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Original poster

Really strange error & now mum owes thousands- help

441 replies

Helpmymum · 28/03/2021 19:18

I'll try and keep this as simple as possible, I'm just seeing if anyone has any advice or insight into how this might play out before we start contacting people tomorrow.

My elderly, widowed & (totally alone for the past year 😪) mother got a letter late Friday afternoon which was spent special delivery from a pension company. In short, it said that she took a bond out 20 years ago which was cashed in 15 years ago and her account was closed, she was no longer a customer. They then said that they are really sorry but they have just discovered during an audit that they had mistakenly used her bank account details with another bond for another customer and she has been receiving a monthly payment for the last 20 years in error. This amounts to an awful lot of money, tens of thousands of pounds. And it needs to be repaid. We have checked and she has been receiving the payment in her account.

She was widowed a long time ago and when my father died, my sister and I where both toddlers and so she employed a financial advisor to deal with the finances, obviosuly to eliviate the stress. She is not wealthy by any means, she owns a modest house (which was paid for by my dad's life insurance policy), has a small amount of savings (which is with the financial advisor invested in whatever he thinks) and collects her pension.

I can understand why she wouldn't question this money going in as she just left everything to the financial advisor, he obviously opened the bond and cashed it out and payments of this nature were expected/ perfectly normal.

After receiving the letter, my sister immediately called the financial advisor who said he had never dealt with anything like this before and was working from home, he would need to go into the office on Monday morning to have a look at the records. My sister then called the company in question, it's a large, well known company so she didn't take the number from the letter just incase it was a scam and found the number from Google. She called and a person in the company could not find any record of this or the letter having been sent out, however she did say she wasn't part of the relevant department and the person who's signature was on the letter did infact work there. It was so late on Friday afternoon, there was no one there who could help or knew anymore.

My poor mum has been in an absolute state all weekend, she's thinking she is going to have to sell her house to pay this back. I think technically she does owe the money as we can see she has recieved it. Does anyone have any idea of what might happen?

First thing tomorrow is a call to citizens advice and legal advice, obviosuly talk to the financial advisor and the company in question too.

I think I'm just asking if anyone knows what we might be in for here?

Thanks

OP posts:
Joeblack066 · 28/03/2021 20:49

This could easily be a scam. Ex employee of said company holding customers’ details.... sets up a ‘repayment’ plan.... not rocket science!

Eckhart · 28/03/2021 20:50

@Nith

Even if this isn't a scam, I don't think she could be liable for more than six years' with of payments anyway. But she obviously needs proper advice.
Yeah, this. The rest would be statute barred.

www.stepchange.org/debt-info/can-i-write-off-debt/statute-barred-debt.aspx

Read the bit about 'The last time you wrote to the creditor acknowledging that you owed the debt'

It's important that you and your mum are careful about acknowledging the 'debt'.

This looks like a scam to me. They're designed to make you feel exactly like you're feeling. Anxious, confused, and pressured. That's what makes people give them money. Get it fully checked out.

SerialSpringCleaner · 28/03/2021 20:51

Of course, the company, which has cocked up big time in letting this happen and it not being picked up at audit, is going to chance their arm by contacting your mum to pay it back.

I would be really assertive with them and say you are not impressed and that they are deeply distressing your elderly, retired, widowed mum and causing her anxiety and depression over the stress of all this and that you will be taking it further. You may think that doesn't make any difference but I used to work for a charity that helped people with debts and this was a sure way to get them to back off.

Katr673 · 28/03/2021 20:52

Hope this a scam, but if it isn't hope you can get it resolved quickly. Terrible situation for your poor Mother to find herself in

Alcemeg · 28/03/2021 20:52

@AcornAutumn

Just as an example

Mum got calls about fraud from a scammer who had cloned the bank's fraud department number.

It is amazing what they can do.

^ this...

OP, have you tried Googling the precise wording used in the letter (just fragments of it at a time)? Sometimes that's a good way of locating similar scams reported by others.

STARmyarse · 28/03/2021 20:55

Not everything is a scam!

I’d let them take it all the way to court tbh. Ignore them till you can’t any longer. No one in their right mind would make an elderly lady pay back anything but more than a nominal sum for money she genuinely didn’t realise wasn’t hers.

CustardySergeant · 28/03/2021 20:56

@redcandlelight

sounds like a scam to me. look up the original company and call their number tomorrow. don't call the number on the letter.
That's exactly what she did! "My sister then called the company in question, it's a large, well known company so she didn't take the number from the letter just in case it was a scam and found the number from Google"
FlyingBurrito · 28/03/2021 20:57

@AcornAutumn

Just as an example

Mum got calls about fraud from a scammer who had cloned the bank's fraud department number.

It is amazing what they can do.

That's basic number spoofing, not at the amazing end of scamming at all, afaik anyone can get an app or whatever is needed to do that
GabsAlot · 28/03/2021 20:58

can i ask how did she not notice she was still getting payments when it was cashed out 15 years ago

did she wonder what it was for

Singlenotsingle · 28/03/2021 20:59

Interesting. What a shock for your mum. She shouldn't panic though. If money has been mistakenly paid to her, there is a defence in law. It was a mistake by the company, which she was unaware of, and the money has been spent anyway. In any event, they wouldn't necessarily be able to make her sell her house - maybe put a charge on it instead?

saraclara · 28/03/2021 21:01

OP says that her sister has checked the number on the letter and that it's legit. The person on the phone confirmed that the signatory worked there. And everything that the letter says is correct on checking the account.

So much as I'd always say letters like this could be a scam, OP and her sister have done everything they should have done, and it's all checking out.

What OP needs is not another 50 people saying 'it's a scam', she needs proper advice, on the assumption that when they phone the company tomorrow, they get the right person who confirms this issue.

OP, is your mum going to be with you when you phone? Because they'll want to speak with her to get her permission to talk to you.

maybemu · 28/03/2021 21:02

I would definitely get financial and legal advice but this does happen. I used to work for a pension company and had cases where people had to pay back a lot of money.

FortunesFave · 28/03/2021 21:05

Scam. They have obviously got access to the company's records and found the details of your Mother's payments. And even if it were NOT a scam I suspect they can't get the money back anyway.

Original poster
Helpmymum · 28/03/2021 21:05

@GabsAlot this is the problem, she is the type of person who doesn't open/ check bank statements, she doesn't do online banking etc and with being ill and old she just doesn't keep on top things. I have tried to question her about what she thought the payment was exactly for the past twenty years, did she notice it had stopped, can she remember cashing out the bond etc etc but she has just said she doesn't know and is getting really upset so I don't want to push her. The most she has said is that any payments going in, she just presumed the financial advisor had sorted out. Her memory isn't great and she's admitted that when the financial advisor sends her things to sign she just does it without any thought 😭.

OP posts:
Original poster
Helpmymum · 28/03/2021 21:08

Yes have tried googling the number and scam and nothing is coming up. Tried googling the company name and scam and it just pulls up a section on their website with advice about scams/ fraud. Is there anything else I can do? Checked the envelope again (it was a big a4 size with cardboard backing) and it was delivered via tnt express.

OP posts:
Babyroobs · 28/03/2021 21:09

If it is the companies error, then they have some responsibility for this. For it to have been going on for years unnoticed is very negligent on their part.

Staffy1 · 28/03/2021 21:09

Wouldn't the financial adviser have to accept some responsibility for this?

FlyingBurrito · 28/03/2021 21:13

@Babyroobs

If it is the companies error, then they have some responsibility for this. For it to have been going on for years unnoticed is very negligent on their part.
Whilst it may have been negligent to have set up the account wrongly in the first place is it negligent not to have noticed?

I don't receive any pensions or investments or any thing like that but if I did I wouldn't expect the company to keep checking with me that I was getting them. Is that some thing that's routinely done?

AcornAutumn · 28/03/2021 21:15

[quote Helpmymum]@GabsAlot this is the problem, she is the type of person who doesn't open/ check bank statements, she doesn't do online banking etc and with being ill and old she just doesn't keep on top things. I have tried to question her about what she thought the payment was exactly for the past twenty years, did she notice it had stopped, can she remember cashing out the bond etc etc but she has just said she doesn't know and is getting really upset so I don't want to push her. The most she has said is that any payments going in, she just presumed the financial advisor had sorted out. Her memory isn't great and she's admitted that when the financial advisor sends her things to sign she just does it without any thought 😭. [/quote]
How old is she? I think, if she's been taking money she isn't owed, it's going to be hard to claim age as a factor.

Midlifelady · 28/03/2021 21:15

Scam. Plus if legit their error and they'd have insurance.

MyCatLovesFish · 28/03/2021 21:16

They can claim a maximum of 6 years of payments,, but it is their mistake and it was not unreasonable of your mother to expect the payments (important in these payment cases). They need to write it off.

As PP have said, make them tell you the circumstances then say you want everything in writing. Do not rely on a phone call. Make sure they know your mum is elderly and frail and does not have the money. Tell them you will be seeking legal advice (and do so).

I think there is a very strong likelihood they will give up at this point. If they don't and insist on taking this to court, there is a high chance they will lose and they know that. Professional financial organisation apparently unable to manage their finances correctly for 20 years vs old lady with good reason to believe she was entitled to the payments. The court will not be rushing to take their side.

FlyingBurrito · 28/03/2021 21:17

@Midlifelady

Scam. Plus if legit their error and they'd have insurance.
Insurance for what? Is there such a thing as insurance against mistakes?
VaVaGloom · 28/03/2021 21:19

Your poor Mum & you must be fraught with worry. Try and reassure her it will all be resolved and she’s not to blame. Her financial adviser mustn’t be much good if he’s not flagged this up over the years!

WetWeekends · 28/03/2021 21:21

@thesandwich

Check if she has legal cover with her house insurance. Could be useful
This is a very good idea.
TellingBone · 28/03/2021 21:23

Have they been deducting tax at source from this bond income? If so, in whose name have they been paying the tax they collected?

If it wasn't deducted at source has your Mum been declaring this income?

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