Father not paying maintenance, can courts force contact?

[SK1ER]

Hi,

My teenage son's father has never paid a regular and reasonable amount of chicld support.

We have never been married and I ended the relationship when our son was a toddler.

Last year my son's father said he was out of work and paid just £5 per month! I later found out from the CSA he had been in work.

Am I right to say he can't have contact because he's refused to pay?

I know my son has a right, and wants, to see his father but it worries me that he will learn this negative behaviour.

There is fine line developmentally at my son's age, between understanding something is wrong, and my son understands his dad's behaviour is wrong, but still learning by example.

'Cash for contact' seems a cruel term but if the roles were reversed and he was the parents with care and I asked for access while refusing to pay a reasonable amount I would expect him to tell me where to go.

Morally am I wrong?

And legally am I wrong?

Since being forced to pay by the CSA he's decided to apply to court for contact and parental responsibilities.

We're both funded by Legal Aid so I'm worried he has too much leeway.

his solicitor is a member of Resolution yet no offer of mediation has been made.

Court should be a final option not a first step shouldn't it?

mjovertherainbow and Andre1960:
Thank you both for your input, and although you've said things I don't want to hear, who does? :) I appreciate what you've said.

I accept I struggle to set my own negative feelings aside completely and I suspect I'm not.

mjovertherainbow: I do not yet have a solicitor acting for me so I am currently self-rep.

DS's dad is the one who is applying to court.

Neither me not my son want DS to become a matter for the court but what can we do?

DS's dad has told a number of lies in his statement including saying he doesn't know of a previous case. Some of his accusations are damning.

How would you suggest I deal with this?

Simply, all I want is for my son be happy, he wants to see his dad, I want him to see his dad, up until last summer he saw his dad whenever he wanted which I thought was a happy arrangement, it was natural you know?

Unfortunately his dad's house became a matter of great concern and social services said DS wasn't to go there until it had been rectified.

I said this to DS's dad, I didn't say 'you can't have contact' I said 'it can't be at your house until you've made the necessary changes' I suggested other ways they could spend time together until he did so but DS's dad had an answer ready for every suggestion, he refused them all.

I don't believe this should be a matter for court, as you and others have rightly said DS is almost 15 and able to make up his own mind, it's a gross waste of public money and court time when they have serious issues they need to spend time on.

DS's dad knew I would be contacting a mediation service to try and sort this out.

DS's dad's application came the week after the CSA contacted him saying he would have to pay child support.

After years of lying and saying he was out of work, and paying £5 per month! he is very angry now he's being forced to pay.

He stayed away from DS for 5 months, no texts, no calls, no emails, nothing. In all that time he could have gone to a solicitor yet he didn't. He was working (yes while paying £5 per month child support) so he would have had to pay for a solicitor out of his own pocket.

All the legal and children centres I spoke to last week all said this was about his dad, not DS, that his dad was basically seeking revenge for the CSA being involved.

I could no longer afford to support my son financially on my own and was tired of chasing his dad for money, the CSA was a last resort.

To summarise:

DS's dad chose to stay away.

DS's dad made his application only after being contacted by CSA.

DS's dad and his solicitor know I am open to mediation yet they have not offered it.

DS's dad's solicitor is a member of Resolution! yet has not replied to me OR the mediation service who have been trying to get an answer from them for over a week as to why they've not offered, nor are seemingly prepared to consider, mediation.

Any suggestions would be greatly welcomed.

We just want this over with :(

Resolution: My son wants a set timetable. He used to have access whenever he wanted but unfortunately his dad isn't someone who gives other people's feelings, including his son's, consideration.

DS's concerns, and mine, are that if court orders an open arrangement and then Ds wants to do something else instead of seeing his dad, DS is worried the court will make him see his dad and that his dad will kick up a fuss.

mjovertherainbow: Noone is saying DS only goes to the cinema with me :) that would be waaaay too weird and clingy on both sides! He rarely goes with me, he spends a lot of time with his friends but he wants the option of doing something with his family as well when he wishes to :)

The court is more likely to order that he has such contact as agreed with your son, so there won't be any fixed timetable. They can arrange things by text.

mjovertherainbow:

Yes, this is true, a couple of people have siad similar to you re the validity of it, I'm new here, are false posters a regular problem?

I've thought the same as you, taking DS to court, surely it should be he who is listened to most of all??? It's his life, it's about what's best for him surely?

SS instructed me to apply through a solicitor re condition of the house as DS's dad was refusing to do it just because I asked, very childish, it should have been done without anybody asking him to but such is he :(

Yes, verification of DS's mediacal condition is available from our GP, he was diagnosed last year.

I hope it is thrown out of court, it is not necessary for things to have got to this stage and it's a waste of public money and the court's time :(

Resolution: If my son wants fixed days but his dad is asking for open access will my son's wishes be taken into consideration?

Your son will hold sway. What his father wants isn't as important, though if he then chooses not to accept that contact there's little you can do.

Resolution:

When you say there's little I can do what do you mean?

Thank you again for your time, and patience with me! :)

Resolution means that if the father chooses not to take up the contact on fixed days you cannot force him to do so.

prh47bridge: Does that mean the father has to go without access on the days he refuses or does it mean he can apply to court for different days?

Thank you for your reply :)

The courts will not be too pleased if he is constantly applying to change the days. There should be some flexibility on both sides - after all, there will always be occasions when a fixed day may be inconvenient or impossible. But at the end of the day if the father refuses to take up the contact that is ordered he will lose it.

prh47bridge: Thank you :)

SK1ER: I don't really want to add to the comments already made and I'm not qualified to offer a legal opinion. I just want to offer you, your son and his father my best wishes. I hope things work out for you all.

It may require a re-evaluation of what is 'good' - but what is good for each of you is good for all of you. It takes time, effort and the sacrifice of selfish interests in order to build the trust to make this possible. That is difficult and it may be too late for your family. The greatest disadvantage has been to your son. Not only has he lost out in those things that he might have enjoyed in his childhood but it will be difficult for him not to repeat the mistakes his parents have made because he will lack an example of how things might be otherwise. I don't know who is most to blame in this, but I do know that your son is not to blame.

Between you you have betrayed his trust and the trust of a child should have made your knees buckle with dread at the responsibility that placed on you. I've got a feeling you were each concerned with other things because that is usually how it is. Nevertheless, I wish you both luck.

Andre1960:

with the exception of his father's occasional 'going walkabouts' on a number of occasions my son has had constant access to and with his father.

Despite any negative feelings I have had towards his father in the past he has always been invited to my house to his son's birthday's and Christmasses.

Despite not having PR my son's father has always been consulted with regard to his son's nursery, primary school, secondary school, cubs, scouts etc.

He has always been informed immediately of any health concerns and his opinion has always been given equal weight.

I could have been a mum who used her child as a pawn.

I could have been a mum who used her child to hurt it's father, stopping access for no good reason etc.

I am not, nor have ever been, any of those.

I have given his father more chances than was wise and in doing so inadvertantly contributed to the situation we have now.

His father chose to stop contact.

His father chose to walk into a solicitors and lie.

His father chose not to accept my offer of mediation and in doing so chose to drag his son into a court situation.

My primary concern has always been, and remains, my son's welfare.

I am very sorry his father does not have the same priorities.

And I am offended by your remarks.

My son has not wanted for anything in his childhood, where his father refused to pay child support (over 90% of the time) I, and sometimes my parents, paid solely for everything.

It pains me to see my son going through the realisation he is currently experiencing and that is that the dad he thought the world of has shown little, if any, of the same level of love in return.

Do not wish me luck, I am old enough and ugly enough to deal with this however unpleasant it maybe or may get.

If your good wishes are genuine then please reserve them all for this 14 year old who's last remaining childish innocence has been dragged from him in only 2 weeks.

SK1ER: I'm sorry to have offended you. I spoke harshly and perhaps that was unfair and, therefore, not very helpful. Although my manner of speaking was not very sympathetic, it arose from a feeling of sympathy and concern for your son. On that basis, I hope you will forgive me.

My good wishes are genuine. I don't think I can confine them to your son because you are all tied together. However it may have seemed, and regardless of how old and ugly you are, I also wish you well in your own right. It was brave of you to subject yourself to scrutiny by posting on this site. I hope it has been helpful to you.

SK1ER - in your original post you never made mention of dad's house being dangerous. The sole reason then for stopping contact was dad's unwillingness to pay child maintenance. I suspect that people might have been more sympathetic to you had you not added the house issue as in "oh and another thing". The feeling that most posters seem to convey is that we think that the house being dangerous is a bit of an excuse, as we are struggling to understand how it can be that dangerous. The only thing that sticks in my mind that you've posted before is that a window is rotten and might fall out. That looks like you're scrabbling around for excuses.
If social services really feel that your son shouldn't go to that house because it's dangerous then that's strong stuff. If they aren't prepared now to get involved that sounds like serious back peddling and I wonder whether you over egged their advice initially.
I fear that if you persist in court in trying to make an issue of this house issue then you will do a great disservice to yourself.

Andre1960: Thank you, for your kind wishes :)

Resolution:
Thank you, I understand now how it may have looked, I am new here, these were my first posts.
When I mentioned not paying child support yet wanting to force contact I was puzzled as to how people, legal or not, view this situation.

As for his dad's house, it was the reason contact stopped last year, I didn't say 'you can't have contact' I said 'it can't be at your house until it's been dealt with' my son's dad refused all other suggestions of contact.

SS gave their advice but said they cannot get involved further as I would have to go to court and the court involve CAFCASS who would inspect the house. They said as the concerns were to do with contact, that was their reason for not being able to get involved further as contact, they said, is an issue for the courts, not SS.

I didn't give all the information out straightaway and have still not mentioned the majority of concerns, as I wasn't sure how much to put, not understanding the forum's here yet.

You've been nothing but patient with me despite having to repeat yourself on some occasions and I am more than grateful for your time and effort.

Thank you :)

mjovertherainbow:

CAFCASS say the same as you, and that was echoed in paperwork I received today so I am wondering now who it was who called last week, I'm awaiting a call from the CAFCASS officer assigned to the case to explain why I'm being given conflicting information.

I am not the one wasting public money and I object to that part of your post as it seems to include both me and DS's father.

DS's father has not offered mediation nor has he agreed to go to it when I contacted his solicitor and the mediation service.

I cannot force him to go to mediation.

so what can I do? If you have any suggestions I would be very grateful as neither me nor DS want DS to become a matter for the courts and it should not have been the case that his solicitor used court as a first option, it should have been a last resort, she's a member of Resolution for goodness sake!

You do not have the right to prevent your son and his father having contact because he is not paying you enough maintenance (unless there is a serious welfare concern.)

SK1ER I have not read the interim pages, just skimmed so sorry if the discussion has moved on and I have just dropped in my thruppence.

SparkleSoiree: It may be better if, if you wish, to read the entire thread.

Thank you for your response :)