Where does my 16yr old son legally stand?

[kg80]

Hi I'm new here and really need some advice, I originally posted this in "Teenagers" but was advised to post here.

My ds is 16 and has just got his gcse results, he did really well (in my opinion) but unfortunately didn't get the C in English Language that he needed to stay on at his grammar school sixth form to do his A levels (he got a D), so after hours of searching/comparing our local Academy will take him, they can't give him all of his choices due to the D but they have given him 3 of the 4, a different one that he has chosen and are going to put him back through his English Language gcse. The problem I have is his dad has parental responsibility that he gained through taking me to court, at the same time I got a residency order and he got a contact order (but as far as I am aware these 2 expire when ds turned 16, but the parental responsibility stays in place till ds is 18), ds dad doesn't want ds to attend our local Academy as he feels that it is not that good and has said he needs to look in to ones that are in the area that he lives in regardless of whether they can offer him the courses he wants to do (we have looked at these and on the ofsted report they are either listed as inadequate or good, the local academy is listed as good). Ds has told me he doesn't want to go to the ones that are local to his dad as he knows his dad will try and persuade him that he should live with him and he doesn't want to do that.

Where does ds stand in legally making his own decision regarding his education? From my point of view he should be able to study what he wants to study at a place he is happy to study at, this is his future, not mine, I've had my chance to make my choices so has his dad, it is now our place to guide and advise, not dictate and manipulate.

Does his dad have a right to prevent ds from attending the sixth form of his choice?

If I signed the consent form to say ds can attend sixth form can I get in trouble legally for signing without his dad's permission? Even though in my eyes I am supporting ds and his wishes.

I'm so confused and don't know what to do, I have tried googling but none of the information is consistent, I only have a few days to get this sorted out and I want to do it right.

Arrange an appointment at his old school and ask if they would reconsider. I'm horrified tbh that schools kick kids out after they've educated them for years, but don't go down that route- explain that finding alternative provision is proving very difficult, that he might end up having to move away and appeal to their better nature.
Good Luck and congratulations on his exam success.

Thanks for replying, I've tried that but unfortunately they will not take him for sixth form as they require a minimum of a C grade in English and Maths, as they are a grammar school obviously they would prefer to keep the students that achieved the most A then the student that only achieved 1 A and requires a re-sit in English Language gcse.

I'd still go back with the new information- that you've looked into alternative provision and it looks like he might have to move to do his
A Levels. You have nothing to lose- they might readmit him and they might also reconsider their policy for future students.

Can DS declare himself to have left home and register himself at a new school? Otherwise, I would enrol him and face the consequences I think.
DS's opinion has to count at that age*

*not an expert.

I'd sign the damn form and tell his father he'll need to go to court for a specific issue order if he isn't happy. He'll lose obviously. Twat.

Ds can change the address on his licence and his df would never know as it would be sent to your address,
With regard to school let your ds attend the school he wants to - I assume his df would have to go to court to force a change - and although I have no legal knowledge as the mum of a similar age teen I can see any one trying to force an over 16yo to attend a school they don't want to.

Thank you for replying, I don't know if ds can declare himself as having left home and register himself, we are due to go to the academy tomorrow to pick up all registration forms etc.. I will be asking them when I get there where we stand in there eyes regarding it all, I'm just worried sick at the moment and haven't been able to eat/sleep properly since thursday and ds is walking round very subdued as he knows he will have a very difficult task coming up with regards to his dad, I want to just get it all over and done with but I need to do it in such a way that ds gets the education that he wants and I don't end up in trouble myself legally due to not really being in a position to pay legal fees.

I'm sure he'd be considered Fraser competent and therefore able to make his own decision about where he wishes to go to sixth form. It's a principle most often applied to capacity to consent to medical procedures (often referred to as Gillick competence) but I think would apply to this situation too. If he can weigh up the pros and cons and understand the consequences, he can make his own decision independent of his parents. More info here - www.inbrief.co.uk/child-law/children-making-legal-decisions.htm. Obviously that doesn't stop all the difficulties around going against his father's wishes,but legally I think it's his decision.
Hope you get it sorted soon.

If the school's sixth form requirements have not been met, they will not reconsider. It is the same at the grammar school I teach in.
If the student goes for a remark the place is 'held' but the entry requirements have to be met.
The students know in advance what these requirements are, students at risk of not meeting them are offered extra support and mentoring.

The sixth form requirements for the grammar school haven't been met (which we are completely ok with) hence we have found an academy that will take him on instead, ds has chosen this academy and the qualifications that he wishes to study at this academy but my question is can his dad object as he has parental responsibility? Surely this decision is ds's decision to make as he is the one that has to attend and study there, can his dad make him go somewhere else?

Thank you Wobblealong for the link, I am checking it out now.

Thank you all for your help, it is very much appreciated.

Just a thought, have you tried citizens advice, they may be able to advise? Alternatively what about the local education authority?

And well done ds on results.

Surely as your son is 16 and could, if he wished, move out and set up home on his own, he is able to sort out his own place of study. Im not sure any court would force him to attend a school his dad wishes.

Its a horrible situation to be in, but I would just support your son.

I've only been able to scour the internet so far but when it comes to looking at the local education authority it basically says that he needs to be in either education or apprenticeship until he is 18 and the terminology used is "you can choose x,y,z or you can choose a,b,c" which to me implies that he is the one who makes his own decisions.
And on the citizens advice website it says "The compulsory school leaving age is not being raised, so the young person cannot be forced to stay in school or college, nor participate in post-16 education or training. A young person will be given a choice about how they want to participate post-16, which could be through:

full-time education, such as school or college
work-based learning, such as an apprenticeship
part-time education or training if they're employed, self employed or volunteering for 20 hours or more a week.
The local authority is responsible for making sure that a young person has a suitable offer of a place in post 16-education or training". which again implies to me that it is ds that makes the decisions.

But then you get to the whole parental responsibility thing and it's "you have parental responsibility until the child turns 18" which implies that ds can't make his own decisions and his dad can still control him

The legal position is Parental Responsibility gives both parents the same responsibilities and rights to carry out those responsibilities. That means important issues such as changing school need to agreed. When no agreement can be reached either parent can apply to court for an order to regulate PR. A Specific Issue Order determines a specific issue such as a change if school and a Prohibited Steps Order prevents something from happening (eg a change of school) or reverses it back.

In making an order the court must give regard to the Welfare Checklist in s1 Children Act 1989, including the views of children according to their age and maturity. Unless there are exceptional circumstances and a child is immature for their age a 16 year old can understand the implications of a decision and their views are determinative.

Thank you Stidw, so does that mean I don't make the application to the academy sixth form and have to make a new court application instead? in which case I will be putting my ds's education back a year and not fulfilling my current obligations as a parent, or do I act on my ds's wishes and then take the fallout from that?

I should add that ds is in a position to make/understand implications of decisions he makes.

I would get independent advice from a careers adviser with regard to looking at all of the options on offer, they can give you a written document to support what the options are and the pro's and con's of each one, ask them to set it out like this. There might also be another option which you are not aware of. this will give strength to any argument that his dad might say in terms of you influencing him unduely and evidence to show a court. Enrol him at the academy and wait to see if his dad does anything, assuming you both have joint parental responsibility then you can sign the enrolment forms.

so does that mean I don't make the application to the academy sixth form and have to make a new court application instead?

To me it says that YOU don't do anything, your son will make the application himself, As he has already made that decision himself now that he's 16

Thank you headlesslambrini,

Yes I also hold parental responsibility, my ds spoke to a careers adviser while in yr 11 about what options he had after completing his gcse's, he himself chose A levels as his next option which he was originally going to complete at his schools sixth form but unfortunately he didn't meet the minimum entry requirement, hence looking for another facility he could complete these at, he has looked in to completing an apprenticeship but as he is not yet sure what he wants to do he feels this is not the right option for him.

Thank you missnevermind,

It is technically ds that is making the application but I think I have to sign something to say that I support his decision, as long as he is happy then I am happy.

Thank you DixieNormas,

The application will be done by him, he is adamant that this is what he wants to do, and as long as he is happy and making his choices for his future then I will support him.

Well I'm not in the same position as you but i do have a 17-year-old and at this point of their life it's more of a process of leading and refining their decisions and rather than making them for them.

That's exactly how I've tried to handle this part of his life, I've explained what the law requires ie-education/training then made sure he is aware of all of his available options.