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Original poster

Massive Parent Issues HELP!

101 replies

onlyhereonce · 04/01/2011 09:55

Hi,

Where do i start? I'll just try and give you an idea of the situation and then let you know the problem. I am married to X (name held for privacy reasons) (been together 7.5yrs), and have 3 lovely children who we both adore (5,3 and 1). We are fine with his parents and his side of the family, my nan and grandad and brother and have a good relationship with them, as do the kids. All my auntys and uncles have washed their hands of me due to being fed a load or rubbish by my parents.The problem is my parents.

We have had 4 years of hell with them ever since Child 1 was born. (first 2 years were manageable). The problem is that they are very controlling, judgemental, ignorant to our wishes, and seem to love making life hard if we dont adhere to their every whim.

Because we are very hands on parents, dont palm them off all the time, dont go out alot as we prefer to be at home with the kids, they resent this as they crave having the kids all the time.

Theres been so much hassle it would take me hours to write but it includes my dad threatening X over the phone twice, whispering things in the kids ears, trying to brainwash my kids into thinking my side of the family are only the important side, constantly undermining and shouting over us when we are trying to guide our children. My mum works in the education system and since doing that has totally changed. She now thinks she knows the lot, seems to think she knows everybody and has more rights than anybody else, including us as parents. It took a bad turn 3 xmas's ago when they purposely withheld the kids xmas presents as we were living with X parents at the time due to our house being renovated. They were only prepared to let the kids open them a their house, which totally went against the whole santa thing. When we let them know how unhappy we were it took a bad turn from then on. We have been blackened to people. slagged off, been called "fu**g crap parents" in front of the children etc etc

We had to get married abroad instead of here due to the hassle they would have caused. We have had my sister turning up at my son's school playground calling me all the names under the sun, crouching down to my eldest and saying "aunty && loves you, this is your mum and dad stopping me seeing you".

Recently we have got a harassment order on them and my sister as they will not leave us alone. We have made our wishes in writing that we no longer want any contact of any sort as it is damaging the children. They have come down at 6:30pm, knowing full well the kids are still up and caused holy hell, hurling abuse, shouting, accusing of all sorts in front of the children, passed things to me through other people, text numerous times with abusive texts and left abusive voicemails so we have called the police 3 times now.

The last time the police officer spoke to my dad she said how difficult it is to speak to him (well we know that anyway) and he was seeking legal advice to get access to see the kids).

My parents have started telling everybody that X is conrtolling me and very manipulative, which is total nonsense. Even my grandparents who we are on good terms with know that not to be true and is probably why they have not got involved and have a good relationship with X.

We are in turmoil to the thought of them going to court and geting access as this will damage my children and their future, not including ruining our quality of life. My eldest has been very touchy and loving (especially with his dad and telling him he loves him like 50 times a day) and i feel this is due to him hearing rubbish like "your f***g crap parents" as he came up to me only a few days ago and said " mum i dont think your rubbish parents".

I could cry, im at the end of my patience and dont know what to do. We are seriously thinking of moving away if they do get an access order as i know this will cause massive upset for us and especially the kids.

Anybody out there who has experienced this or can help?

Thanks

Amy

OP posts:
SpringchickenGoldBrass · 25/02/2011 22:30

You really do seem to think the whole world is out to get you OP. What triggered all this off in the first place? I don't see any mention of your parents being physically abusive to your DC, or alcoholics or in any other way a danger to them.
Is there something in your parenting style that is a bit unusual (at least in your parents' view)? Are you strict vegans, or very anti-consumerism, or did you convert to your H's religion which is one that demands certain behaviours that might make your DC stand out among their peers?

Original poster
onlyhereonce · 25/02/2011 23:46

What the heck has being a vegan got to do with this? Im not a vegan, we are both catholic, and ive converted to nothing. I guess my feeling that the world is out go get me is based on the fact that it seems i have to explain myself and my choices on how to bring my children up to a total stranger in court. I'll tell you what triggered this all off. My parents are very controlling, ive been controlled all my life by them and because they cant have control now they dont like it.

Amy

OP posts:
Resolution · 26/02/2011 00:14

Parenting is something to be done by 2 people, not 4 or 6. Grandparents can enjoy a relationship with their grandchildren, but that doesn't give them the right to interfere, or call the shots.

When it starts to have a negative impact upon the welfare of the children, it is often time to suspend the grandparent/grandchild relationship.

Original poster
onlyhereonce · 26/02/2011 00:25

Thanks Resolution. Thats what ive been thinking and wanting to say all along but didnt know how to.

Amy

OP posts:
LittleMissHissyFit · 26/02/2011 00:45

I don't blame you for feeling embattled, this is a horrid situation to be in.

I know it's asking a lot of you , but try to stay calm, don't talk to the DC about stuff unless you really really have to, it's your job to shield them from scary legal stuff. They might think they are being taken away from you or something.

If you project this everyone is out to get me, it'll come across badly.

Stay calm, stick to the facts and you will win.

It'll be OK OP, hold your nerve.

Resolution · 26/02/2011 00:52

I'm lucky that my parents and in-laws don't interfere, but do see the kids regularly. They're acutely aware of the need to leave us to do our own thing, even though MIL was a child minder she only gave advice in the early years when asked.

Resolution · 26/02/2011 00:58

The thing about grandparents is that some kids don't see them more than once or twice a year and are not harmed by that. Of course a close and loving relationship can be beneficial for a child, but when balanced against the negative effect on the home and family life, it must be remembered that they are only grandparents. Where do you draw the line? Should aunts and uncles have a right to see the child too? Where does family time with the parents fit into all this?

If Amy's parents haven't recognised the effect their behaviour has had, and still persist in seeking contact, they must have little regard to the needs of the child. Their application is, i suspect, driven by their own needs. Had they put the child first they wouldn't have interfered at all.

SpringchickenGoldBrass · 26/02/2011 01:55

There is nothing wrong with being a vegan. In my opinion anyway - I was using it as an example of something that might have initially triggered this feud, if your parents were insistent that you were being unreasonable in not allowing the DC the odd burger, for instance - it wouldn't make either of you actually right or wrong, but it's an example of something people might disagree over. Your parents may well be unreasonable bullies, it's just that your posts seem to suggest that you are determined to regard everyone apart from your H as the enemy.

Resolution · 26/02/2011 08:40

Springchicken: Amy's problem is that the grandparents feel entitled to make parental decisions re her child. That has, quite rightly in my view, thoroughly pissed her off. Everyone has to draw the line somewhere and that is where she draws hers. I'd do the same.
Many of the posters have suggested some sort of compromise, but that involves her redrawing that line, which is not an option for her. Anything that allows her parents to do something with her child that is against her wishes then gives the grandparents something that Amy has refused to yeild on - control. I suspect therefore that, whilst well intentioned, any suggestion that she should compromise comes across as advice just to give in, and capitulate a measure of control to her parents. That might be why Amy thinks many people are against her. Were her parents to have posted here we'd all be telling them to back off her, do as she asks, mend fences, and enjoy every minute with their grandchild they are privileged enough to be given. If they can't accept that type of relationship then no other type is on offer.

prh47bridge · 26/02/2011 12:20

Agree completely with Resolution. Whilst I am generally in favour of compromise there are some situations where that simply isn't going to work. In this case it seems the only "compromise" acceptable to the grandparents is complete compliance with their wishes. I would not accept that if I were Amy.

Amy's parents are trying to use the courts to force their will on Amy and her partner. Amy is naturally worried that the courts will force her to let her parents into her children's lives so that they can carry on telling them that she and her partner are bad parents. I think that is unlikely but I can understand Amy's fears.

If I were advising the grandparents I would say that the children are Amy's and it is for her and her partner to decide how to bring them up. They can either accept that and keep their opinions to themselves or find themselves shut out of their grandchildren's lives completely.

Original poster
onlyhereonce · 28/03/2011 10:44

Just to update. The Cafcass officer has called today and advised us that this week when we go to court for the resolution part to see if we can come to some sort of agreement before starting the whole investigation that they want us to go to mediation. We have been trying to sort this out for years now, it will never get sorted out and i am not going to agree to mediation. No good will come of it, they are very good actors in front of others and i dont feel why i should have to agree to mediation just so it looks good in front of cafcass and the judge who are strangers and dont know the whole picture.

Amy

OP posts:
StiffyByng · 28/03/2011 14:25

I can completely understand your frustration. When my husband was going through residency proceedings, his ex manipulated the mediation process in a ludicrous manner. But it didn't matter to the judge who had the measure of her. Cafcass will always press mediation because it is better if things can be sorted out away from the court. Unfortunately often things have come to court precisely because it's the only way to decide things. If you can see no outcome to mediation that would be acceptable to you, then I can understand your reluctance. But please don't be put off trying because you feel there will be 'acting'. It will be up to you, not the mediator, what the outcome of mediation is.

Original poster
onlyhereonce · 28/03/2011 17:15

Hi SiffyByng,

It has come to court because my parents haven't been able to obtain control of me or my husband. This is just another way to force our hand. Mediation has been attempted by us and failed. I have asked my parents to come down when the kids are in bed 4 or 5 times and instead they turn up at 6pm , cause a massive argument and then leave, leaving us with crying kids and a thoroughly horrible atmosphere. I refuse to talk to them unless i absolutely have to and as there is no legal right for them in the uk , i dont see why i have to jump through hoops just to avoid court. Im more than prepared for the cafcass to check me, my husband and kids out as they will find that our kids are absolutely flying at school (my eldest is doing work meant for 2yrs ahead). The kids dont need them , we dont need them and no amount of mediation will change my parents.

Amy

OP posts:
CarGirl · 28/03/2011 17:48

Asking you to go to mediation is standard.

I remember this thread from when it first started but haven't reread it all.

Have you decided that there is to be absolutely no contact between your dc and your parents?

You can still go to mediation and refuse to permit any contact and constantly itterate your reasons for that. You do not have to concede just because you are in mediation IYSWIM.

Cafcass will make their recommendations to the court and the judge will make a decision having read that report.

Collaborate · 28/03/2011 18:32

Go to the initial mediation session. After 12 April the judge can adjourn the case for mediation if it's not been attempted yet, do you might as well go if only to tell the mediation assessor why you're not yielding an inch and so mediation is pointless.

Original poster
onlyhereonce · 28/03/2011 19:05

The day we go court is in 2 days time so thats before the April 12th. Does that mean the case will go ahead anyway? If so cant see any point in agreeing to mediation if he cant adjourn it.

Amy

OP posts:
Collaborate · 28/03/2011 21:15

The new procedure won't apply then. I agree that mediation isn't appropriate. There's no middle ground.

Original poster
onlyhereonce · 30/03/2011 11:04

Dreading today! Im just going to say "Mediation will not work, it isnt what we want as we no longer want any relationship with my parents. My kids no longer want a relationship with my parents. Mediation has been attempted at my parents house for 3yrs approx and failed and mediation was offered by us at our house for 2yrs and not accepted. This whole court case is, in our opinion, driven by their selfish needs to gain control and not driven by what is best for our children"

Amy

OP posts:
ElsieMc · 30/03/2011 14:26

I would recommend you attempt mediation as Collaborate has suggested. I know how adamant you are that you do not want this, but mediation means you will have some say in the outcome. Once it gets into court, you may well not get the decision you had hoped for and they may achieve an order for contact you feel intolerable. It really will heighten tensions further, if that is possible, and I believe the new mediation process is the court's way of weeding out some applications at an early stage which I generally welcome.

I say this as one who wanted the court to decide and it was a disaster for my poor grandson whose growing sadness, disillusion and resentment is hard to bear. Court means strangers will decide the fate of your children. Do not underestimate the stress of proceedings and CAFCASS will not necessarily believe or support you. They will have competing versions of events.

Sorry if this comes across as harsh.

prh47bridge · 30/03/2011 14:44

ElsieMc - Collaborate's most recent post says that mediation isn't appropriate and I agree. There is no middle ground here. The OP's parents want to make all the parental decisions for these children. They are unwilling to accept that it is up to the OP and her partner to make these decisions. Given the facts of this case I think it is unlikely that the grandparents will get a contact order.

2blessed2bstressed · 30/03/2011 15:17

I've been following this thead for a while - and have sat on my hands for aaages, but I can't help myself now.....
According to the OP her parents want to make all the parental decisions. According to the OP these are the "facts of the case". They are actually, the OP's opinion and we haven't heard the grandparents version of events at all. I'm another who thinks that they should really try mediation.

prh47bridge · 30/03/2011 15:49

The fact that the OP was able to get a harrassment order against her parents suggests that her version of events is reasonably accurate. There needs to be some middle ground between the OP and her parents for mediation to stand a chance. There does not appear to be any middle ground here.

Original poster
onlyhereonce · 30/03/2011 15:58

Well..

We were advised by pur solicitor to agree to mediation as in the future if they get legal representation the solicitor would most probably say "these are your wishes you are forcing on your children as you cant even agree to mediation"

So.. we have agreed to mediation, but this will NOT work , as according to them they have done nothing wrong. The have also told cafcass that i am afraid of my husband and that he goes round punching walls and smashing things which is total nonsense.

I feel that they are trying to paint a dark picture of my husband and to create doubt when in fact the reason it has got to this is due to their total lack of respect for our wishes and there overwhelming interference. Not to mention the f-ing and blinding in front of our kids.

OP posts:
Original poster
onlyhereonce · 30/03/2011 16:01

I've been following this thead for a while - and have sat on my hands for aaages, but I can't help myself now.....
According to the OP her parents want to make all the parental decisions. According to the OP these are the "facts of the case". They are actually, the OP's opinion and we haven't heard the grandparents version of events at all. I'm another who thinks that they should really try mediation.

IN RESPONSE TO THE ABOVE...

The comments i have made are FACT. The police have listened to the abusive voicemails , seen the abusive text messages. The school can verify that my sister came down to the school,as intructed by my mum, to create hell (screaming your f-ing crap parents etc etc). How in any way is this opinion??????

OP posts:
2blessed2bstressed · 30/03/2011 16:39

Sighs...ok, this isn't aibu and I don't want to get into any kind of bunfight, but there are two sides to every story. From your initial post I felt that sometimes you had a point, and sometimes you came across as quite bloody minded and I could understand that this situation must be very difficult for your parents too, and it is just so sad (for all of you).
From reading other posts I don't think I'm entirely alone in that opinion - of course, that's all it is, my opinion, and as you're posting for legal advice and not opinions, I'll leave you too it.