Absolutely. As I said in the last post, 5 years doesn't mean much if the original incident/involvement is much more serious. Having children removed previously will almost always trigger an assessment to see what has changed. It doesn't mean future children will be removed necessarily.

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 24/10/2021 08:48

[quote Redruby2020]@CloseYourEyesAndSee In terms of you dealing with SS, that it's purely voluntary unless Child protection plan is in place.
As I, and I'm sure others have felt, with SS, that you couldn't say no once they came in and got involved.[/quote]
Yes, I understand that, it can feel coercive or oppressive. And it is generally better to work with them on a lower level than be forced to on a higher one, so we try to persuade people to work with us. Threats and coercion are not ok; but also saying 'if you don't engage on this level, the next level is likely to happen' is giving people informed choices to make. It would be worse to say 'it's totally voluntary' then turn around and initiate a child protection plan with no warning.

Redruby2020 · 24/10/2021 08:52

@CloseYourEyesAndSee

I think you're talking about a specific situation that happened to you? I was talking generally. However; If the situation is as the OP described, with one reported incident 5 years ago and nothing since, this would not meet the threshold for a new assessment. If that one incident was extremely serious for example, if the man had tried to kill her or seriously injured her, it would be a different matter. However, social services just cannot insist on assessing a family based on one reported incident 5 years ago. It's not proportionate.

Child in need is voluntary. If you don't engage it depends on how serious the concerns are. It might warrant a child protection conference based on not being able to work on a child in need plan. However if the threshold for child protection isn't met, they have to close the case.

There is also the matter of patterns - if they have tried to support you several times under child in need for example and you keep disengaging but nothing changes that may trigger threshold for child protection to be met due to the ongoing pattern that increases the risk for the children in the future.

Hope that helps a bit?

Thankyou that is helpful yes.
Hann101 · 07/02/2024 18:05

Hi looking for some advice
Hi I’ve got a 7 year old child I was 26 when had her my past wasn’t great my mother kicked me out and I got put into mother and baby units and didn’t open well I didnt know how to cope I needed constant help with my baby , I would be ignoring her :cry: when she be crying etc so social took her off me on the 3rd court and now she’s with her dad and I still her every school holiday I’m wondering if I was to get pregnant again will they take this baby off me
I have had my own place for 5 years I have done a parenting course group I’ve been in this current relationship for 4 years I’m just so worried

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 07/02/2024 19:28

Hann101 · 07/02/2024 18:05

Hi looking for some advice
Hi I’ve got a 7 year old child I was 26 when had her my past wasn’t great my mother kicked me out and I got put into mother and baby units and didn’t open well I didnt know how to cope I needed constant help with my baby , I would be ignoring her :cry: when she be crying etc so social took her off me on the 3rd court and now she’s with her dad and I still her every school holiday I’m wondering if I was to get pregnant again will they take this baby off me
I have had my own place for 5 years I have done a parenting course group I’ve been in this current relationship for 4 years I’m just so worried

Hi,
You really need to start your own thread as you won't get many people notice your post on here.
nobody can answer your question as we don't know exactly why your first child was removed but I will say if you've genuinely changed and addressed the issues that led to her being removed it is more likely than not that they would support you to stay together. However my disclaimer is I don't know your full story so it's only very general advice.

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