Embryo Banking Support Thread / PGS wait

[ForeverAintEnough]

Hi all, I’ve just name changed but I’ve been on here loads and chatting to many of you under different user names ( irrational fear of being outed!). I wondered if there was interest in a ‘no transfer happening’ group? So those doing embryo banking or PGS or whatever.

I’ve just done one round of embryo banking and found the normal threads difficult with discussion of hoping for a Christmas pregnancies etc.

We are unfortunately taking the long way round with 3 rounds and no transfer. It looks like my first transfer might not be until June 2021.

If anyone wants to jump on feel free!

About us: Me 34, DH 36, TTC 3 years. Both male and female issues. x3 rounds of IVF all failed. Moved clinic to Lister for 3 rounds of embryo banking and PGS. One round of embryo banking just finished with x3 blasts sent off for PGS testing.

@Sara279 That’s good news, I do think the day 3 call is quite stressful because they give a lot of info about grades & cells etc, so it’s always a lot to take in...plus if I think for most of us, once they say some embryos haven’t made it, it’s hard to keep concentrating without panicking, even when the rest of the call is good news!

I’m not taking any supplements except Pregnacare, but I have heard for other issues, not fertility related, that taking a lot of different supplements can react against each other and cause heartburn or digestion problems. I suppose it’s all about weighing up the side effects vs benefits. Fingers crossed for day 5 x

Hi ladies!

Just had a bit of a catch up on all the messages - I ended up delaying my cycle by a month to have more time for the supplements to work. So it’s felt a bit early to join in on the retrieval chat :)

Sounds like there’s been a lot of good news in the last few weeks. With all the surrounding stress too. Reminding me of what I yet to come! I’ll be starting stims in 5 weeks or so, so next retrieval around the end of March.

I’m a bit conflicted. My doc has advised batching two or three cycles. But if I get a normal one, I’m not sure why I wouldn’t go ahead with the transfer? Any ideas?? Tbh, this is our first self funded round, and it’s eye watering!! For some reason it’s more expensive to go a freeze all than to do a fresh transfer. And then I’ll have to pay for the transfer on top of it! Just doesn’t make sense me to - any else having similar??

Hello @Lepatz, hopefully this month will go quickly and you'll be ready to start again soon. The PGS results wait is killing me, especially during this winter lockdown. Have been on a mad deep clean of the house this weekend just to pass time!

With PGS they tend to suggest banking so you have enough embryos to make it worthwhile, as results can be fairly low when you're over 40. Maybe 2 cycles would be worthwhile. I wish i had this option, Create only have 3 cycle packages, which besides the cost, adds to the time involved.

@Lepatz hope the 5-weeks go quickly for you. IVF is a rollercoaster and it does dominate your life. Did you doctor not explain why they suggested batching? I am doing batching because of my age (41) and also my AMH was low. I had a failed round on the NHS at maximum stims 450 menapur but had terrible results. I decided to take a different approach with these rounds and I am doing low stims 150 bemfola with Create Fertility and got much better results on my first cycle with them. Will have to wait until tomorrow to find out if any have made it to blastocyst for my second cycle. Honestly, it's so worrying. I think if you did sign up for batching and then changed your mind and wanted to transfer one and not batch then the clinic would probably support you with that. Good luck x

Hi everyone, so none of the 5 have made blastocysts yet so they are leaving them overnight to see if they make it by tomorrow. They said we have 2 x early blastocyst and 2 x morullas and 1 x degenerating. I'm gutted obviously but still holding out that we might get some good news tomorrow. My knowldge of day 6 v day 5 is very poor. Do any of you know anything about day 6's? Obviously, at this stage we don't even know if we'll have anything. I'm so disappointed x

@Sara279 Sorry it’s disappointing news, it’s really stressful. I know I definitely had some day 6 blasts and have sent some off for PGS as they became decent quality in the end. I’ve heard day 6 is not as favourable, but I haven’t researched it a lot, so I don’t know how true it is, plus day 6 or lower grade blasts can still be PGS normal, so I’d say don’t lose all hope just yet x

Thanks @IslandStars I will try and keep my hopes up. Just finding it all too much right now :( just got a message from my auntie saying with a photo of her new grandson delivered today... my sister in law is due with her second in April. Just feel like I’m failing :( x

@Sara279 know how you feel, the PGS results wait is getting to me too, I’m not sleeping well this week. Also getting sent lots of pics from family of my nephew & niece playing in the snow, which is fantastic because they mean everything to me, but it’s touching a nerve today with all this worry that I might never do the same with my kids

We just have to keep going, I’m sure one of your early blasts will make it at least x

Hi @Sara279, don't know if this reassures you - my clinic has said they've found negligible difference in success rates of day five versus day six embryos. The embryo I'm transferring next month is a PGS tested day sixer.

Also @Sara279, on day five I had six embryos that were still going but weren't at blast stage. Five of them made it to biopsy on day six.

@msgloria and @IslandStars thank you for your supportive messages. I’m keeping everything crossed that we get some blastocysts tomorrow. I hope your PGS embryos come back normal island stars and I hope your PGS tested 6 day embryo is the one for you msgloria. We got a 5 day 4AB and 6 day 3CC last round, we were really just hoping for the same or better really. Xx

Hi everyone, just wanted to update you all. The embryologist rang at the end of the day to let me know that one was a fully expanded 4BB, so they were freezing that.. she said one of our embryos had started to hatch but then died (necrotic) and that two didn't progress passed the morula stage however one was an early blastocyst but was of poor quality and she didn't recommend freezing it though offered it as a choice to me... anyway we had quite a long chat because I was feeling a little emotional (she was very lovely) and towards the end of the chat she asked to put me on hold and when she came back she said that the embryo had started to expand and had 'extruded' some cells and was now looking a better quality so they have decided to give it a chance and freeze it. So we have a 4BB and 3BC. So relieved. She said that in her opinion there was no difference between day 5's and day 6's and that all embryos that make it to blastocyst are strong.

I'd heard it discussed somewhere that embryos can correct itself and send the rubbish faulty bits to the outer cell layer, so this must be what they mean by that. Anyway, I'm pleased with the result. Hopefully will sleep better tonight now. My nerves are in tatters! xx

@Sara279 So pleased the cycle has worked out for you, two blasts are two blasts, they all count! A lot of embryologists seem to take the view that if it’s good enough to freeze, it’s good enough to implant, so it’s great to get 2 in the bag.

I think embryos keep improving too, so if they are destined to work, even lower grade blasts will continue to develop once thawed. Enjoy a good nights sleep now x

Thanks @IslandStars just finished some work so going for a walk now and then having another long bath! Thanks for the support and hope you are ok. When do you find out the results? xx

@Sara279 Sounds perfect, good way to relax. I’m ok thanks, trying to stay a bit calmer today, think I let the worry overtake me this week. Hopefully get my results in around 2 weeks time x

Hi Ladies! Sorry I've been quiet it's been an emotional few days and we've literally just had our follow up call with the consultant.

We were quite shocked to get one average blastocyst from this cycle. We thought, how can we do a blastocyst freezing package if we just get one from each cycle? It doesn't make financial sense. However the consultant showed me clinic data and out of all their patients (thousands) only 30% have blastocysts available to freeze. This is exactly what we were told at our local NHS clinic. So, although we recieved much better care, the outcomes appear similar.

At my last NHS clinic round I got 3 good blasts from 4 eggs so I assumed it would be the same for my partner at a private clinic. So I guess we've got decisions to make about whether to do any more freezing! We currently have two frozen in total.

Hi all! I hope you are well.
I am sorry i have been quiet, this week was difficult for me, as my brother welcomed his second child, a little girl. I was very sad, and though a lot about our lost baby girl.
I don't have much experience, yet, with blastocyte quality as my embryos are frozen at day 3^^ looking forward to the end of my second cycle to see the results of the future PGT-A.... I am learning a lot from you though. The wait for results must be very hard..
Take care xx
S.

@MrsC2019 Sorry it hasn't gone as well as hoped. I've read that around 35% of eggs made blastocyst on average, so i can understand you would have hoped for more than 1, but things can vary each round. If you got 3 blasts from 4 eggs last time, that is really impressive. Maybe you could do the next round too? I'm not sure if that was what you was planning anyway, but i remember you wanted to share the rounds with your partner so you both have some embryos.

@Sophfr17 Sorry you've had a tough week, it must be very difficult after your loss. Don't be too hard on yourself, there must be lots of mixed emotions as it's such a happy occasion for brother, but you can never forget your loss x

Hi everyone. Seems like everyone is having a rubbish time. @MrsC2019 sorry to hear that you only got one blast. It’s really disappointing isn’t it. Can I ask how old you are? My clinic told me (age 41) that they would expect approx 25% of my day 3 embryos to make it to blastocysts. It’s hard. I know I’ve struggled this cycle. I didn’t think we were going to have any and then got two day 6’s. The other thing is that I’m doing banking because I know my chances are slim with single rounds, so I’m doing three to hopefully improve my chances. I was told by Create the three rounds together would give me approx 30% chance of having a baby. It’s still quite low isn’t it :((((

I also had a long chat with my embryologist the other day and she told me I needed to change my mindset because she said most women my age don’t make blastocysts and that I’m lucky that I do. That the clinic is really pleased because out of all the eggs they have selected the strongest embryo and have a blastocyst. She also said they often don’t see much difference in blastocyst rates between 7-10 eggs or 15-20 eggs. Anyway whatever she said made me feel better. She was really nice.

It’s the thought of it not working and then having to go through more rounds that gets to me. I don’t know how much I’ll have left to give after these three rounds... but will give these rounds my best shot.

@Sophfr17 my sister in law is due a baby girl in April and none of my family know. I also had a family member text me a photo of a distant family member’s newborn this week and a close uni friend has recently given birth. Also I’ve a couple of neighbours that have had babies in lockdown. It’s really hard. Sometimes I feel so bitter and twisted but it’s just sadness that I haven’t got what they have. All we can do is try and keep a balanced view and heart :(

I only slept 3.5 hours last night. Currently in bed... having a lot of stress with something that unfortunately is hard to distance myself from. Hopefully I’ll sleep through tonight. Are any of you doing anything nice for valentines?

I think I’ll make my other half some food and we’ll probably go for a nice walk. Xx

That should say, ‘none of my family know I’m doing IVF’ so no one in the family is sensitive to what I’m going through x

Morning everyone!

I hope the weekend has been as nice as it can be We walked about six or seven miles on Saturday. We were freezing! Not the best idea in the snow! We've just been trying to process everything amd adjust to a new short term plan.

Our plan was to bank embryos for convenience so we could take a break from treatment, possibly move house and enjoy a bit of life post lockdown! We have been having treatment since I was 33. I had one round of ivf age 33 (2019) and one round age 34 (2020). This was at our local nhs clinic and on my first round I had 5 blastocysts. I had one 4BA transferred but the others weren't good enough to freeze (strict criteria - must be at least 3BB grade by 11am on day 5). On my second round I had three blastocysts, which thankfully met their strict criteria. Sadly, on my fresh transfers I lost my womb lining 7 days post transfer (due to progesterone issues) so my first real shot with the extra progesterone was last November and I had a chemical pregnany. We wanted to bank embryos with a good private clinic instead, to take a break from everything really. I've still got one frozen blast from the last round.

In relation to my partners cycle this month, We had to do ICSI on this round because the donor sperm count turned out to be so low. Our consultant said that the quality of the egg is responsible for getting it to day 3, then the male dna takes over and is respinsible for getting it to day 5. As we had 4 grade one embryos on day 3 he thinks the outcome could be related to sperm issues. However, he can't be certain because this is based on 4 embryos not 10.

We used the same donor for my round last year and we got 3 grade 3BB embryos on day 5 from 4 embryos. Although we didn't need to do icsi it was IVF. Consultant said the good outcome could be related to the sample on that occasion being good quality.

We have one vial of sperm left from this donor and we've been told by Xytex (Sperm bank) that they do not expect him to donate again..

I know we've not got one child yet but we'd like the option to have a sibling of possible, and we would want them to have the same donor. So the best plan we can come up with is to transfer my 3BB and if it doesn't take transfer the 4BC (Partners embryo). I am worried about the quality of the sperm but we feel like we need to use these embryos up before changing donors/doing more treatment. We both turned 35 a couple of months ago. I'm booked in for an endometrial scratch early next month and the first transfer should take place April time. Xx

It's not ideal but I feel like we're backed into a corner a bit with the decision. We have two blastocysts that we don't want to waste so to speak.

@MrsC2019 Hello, glad you've been able to make the most of the situation and come to a decision, must be awful to have this thrown on you unexpectedly.

For what it's worth, i would do the same too and transfer what you have. If they don't work, at least you know you tried to salvage these rounds and then you can move on with a different donor if need be. You're both still young enough to get plenty more blasts x

@Sara279 Create told me my chance were 30% too, but said if i do PGS, it could increase it to 60-70% which is why i went for it. Makes sense, but all hinders on whether i can find normal embryos from my 3 cycles. If not, i think i will keep trying this year, as my egg to blast rate is good and at 42 will probably be my last decent year.

@Sophfr17 Hope you have a better week, emotions must be running high with a new baby in the family. It's really tough managing everything IVF throws at you. I seem to think about the process all day long, even with work as a distraction.

Hi everyone!

I see times are hard for everyone right now... god ivf is so hard, i am already thinking what if i got nothing at the end of round 2 next month, and that the few i have at Day 3 dont grow to day 5, or that they appear all abnormal?

I can't stop thinking about what could happen badly, cause to be honest, the worst happened to us in the last 2 years with 6 losses; i dont find positivity in all this.

I just hate it. Am I am so jealous at my friends, at my oldest brother with his cute little girl. Being in lockdown is good for me, i dont have to see anyone. Also we live in London and my family is in France, so it is even easier. I feel like a monster sometimes, jealous of people's normal life and little problems... It is so unfair.

But I know you know what I mean, how could we be positive about that? I know how incredibly lucky we are however; for example, PGS is not allowed in France...

Just a bad monday i guess.... but we are moving into a bigger flat next week, little excitement yeah! I just couldn't stay in this flat where the worst happened, we sort of need a fresh start.

Take care all, I hope we will all get there eventually. You are all so strong, you have been through so much with IVF already.... i am new to this and i am already imagining the worst haha :(

xx
S.

Hi ladies,

How’s everyone been? I finally got my PGS results and will start FET early next month. I got 2 normal embryos, thankfully. Out of 13 embryos, the consultant said he would have expected 3, but just goes to show how statistics do not always work out. I had exceeded expectation up to now, so it’s swings and roundabouts, I’m just very grateful for my 2 normal and will focus on them. I have some high level mosaic too, but unlikely I’ll be able to consider them for transfer.

Hi @IslandStars!

I think 2 normal embryos is very good, i hope i will have the same outcome in a few months!

My consultant told me yesterday that he wants me to have 12 blastocytes, eventually, in order to get 2 normal embryos, so to me it looks very good :) I would be happy about that result. However i totally understand your slight disappointment.

I am currently doing downregulation, in order to start stims in 2 weeks. I am struggling a lot this time with Norethisterone (5 mg twice a day), and my Dr told me to reduce to 5 mg per day instead, since I had a psychotic episode due to progesterone many years ago....

i spent hours online of course, trying to see if 5 mg is enough to downregulate the cycle, but all i can see is 10-15mg per day. I am worried this cycle will fail because of that.

I hope you girls are all okay :)

S.