How far is a reasonable distance for DC to travel for weekend contact?

[CarsonsHat]

Could anyone please tell me what is considered a reasonable distance for DCs to travel for EOW contact visits with their parent?

My ExWife has moved away with our children. Since she moved, I have been collecting DCs from their house on a Friday, and delivering them back on a Sunday. ExW doesn't believe she has any responsibility to do any of the travelling. They live too far away to come back to my house for weekends, so we stay in hotels near where they live. I pay for the hotels and all the travel costs.

I'm trying to negotiate an agreement where ExW delivers the DCs a bit closer to where I live so that I don't have to spend all day Friday/Sunday travelling to see them. She argues that it is unreasonable to expect them to travel at all, as they find it too tiring, and she is sticking to her guns and refusing to negotiate. They are 15, 13 and 12.

I'm fairly certain that her position is unfair and that I am within my rights to expect her to undertake some of the travelling, since it was her decision to move away. What I'm not sure about is how far could I reasonably ask DCs to travel on a weekend.

If this goes to court (and its looking likely it will), she will try to argue that it is not in the DCs best interests to do any travelling. I could really do with some examples, or even better some caselaw, to support my position that expecting them to travel 1-2 hours to see their father on a weekend is entirely reasonable.

Can anyone give me some examples of how far their DCs travel for EOW visits?

My two are a lot younger (8yo and 10yo) but we initially moved away from the area that their dad lives and then he also moved further increasing the distance. We found a half way point and we do half the driving each. It works out at an hour for us and 1.5 hours for him, they go Fri night and come back Sunday Eve. The difference with us is that we dropped to once a month when he moved further away as all the travelling especially after work and school was a bit much eow. We aren't court ordered but it was mutually agreed.

I agree with others that at your DCs ages court isn't likely to be very effective as they will take into account GCSEs being imminent etc. Could you look at renting a room in an area nearer them and using that when you are due contact? Or moving closer yourself? I see you are near your family currently but moving slightly further away from family would shave a bit of travelling time off. Maybe suggest to your ex wife that once a month she travels just for an hour to drop them somewhere on the way to you, and then you can travel back to your home that evening?

Id also be wondering if you could just pop a few duvets in the car and drive them back to you once a month, arriving very late. Then on the Sunday you could find a day out that's half way back home and break up the driving by stopping there for the majority of the day before driving them home/getting mum to collect. It's more driving for you but if it's once a month or once every other month it won't take as much of a toll, and could be a good option if she's refusing to budge on the issue and you are keen to be able to take them places other than their home town.

Your ex wife should at the very least be contributing to travel expenses. Did you even want her to move the children away?

She flat out refuses that she has any responsibility for the expenses that I incur having to see my children.

No, I desperately didn't want her to take the children away. I had no choice, she didn't consult with me, she just went.

I'd go to court to try and get her to agree to put them on a train for contact! Madness she won't allow that.

I can't currently move because of my job. I think she expected me to move to follow her.

I've already tried some of the options suggested above - that she meets me an hour up the road, or I do more on a Friday, and she picks them up on a Sunday. She won't consider any of it - hence why I'm considering court.

I'd love to have them for more of their holidays, but shes adamant we split them 50/50. Eldest DC is very unhappy, and has previously said she would love to spend more of the holidays with me, but her mother won't consider it.

Is flying an option for the children? Booked far enough in advance internal flights can be quite reasonable

@RedMarauder

Keep it out of Court.

The Court won't enforce anything for the 15 year old anyway, and the with the younger children it would depend on their mental capacity.

If you keep it out of Court and you maintain your relationship with your kids even though it knackers you, you give your kids the option of moving in with you full-time.

Obviously due to schooling reasons they would only be able to move at certain times but give them that option.

Going to Court and having your ex named as the parent they mainly live with removes that option for your kids until each of them is at least 16.

If there is no Court Order and the kids lived near where you live now ask them if they want to spend their school holidays catching up with old mates, then enable it to happen. Yes you will have to finish work earlier on the days they are around and take days off, but they don't need as much care as younger children.

This makes a lot of sense.

I've been so conditioned to believe I have no choice in the matter that it hasn't even occurred to me that the kids could make their own choice about where they want to spend the holidays. They want both - they have friends where they live now, but they also have old friends and lots of family where I live.

@sayhellotothelittlefella

Is flying an option for the children? Booked far enough in advance internal flights can be quite reasonable

Not where i live at the moment. If I moved, then yes it's an option.

I've suggested she considers it - but it would involve her travelling an hour to the airport. You've guessed it - she won't consider it.

To be honest, I'm losing hope that there is anything I can do about this other than wait for the DCs to be old enough to make their own decisions.

Well bloody done for keeping going in the face of such intransigence. Your kids will see the efforts you are making and will soon be old enough to make their own choices.

I know you're suffering but you are a good parent. Hold that close and work with your kids to find a solution. Court may be an option but having been there, any victory is a Pyrrhic one

I think 6 hours is too far for them to travel every other weekend.
Did she not offer you extended time in the half terms with them?
That being said they are older now and their views should be taken into consideration.

I do think she's unreasonable though to move so far away and not come up with some sort of plan in place for contact.

OP you need to make it clear to your children if they want to stay with you they can as long as it doesn't disrupt their education.

So if your 15 year old wants to spend an entire half term with you or most of their summer holiday they can - you will need to collect and return them. (Generally if an older child does something the younger ones follow.)

As there is no Court Order your ex cannot claim you have kidnapped them - at the most the police will do a welfare check - and if she takes it to Court she will be told the same thing you have been told about the children being old enough to make their own choice.

Just don't allow your children to play you off with your ex especially if your ex has indicated that some of their behaviour is completely out of order.

I think you have been given good advice and you seem realistic. Could you try a very gradual change
You are already driving to them. Could you pick them up and then stay a little bit further away ie an hour to1/2 hour than what you normally do. ( but closer to your home)That has transport links back to their mum’s home and put them on that transport when your weekend has finished. They are all old enough to do this and surely their mum will pick them up.
Do this for a month or two and then see where you are at.

Mother should be either delivering children to you and you dropping them home or vice versa .

Absolutely selfish and unfair she expects you to travel, especially as she created the situation

I would be taking her to court because she is totally unreasonable on access.

Oh just read you are 6 hours away well if that's the case she should be driving 3 hours to meet you half way

She is a very selfish woman.

The person who moved away should be the one doing the majority of the travelling.

I do think that travelling 6/12 hours is too much EOW though but it must be costing you a fortune in hotels and petrol staying down there.

If it’s possible to have them during the holidays I would be telling the ex that you are going to request it in court.
I think half terms are roughly every 6 weeks and you can have them for the entire week and your family can help out with childcare if you’re working. You could still go down for a weekend every third week if you wanted to. You wouldn’t be seeing them as regularly but for longer periods which I think would be better for you and the children.

6 hours is a bloody long way EOW - I'd def look at the options of taking it back to court to get her to do some of the driving

Well I guess with your eldest if she wanted to stay longe then just don't drop her back?

Is the current contact schedule court ordered or not?

Start putting them on public transport to return. So the two hours first. Then from yours.

How far from train or airport to their house? Three teens can take taxi together.

The children have a legal right to see both parents and if travelling is excessive (6 hours is) then a judge is likely to rule in favour of some amendments to transport or contact.

Offer mediation and then go for a Specific Issue order to get a more suitable arrangement. The impact on you doing all of the driving will be considered a H&S issue.

It is judge dependent but if you propose a few solutions, offer mediation and Ex refuses to budge it will go against her.

With the option of putting on to return . If they get used to it then they may not see the issue of catching transport to you at least some of the way in the future. So initially more work driving for you but with the hope things are alot easier in a few months.

@Upsidedownpineapplecake

With the option of putting on to return . If they get used to it then they may not see the issue of catching transport to you at least some of the way in the future. So initially more work driving for you but with the hope things are alot easier in a few months.

Exactly. Op cannot force ex to drive but cN start training the teens from his end. Show them how. Start with shorter journeys then extend to the six hour one. Anyway presumably they make their own way to high school on school bus or public transport? So are not unfamiliar?

@Fireflygal

The children have a legal right to see both parents and if travelling is excessive (6 hours is) then a judge is likely to rule in favour of some amendments to transport or contact.

Offer mediation and then go for a Specific Issue order to get a more suitable arrangement. The impact on you doing all of the driving will be considered a H&S issue.

It is judge dependent but if you propose a few solutions, offer mediation and Ex refuses to budge it will go against her.

This is what I'm considering.

I have offered mediation - she refused to attend. I have the MIAM form signed from the mediator.

My solicitor has written to her with a proposal, which involves her driving approx 1.5 hours to alleviate some of my travel (I'd still do 2/3 of the distance to minimise the impact on the children). It also suggests that some times she might put the children on the train instead. I've also asked for a greater share of the holidays.

She has refused to consider it. So all I can do now is repeat that request to the court, if that's what I decide to do.

@Upsidedownpineapplecake

With the option of putting on to return . If they get used to it then they may not see the issue of catching transport to you at least some of the way in the future. So initially more work driving for you but with the hope things are alot easier in a few months.

That's a really good idea - thank you all of you who have suggested it.

It would involve me picking them up, then driving some way back towards my house, somewhere near a train station. But then I can put them on the train home. I would pick somewhere with a straight connection so they wouldn't have to negotiate any changes.

That's definitely worth a try, and it removes her excuse that they're not old enough or capable of getting the train themselves. Of course they are.

That's a really good idea - thank you all of you who have suggested it.

It would involve me picking them up, then driving some way back towards my house, somewhere near a train station. But then I can put them on the train home. I would pick somewhere with a straight connection so they wouldn't have to negotiate any changes.

That's definitely worth a try, and it removes her excuse that they're not old enough or capable of getting the train themselves. Of course they are. The train station is walking distance from their house.