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Legal matters

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Neighbour has asked to pave part of my land

61 replies

Ohffs66 · 26/04/2020 09:49

We live on a new build estate, the houses are about 2 years old and we all moved in at roughly the same time. We are on a shared driveway of 5 houses...us (house 1) and house 5 are on the main road either side of the entrance to the driveway, houses 2 3 and 4 are all set further back with their driveways branching of the central driveway. All the houses are fairly close together.

House 2 is directly behind us but at a 90 degree angle and has a long narrow driveway (as opposed to side by side) which runs along the back of our garden. We own a piece of land that runs directly along part of their driveway, which although belonging to us is not fenced in as part of our garden, and of no use to us at all, we've only ever been on it to cut the grass. It's a bit daft it belongs to us rather than to house 2 tbh.

House 2 have asked if they can pave or gravel this piece of land at their own expense, as they tread on it daily to get their grandchildren and daughter in a wheelchair in and out of their car and as it's slightly sloping and gets muddy in the winter, it would make their lives easier.

In theory I have no problem with this but I am worried about somehow accidentally creating a right to use the land or a right of way which could cause us problems if we come to sell: it would be really obvious why that patch of grass, and not the bigger area next to it, which we also own, had been paved i.e. to make it easier for house 2 to use it for access in and out of their car.

They are nice neighbours and I'd like to do this if we can, but I'm not prepared to do anything which could cause issues for us later down the line.

Any conveyancing solicitors about that might know anything about this please?! I'm not willing to seek legal advice at this stage as it's only just been raised and obvs I'd have to pay, but if anyone has an idea about the legal position here as a start point I"d be ever so grateful.

OP posts:
SecretIdentitee · 26/04/2020 10:31

Have them send you a solicitors/notarised letter to say they are not claiming any rights over the land.
Have the paving done differently eg if cobble lock make the brick angle different, put in a flat stone edging, gravel the strip rather than pave. Just to show the border for future use.

Ohffs66 · 26/04/2020 10:32

Tbh we can"t see if they are using it or not because of where it is, so if they hadn't said anything we wouldn't have known! Thinking about it I assume there must be some kind of right of access over the whole shared driveway as everyone drives over land that belongs to us and house 5 every time they go in or out.

I think I will say we cannot allow them to do it for reasons X, Y Z but if they want to look into buying it then I Will happily provide copies of our paperwork to their solicitor. I really would like to help them if I can I'm just not prepared to cause myself issues later on to do so.

OP posts:
Griefmonster · 26/04/2020 10:33

Not a lawyer I think perhaps you're over-complicating this by trying to protect future dispute/legal ramifications. I was thinking along Marphise's lines but simpler. Say you'd be happy to resurface that area of your land if the cover all costs and arrange the work. I.e. you are saying you will do something with your land for their benefit but they cover the costs of you doing that. No dispute then on whose land it is, I would say?

SecretIdentitee · 26/04/2020 10:33

You could also get the papers to invoice you so you are shown as the one improving the land. The neighbours could then pay you cash but they would have no trail of 'improving ' the land but you do.

fishonabicycle · 26/04/2020 10:33

Sounds good - let them do the work if they are interested in buying it. Otherwise no.

SecretIdentitee · 26/04/2020 10:34

Pavers not papers

Deux · 26/04/2020 10:43

Check your covenants to make sure that you can interfere with the grassed area first.

Someone else suggested rubber grass mats and that might be a good solution? You can get really heavy duty ones.

Bridgeofpies · 26/04/2020 11:04

I think it is fine OP if they want to put some stones on it (gravel it), and you don’t mind then really what is the problem?

A friend of mine bought a house where part of the garden had been fenced off and incorporated into a neighbour’s garden. The current owner had promised to sell the land to the neighbour but hadn’t got around to it.

Anyway, it was all totally fine. The neighbour had no legal right to the land so they had to move their fence back to their original garden. And if they still want to buy it they can now negotiate with my friend. They didn’t have any rights over it even after it had been fenced in to their garden and they had been using it! So I think a bit of gravel or paving will be fine.

If you have given permission then technically you are the one doing the gravel or paving. If they happen to walk on it then that’s fine. If the land is so peripheral I can’t imagine future buyers being put off. “Oh we put gravel on that bit of land as a favour to our neighbours so they don’t get muddy when they get out of their car. They don’t have any ownership over it though.” “Oh ok no problem”

I am not a solicitor so of course I could well be wrong but it seems bonkers that the legal system would prohibit a bit of kindness like this.

copycopypaste · 26/04/2020 11:09

If they pay for it and use it, then I'd be worried that it might give right to something. A bit like moving a boundary and if no one contests it after X amount of years you can then legally claim it as yours.

How much would it cost to pave it yourself? If it's not much and you can afford it, it might be better to pay for the work yourself.

Or, paying for an hours session with a solicitor might put your kind at rest

Billben · 26/04/2020 11:17

If they pay for it and use it, then I'd be worried that it might give right to something.

This is what I’d be worried about ‘cos I personally would never buy a property which has a right of access over it.

MadisonMontgomery · 26/04/2020 11:32

Make sure you get legal advice first - I seem to recall that if you let someone use your land for so many years they can claim ownership. Not sure if it’s true, but worth checking.

carly2803 · 26/04/2020 11:41

dont sell it. Lease it to them?

rolling contract for say 12 months and review?

I would not sell any land if you are possible going to move in the future. Make sure any contract is legally binding

carly2803 · 26/04/2020 11:41

dont sell it. Lease it to them?

rolling contract for say 12 months and review?

I would not sell any land if you are possible going to move in the future. Make sure any contract is legally binding

happinessischocolate · 26/04/2020 11:42

You could charge them a minimal sum to use it which would prevent any future claim. Just write a brief description and invoice them £1 per annum.

I would also get the improvements invoiced to you and then they pay you.

Mumdiva99 · 26/04/2020 11:47

Surely if the grass gets all muddy then actually they are doing you a favour. I would just let them do it.

OneMoreLight · 26/04/2020 11:57

I'd double check them paving it isn't going to cause you any issues with excess rain water.

MinnieMountain · 26/04/2020 12:12

No @00Sassy, it's for the seller to sort out. Which is why OP needs to be very clear with her neighbours now.

00Sassy · 26/04/2020 12:23

  • @MinnieMountain*

On reading yours and other pp here I do agree.
I’m no expert and it was just my opinion, which I fully accept is totally wrong Blush

Leighwalk · 26/04/2020 12:33

Would it not be cheaper for you to have the work done and let them carry on using it - than pay legal fees.That way no confusion over who owns or maintains the land.

Witchlight · 26/04/2020 13:25

If the strip of land does not add anything to your house, I would offer to sell them it for a nominal amount subject to them paying for and doing the footwork for:

All legal costs.
Registering the sale
All costs associated with your mortgage provider.

If they don’t want to do this, ask them to have a legal document drawn up, to state their improvement will not provide any extra rights, other than those currently enjoyed, over the land. This must be at their cost.

RedHelenB · 28/04/2020 16:50

I let my neighbours have a small sliver of our front garden to help them out with a disabled relatives access. No skin off my nose and theyve since moved and I've had 2 new neighbours, However at some point I may want room pave over the garden for we hickey and I will ask that they remove a bush to allow the access given that they gad some of my land.

Chocolatedeficitdisorder · 02/05/2020 11:43

'Gardenlaw' is a great site for questions like this and I've enjoyed reading the advice.

I think there's a principle that rights or adverse possession can't accrue if permission is given formally - you give them an annual 'licence' to use your piece of land for a nominal sum. Permission granted can be permission rescinded at any time.

wibdib · 03/05/2020 01:16

Do you have legal insurance on your home insurance? If you do this is the sort of thing it’s really useful for - you get advice without needing to pay out for it (as you’ve effectively paid up front).

HoppingPavlova · 09/05/2020 12:21

Far easier to sell it to them but put it back o to them to do admin, legal and associated costs.

SouthWestmom · 09/05/2020 12:48

Any problem that anyone who buys the house from you in the future has with the way this land is used would be up to them to handle, surely?

This is exactly us!
The bloke behind us has a corner of our garden for his drive. We did think it odd that our garden is missing a corner but nothing on the paperwork at all.
He knocked after we moved in and asked if he could block pave because he had a bit of our garden - we agreed - distracted at the door, kids, pregnant all that.

Now we have settled in and have a stupid shaped garden and no paperwork as to how or why.

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