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Original poster

Aunt has died and her friend reluctant to leave her house

362 replies

JellyBook · 13/01/2020 12:34

Our aunt died late November and she had a friend staying when she died. The friend lives overseas and doesn’t want to go (yet, she says).

Just getting a bit nervy about whether she will decide to stay even longer, and what problems that might cause. She has been left a lump sum in the will. The house and belongings are left to the estate to be sold and shared amongst various family members. Aunty leaves no spouse or children.

Do we have anything to worry about or should we just proceed with probate, sale of house and just tell her you need to make arrangements to leave?

OP posts:
Whynosnowyet · 13/01/2020 20:01

Imo you need to get there without giving prior notice.

SchadenfreudePersonified · 13/01/2020 20:01

Go to the house when she isn't there.

Go through her drawers etc. She may have stuff there (or she may have already sold items, or put them into bank deposit boxes. Go with someone else so one of you can keep toot in case she returns early.

You have every right to be in the house, so she can't complain about that, but obviously you don't want to get caught going through her things. (My be worth filming yourself if you do decide to do this, then you have evidence
a) of any of your aunt's possessions found among hers
b) that you have not taken anything you are not entitled to.

I'd really get round there asap, even if it meant taking a couple of days off work, and get the house stripped of anything of value.

Bananaman123 · 13/01/2020 20:04

Personallg id serve her with written notice of when she is expected to leave by. Get all execs to sign it, proceed with probate and if you get any issues with her moving, instruct legal action.

Hopefully you wont need to do this but in my job i see families split apart because someone stays i the home and refuses to leave, causes issues to the point of legal action and eviction.

IdiotInDisguise · 13/01/2020 20:04

She tried to get POA? Your aunt had dementia? Was your aunt well enough to have guests? This woman might have been freeloading for longer than November.

Given the POA information I think you need get her out and change the locks as a matter of urgency. Give her a day, she has other friends to go to, she might be working her way to get a higher chunk than what she has been left and squaring is a real possibility.

BTW, tourist visas expire after 6 months, you really don’t want to be hosting someone who may be breaching immigration laws.

IdiotInDisguise · 13/01/2020 20:05

Squatting not squaring

NettleTea · 13/01/2020 20:12

wow, do you know what valuables she had? Was she buried with her wedding ring? If not has the funderal home got it.

my grandmother died and when my mum went to her home all her jewelry was gone, but also all my grandfathers medals from the war. We dont know who took them - she was sleeping downstairs by then so carers or friends could have gone up and got them. Its shocking what people do

Whynosnowyet · 13/01/2020 20:15

Written notice makes it seem like she is entitled to have been there this long at all!! Turn up, ring a taxi, carry her stuff to the car after making sure there aren't half your family's heirlooms in her cases!! She has other places to go after all!!
No fuss.

thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter · 13/01/2020 20:48

She tried to get POA! Note how she obviously did this behind your/the family's backs seeing as the first you heard of this came from the solicitor. Sly as fuck. I'd get her out asap. Good luck.

DuMondeB · 13/01/2020 20:49

I’m aghast at the POA update.

Friend appears to be a POS.

So sorry you are having to deal with an ultimate CF while newly bereaved.

DesLynamsMoustache · 13/01/2020 21:02

Even if you do struggle to get her out right away, if she's using it as a base, presumably she will disappear to visit someone sooner or later and you can just change the locks? She'll have a hard time convincing anyone she should be allowed entry when she returns when she isn't even resident in this country.

lljkk · 13/01/2020 21:14

Empty houses are a burglary risk. I think I'd ask about formalising this a bit more (she pays something like rent), but not be hostile to her staying.

PickwickThePlockingDodo · 13/01/2020 21:19

Empty houses are a burglary risk.

I think this CF friend is more of a risk tbh.

BlouseAndSkirt · 13/01/2020 21:37

The POA detail is quite an update.

If the solicitor is the Executor surely he should be protecting the estate and getting her out?

WingingItSince1973 · 13/01/2020 22:30

Wow am so shocked. Your aunty surely must have been suffering for some time? The friends visit seems well timed. Why would she ask for POA for a friend who has dementia knowing full well she wouldn't be able to make her wishes known. The friend sadly seems to have used your aunt and is still doing so. Sometimes in life the prospect of a good payout makes even the most seemingly good family/friends behave quite dishonourable. I would turf her out before end of the week. I would be so so mad that she went behind all your backs and tried to do this and then stayed free of charge for longer than necessary!!

Drum2018 · 13/01/2020 22:35

Personally id serve her with written notice of when she is expected to leave by.

Why give her written notice. She's not a tenant. She's a visitor. Given your latest update and the fact the solicitor has kindly shown you what she's like, the executor needs to go round tomorrow and tell her to move out. No asking nicely, no giving notice - just tell her she needs to be gone now, as the house is being cleared.

mineofuselessinformation · 13/01/2020 22:46
  1. Go there and secure (by removing) any valuables. This includes any furniture, ornaments or jewellery etc. Remember she has no legal right to keep you out of the house.
  2. At the same time, give her one weeks notice (which is more than generous) that she needs to leave - in writing. Let her know that you are aware she tried to gain POA.
  3. If she hasn't left there after the notice period, go in and forcibly remove her. If she wants to call the police, let her. I doubt she will go through with it.
  4. Change all locks after she has left.

With all of the above, take someone with you as a witness.
This woman sounds like she is really trying to put you in a position where you allow her to stay.
Don't let her.
It might sound harsh, but I know of a family who let someone stay after the death of a relative. It has been nothing but trouble for them.

IdiotInDisguise · 13/01/2020 23:34

No notice, that will only give her a chance to steal stuff or cause some damage. Letting her stay for an extra single night after she tried to get POA for a lady with dementia without the knowledge of her family is akin to leave the door open over night and tell every tug you find in the area to go and have a look but ensure they leave, hopefully empty handed, before the weekend.

PanamaPattie · 13/01/2020 23:47

Search her bags before she leaves - and pick her up and give her a good shake and see what falls out!

ThePawtriarchy · 14/01/2020 03:01

Has the bank been informed of your aunt’s death so that the account is frozen?

cabbageking · 14/01/2020 03:10

Just proceed with the solicitors and follow their advice

You have no power to do anything as you don't own the house.

AlwaysCheddar · 14/01/2020 07:28

Don’t tell her you’re going over and get someone to keep her talking whilst one searches her stuff. She’s probably stealing stuff and taking the pis. Plus the executors gave a responsibility to protect the house and belongings etc for the will beneficiaries.

NettleTea · 14/01/2020 08:12

what is concerning about the POA is that on the form it asks whether there are other people who should be notified - this usually would be people like close family. Its not necessary but if things are above board it is customary. We had to do this for MIL, my DP has POA but we sent all the forms to his sister and she would have the chance to raise concerns.

Similarly on the form, you need a witness to the form signing, but also another unrelated person who signs to say that the person who is giving the permission for POA (ie your aunt) is of sound mind and fully understood what was going on.

Could it be that the solicitor was the notified person and he objected on grounds of dementia?

I would be pushing to see the application forms if I were you, as there were at least 2 other people involved in this

NettleTea · 14/01/2020 08:16

as for missing items - now is the time to make an unexpected call and ask for specifics - ie wedding ring and bangles plus anything else you know about. dont pre-warn.
of course there is a chance that in the last 2 months she has disposed of them. Depends on whether she wanted them for herself or for the money (assuming the worst)

If she says 'oh Aunt wanted me to have them' I would challenge that because it DOES specify a large sum to her, but it also does not specify specific items, which fall into the 'chattels' which are not hers.

When was the will written, with the large sum for her? Are there copies of earlier wills? Is it likely that she would be left a large sum? given her POA attempt I think Id start to question everything here

TinklyLittleLaugh · 14/01/2020 08:29

When did she get written into the will for a big chunk of money? If your aunt changed her will fairly recently I’d be quite concerned.

longearedbat · 14/01/2020 08:37

Different councils all have different rules re properties left empty due to death - there is no one nationwide regulation.
I would be concerned as to whether this property is actually insured at all (unless the op has re-insured it). As the aunt, who (hopefully) originally insured it is dead, the insurance is void and needs renewing. When my remaining parent died we found that only certain companies deal with insurance of empty properties, and they also charge a premium price and have various caveats in place (i.e. either heating left on in winter, or entire system drained down. Regular visits to be made etc etc.). The company we used was Towergate, if that's any help. I know the property isn't actually empty yet...hope you get your property back soonest op. I can't get over the sheer bloody cheek of your aunt's friend.