Anyone at (or been at) ARGC?

[Jamtea123]

Hello, I'm looking for some insights into ARGC from people who are/have been patients there please! After a couple of disastrous cycles elsewhere, we're considering ARGC for one last go.

I know it's 'boot camp' style and staff are not the hand holding type, which I can live with. But I have some more specific questions I would be so grateful if anyone can help with?...

You have to go in for scans and bloods every day (including Sundays)? From your baseline scan onwards is it? Do you ever have to come in twice a day?

Are wait times for bloods and scans long? I've heard you don't get appointment times, it's first come, first served, is that true? Is this the reason its hard to work at the same time as cycling there? Has anyone carried on working throughout?

What's the average wait time for scan/bloods if you turn up at 8 or 9am for example?

I know it's super expensive due to the immunes they put people on after transfer, is that right? But from what I've seen I think the costs up to that point are comparable to elsewhere? I can't seem to make decent blasts so I don't want to pay a fortune if I don't even get to transfer.

Finally, are you glad you went there? Did you go due to failures elsewhere? I love my current clinic but I do think the daily monitoring may help me.

Thank you in advance!!

Hi @Jamtea123 I have done 3 rounds of treatment at ARGC, 2 fresh and 1 frozen. The first was in 2018 followed by an NHS cycle that was successful. Last year we did a FET resulting in miscarriage and we did a fresh cycle that failed in March. We are now switching clinics but more because we need a change.

Firstly I'm not sure why ARGC have a reputation for not being hand holding. In my experience they are the most supportive of the nursing teams I have come across. It is different to other clinics in that your treatment is all directed by Mr T and the consultants but you don't see them much - you mostly see nurses or more junior Drs for scans. Personally I'm fine with that. You see different people every time but all the nurses are lovely, they give you loads of time, you can phone them and talk things through as much as you like. Other clinics I have been to are more like an NHS service where they are polite and efficient but there is no other interaction beyond the clinical one.

Yes you will have bloods every morning during stims. In the second week they ask you to be within 30 mins of the clinic to go back in as needed. I have actually only been called back in 2 or 3 times across 3 cycles but you do have to be available.

The blood clinic opens at 7:30am on weekdays and I think 8:30am on weekends. They open the doors earlier for queuing. The earliest I've arrived is 7:10 and I've still not been first!!! If you get there super early you could be done by 8. My office is in Aldgate so when I was working I could be at my desk by 8:30. If you get there at say 7:45 you could wait 30-40 mins for bloods or possibly up to an hour but because it is so early you can usually still get to work. You could also potentially wait for scans but I've rarely waited that long. Other clinics have given me appointment times but kept me waiting longer.

It is possible to work through it if your work is nearby and if you are able to take a personal phone call and inject as needed. I would take off the second week of stims though as it can be a bit much to juggle.

ARGC isn't expensive per item but it gets more expensive because they do a lot more. Bloods daily adds up. You take way more drugs than elsewhere which also costs a lot and the immunes is super pricey. If you have a failed cycle (obviously not the aim) it could only cost you around £1800 for immunes - that is one blood test plus IVIG. Nearly everyone needs treatment so you may as well budget for it. However if you get pregnant they will test you and treat you every three weeks so it gets expensive.

ARGC are amazing but they work on a system of marginal gains ie if 5% of transfers fail due ro a particular issue, they will treat everyone for it just in case. So you end up taking a lot of drugs you may not need - but one of them could just make the difference to getting you your baby.

BTW ARGC like to do early transfers. If you have only a few embryos they will transfer on day 2 or 3. They say that embryos do better inside the body and a small proportion may not make it outside so why risk it. It may all be true but I find it too emotional doing transfers when I don't even know if it would have got to blastocyst stage. That is one of the reasons we are moving.

I think ARGC are amazing. They are Mavericks and they will do anything to get you your baby whatever the cost (financial or emotional).

There is a FB group you can join or feel free to ask me more questions xxx

@Jamtea123 I know this thread is a couple of months old but I am going for bloods at argc now and generally I'm in and out in around 15 mins. I've been getting there between 7:30am and 8am. Weekends I've waited longer but then I'm not in such a rush then. Hope that helps

The immune testing and treatment alone was thousands. It would have delayed our treatment by months, months we could not afford to lose. I took Humira, got a raging sinus infection which spread to the bone in my face because my immune system was suppressed. After all that, my 'cytokines' actually INCREASED.

Needless to say, I did not go back to them for treatment. Ignored cytokines, had treatment at a different but excellent clinic with no immune medications whatsoever, had PGS and now have an almost 2 year old.

If you are put on the immune medications, do try to seek independent medical advice before taking them. I wish I had!

@Jamtea123

I have just finished a cycle with ARGC. The cycle resulted in a BFN. Please message me privately and I will happily answer your questions.

Hello. I am also considering them for a last last last attempt but I am 43 years old and wondering if even worth it…

Hi @Anxiousbuthopeful we've met before I think on other threads. ARGC is a particular approach and is especially relevant for women who have had recurrent miscarriage or multiple failures. I'm sorry but I can't quite remember your situation.

I always say that decisions about IVF are all about peace of mind. If it works then amazing. But if it doesn't, will I feel happy with the choices I made. I actually left ARGC because I just had a instinct that I wasn't going to get pregnant there - it is probably nonsense but I knew that if I failed there I'd always wish I had followed my instinct. So that's how I make my decisions!!!

Best of luck whatever you decide xxx

Hey j know this is an old thread but just wondering if you have to have the immune testing there?

Is this obligatory?

Thank you x

@Annadance no you don't have to have immune testing. I did a fresh cycle and an FET without immune testing or treatment. They obviously recommend it as that is their standard protocol but you can choose not to and they won't pressure you beyond giving their initial advice

Best of luck x

@Jamtea123 thanks so much that’s really good to know x

Hi
We have been using ARGC. It’s been a lengthy and expensive process. Based on our six months or so we’ve frozen sperm, eggs and now embryos, tried IUI (not IVF yet) and gone through weeks of morning injections and they are good, sometimes communication is a bit spotty and contradictory (esp when it comes to costs), but overall positive. We are going to try IVF with them but it does feel like every time we get a call they want more money. And when they ask for money it isn’t a few quid here or there, it’s hundreds, or over a thousand sometimes. That causes more stress than anything. Virtually all the staff are excellent, and we would recommend them. But the costs are meaning if we do have a baby through them it won’t be going to a good university lol as it’s college fund has been spent making her/him (joke).

Further to this, after a conversation with ARGC they have been misleading us I believe on the costs. Having gone through everything to the point of having our embryos frozen we were told that our final bill was our final bill, but suddenly a new four figure bill appeared and we have been told because of the way we interpreted the process (i.e. them not being clear) the costs for actual implantation is going to be another 4 figure sum, and we may need more meds (£££) and need a hysteroscopy again they charge for. More bloods £££. And we are starting to feel they are basically partying every time the phone goes.

Wow lists of very useful posts here! I’m about to start my IVF journey after several years of TTC. I’m 34 and both my partner and I have been tested by NHS… there have been no abnormalities.

im looking to book my initial consultation; should I be booking in for any tests before this appointment? My interpretation of the website, is that there’s quite a long list! Not sure why you’d be expected to pay ££s for checks before you even have a conversation! Please can someone confirm what I need to do?

Hello,

I’m 35 and currently with ARGC at the moment.

nothing is expected from you at the initial consultation. The doctor will run through your history of you and your partner and get an idea of where you’re at in your journey. This is your chance to ask any questions you have.

During the monitoring cycle you will be required to do a list of initial tests.

Good luck x

Thank you @Love31 😊
I’ve got my consultation all booked in, how long after that does it start? Do they give you time to mull over the info? Given popularity I assume if you want to proceed there would be a bit of a cap… took 3 weeks to Judy get a foot in!

Hey, I’m currently in my first week of stimming at ARGC- so far I’m really happy with the service we’ve been getting.

We haven’t felt pressured at all… we had the consultation and waited 1 month before I started… they were fine with it. Just had to go in on day 1 of my period.

This is our first cycle… we looked at the nhs but felt it would take too long and potentially give us no results. Neither my partner or I have had anything identified as abnormal/ low… therefore I’m not sure whether I should start immunology testing or not?! I’m thinking against it as it’s first cycle and if I don’t do it, I have some funds towards a 2nd cycle… any advice?!

@ChipButton welcome and good luck with the cycle. Immunes is a tough one and depends on your circumstances I think.

We were similar to you. Did our first cycle at ARGC in Jan 2018 assuming NHS wait times would be long. It turned out they weren't long and we then had an NHS cycle at Guys in April 2018 which resulted in our daughter.

We didn't do immunes on our first cycle. I was convinced that it would show up positive for needing treatment but that it probably did for everyone regardless of whether they needed it or not. Our second cycle at Guys had no immunes and was successful.

However we have since been trying for a second and have had lots of failures which made me reconsider immunes. I am now at a different clinic but under Mr Shehata for immunes. Part of me wishes I had done immunes sooner when we started with our second as I wonder if we could have avoided failures. We can never know but I've done embryo banking since and had a reasonably high number of euploids (healthy embryos) for my age. That has made me question the fact that from our initial cycles we had 6 blastocysts (approx) but only one birth - is it really likely that the other 5 were unhealthy given that I was younger or could it have been connected to immunes.

Sorry if that is rather a complex answer. It's hard to explain concisely. Immunes are very very expensive, there's no doubt about that. But it may save you from having failures too.

I think it depends on your situation. How old you are, whether you have had previous losses etc.

There is a FB group if you're not aware called ARGC Support Group - lots of people on there who can advise too x

thanks, I’m 34. No losses… just couldn’t conceive naturally after 2 years. All results have been clear/ within range so far

Hello again, glad you took the leap. I didn’t do immunes but I’m 35 and had low amh levels. I also didn’t have any previous losses or any concerns. Luckily it paid off for me as I’m currently 18w with twins. But I know i would have kicked myself if the cycle wasn’t successful and I didn’t do the immunes as I’d always be wondering what if.

i also don’t think they are very transparent about costings following a positive test. The immunes can typically go on until week 20 plus. Some thing I wasn’t made privy to at the beginning. Good luck. Xx

Awww glad to hear it all worked out for you @Love31

i think I’m going to try without immunes- 20 weeks just isn’t affordable for me right now. If I had to do another cycle then I could consider funding it too then.

I too think my AMH is on the low side but it’s in range… the only other update I’ve had is that my ovaries are “deep”

i guess you’ll never know whether you’ve made the right decision till you fall pregnant!

Hi All, jumping on this old thread…..I’m about to have my consultation tomorrow with ARGC and wondered if anyone could share what they paid totally? Obviously this varies for everyone but I didn’t know if it was closer to £30k or £15k these days? Do you have to pay the total upfront? Thanks in advance xxx

Hiya,

Like you said it really depends on your situation, the problem is that unless you’ve had something diagnostic before you even start; it’s hard to determine the cost- not great when you’re determining if you can afford it and trying to avoid being stressed once you’ve started!

My recommendation is to go in with some contingency…

Here’s our situation:

my husband and I are both under 40, no indication of any abnormality and this was our 1st IVF Cycle.
I’ve had the embryo transfer and am in the 2 week wait for pregnancy test.

our total costs end to end at clinic: £11,980
pharmacy cost: ~ £1k

I’d say I’ve been really lucky so far - I’ve not been asked to take loads of meds… some ladies I hear have 6+ injections a day! I pretty much had 1-2 jabs a day and then 3 post transfer.

I didn’t go for immunes… the clinic left this decision up to us and we never felt pushed or that we should have done it. They were supportive - there was no evidence in our resolve that suggested the immunology would make a huge change. Therefore we thought we’d try without and worse case use that money for another round.

Best of luck with your journey and if you have any questions, feel free to reach out xxx

@R55 my first IVF cycle with no immunes aged 41 was similar to @CurlySue7 at about £12. I also didn't need many drugs as I stim easily. That induces a hysteroscopy which ARGC always want to do before you start treatment with them.

My second a couple of years later included immunes and was probably closer to £14-15k but since then IVIG has become a lot more pricey so if you do immunes and IVIG the cost increases hugely. It also depends if you get pregnant or not. Our rounds didn't work so the costs stopped. If you are successful and do immunes then you'll be doing Chicago tests plus IVIG/intralipids every 3 weeks so that massively increases the costs.

I would suggest joining the FB group ARGC support group where you can ask others.

Best of luck x

Thanks so much @Janefx40 @CurlySue7 ❤️. Fingers crossed for you @CurlySue7 xxx

Thank you but sadly we weren’t one of the lucky ones…. No explanation “yet” which makes it tough!
but it’s my first cycle and we all go in knowing there is a chance we’ll not conceive… luckily my husband has been absolutely amazing - if you’re going through this, support makes the world of a difference.

for those of you who did immunology, would you mind sharing what actually happened, how long for, etc? feel a bit clueless! We decided not too…

I can’t fault the clinic… i think we will be continuing with them but want to do something slightly different this time so I don’t feel guilty.

wishing you all lots of baby dust x

Hi girls, could you explain what immuns are ? How are they by them?