Cameron defends hunt

[Pineberry]

oh dear

I don't dispute peoples personal opinions on the rights and wrongs of hunting, everyone is entitled to have an opinion. I mean that Labour's reason for going along with the ban was class based, as well as the fact that the animal-rights loonies had contributed millions to Labours's election campaign - effectively "buying" the debate.

Foxes are vermin and indescriminate killers - a friend of my boss' wife had a litter of puppies killed by a fox in broad daylight a few years ago. She had left them in a pen in the garden for 10 minutes and when she came back they were all dead.

The fact is that many people think foxes are cute because they look like dogs. If we were talking about rats being hunted by dogs there wouldn't be half as many people professing themselves to be anti-hunting.

Sorry cavemum but I was a saboteur for years and have never once mentioned 'toffs'. I prefer to call them wankers. Ever seen a pack of hounds tear apart a 2 week old fox cub? I have, believe me it is not a pretty site.

ROFL at I could bag him from the kitchen

I don't know enough about hunting on either side to let it influence my vote

But it does seem like a waste of time to just bat back and forth banning and then un-banning something

Urrgh too much wine! *sight

nothing to do with class

the 'vermin' argument don't hold no weight either

people like the 'sport' that is the hunt

folk should have the courage of their convictions if they wish to defend the hunt and not hide behind 'nasty' fox hurt my mates puppies'

fox hurts puppies = natural
group of humans hounds and horses tear fox apart = unnatural

Ask most people who hunt want they are there for and they will tell you that they are there for the ride. Most people on a hunt never even see a fox, so to paint them all as blood-thirsty killers is just ridiculous.

A fox often kills for pleasure not just food. When a fox gets into a chicken coop he will usually kill every bird before taking one for food. Try telling the farmer who has lost countless chickens and lambs to foxes that it's just natural and he should accept it.

Most antis like to claim they are fighting for animal rights but tell me why a group in Gloucestershire broke into a hunt kennel and tried to poison the hounds or why some sabateurs throw stones at the horses. Do their animal rights not count?!

As I said before, there are many more pressing and horrific animal rights issues than that of fox hunting, but people seem to get obsessed by the topic.

Cavemum

Just seems so pointless

Most animal rights stuff is about helping humans- drug trials etc not 'sport'

I think that is what upsets people

Pineberry

As I said I've never hunted so have no vested interest in the pursuit, but I respect your right to disagree with it.

Have a good rest of the weekend!

and you Cavemum

Oh, really, most hunters are just along for the ride? Here's an idea... why not just go for a ride, then?

Wasn't aware that foxhunting had been effectively banned. I life on the West Mids/North West border and believe me fox hunting is alive and well. Piddly little hunt that no-one bothers monitoring but they're still out 2-3 times per week and still regularly "accidentally" catching foxes.

Plenty of 'em are indeed just "along for the ride" and have never seen a kill, in fact I know several who say they wouldn't be able to bear to look, but they still go along nonetheless. And they go to the hunt ball and turn out like goons for the Boxing Day spectacle.

None of these people have any interest in freedom of speech, just in pursuing their own interests, most of which are purely social. It's bog all to do with pest control and everything to do with their perception of a good day out. If hunting on horseback is such effective and humane pest control why don't these people gallop after rabbits with a pack of dogs? Not such a good chase is it?

Tally bloody ho indeed.

Another country person who loathes the hunt here. Arrogant, snobbish, selfish, ineffective, cruel, noisy pests.

"If hunting on horseback is such effective and humane pest control why don't these people gallop after rabbits with a pack of dogs? Not such a good chase is it?"

well they gallop after hares, bit similar

here's our lot the Waveney Harriers getting told off in the Independent

it's a silly circular chase, but yes, and some people raise hares specifically for this purpose

have more sympathy with fox hunting as fox has a sporting chance and pest control aside, it is ultimately a sport

am having 2nd thoughts about which way to vote now though, after those awful comments about same sex couples in B&Bs - is enough to turn any Tory into a communist

Spot on about the hens, riven. Ludicrous that the hunting brigade, who pride themselves in being unsentimental about foxes, should attribute human emotions to them like that.
Where I grew up, rabbits are a terrible pest, foxes help to keep them down.

you didn't hear about Chris Grayling? here

"it is ultimately a sport"

I think if you get your thrills from chasing terrified animals down to their tearing-apart death, then there's something very very wrong with you.

It's definitely not a sport.

That's not to say I don't think there's a need to control the numbers of certain animals in the countryside but to enjoy the suffering of animals is twisted.

But this issue not ever going to alter the way I vote anyway.

oi no need to get your knickers in a twist, nobody ever gets converted from one side to another during these discussions anyway - think it is possible to disagree without thinking someone holding an opposing view is horribly flawed

Are people aware that quite substantial tracts of land can be taken from a tenant farmer under 'resumption' and used for hunting.

We are forbidden to work these bits of land - some of them right in the middle of our crop fields- but still have to pay rent for them. Plus the damage done by thousands of tame pheasants (and the rats that are attracted to their feed).

I just wanted to illustrate where some of these shoots took place.

commercial shoots make such a mess

I must admit am v puzzled by today's syndicates, the effort and £££ spent to raise game for people who don't even eat it or know how to prepare it seems wrong

There is a Mumsnet discussion on Chris Grayling here. It's pretty long though!

Personally I think what was said was stupid, but I genuinely think he "miss-spoke". To call him homophobic is ridiculous as he has a 100% record of voting pro-gay rights in Parliament - not the actions of a raging homophobe!
I dislike the way Labour have jumped on the "all Tories are homophobes" wagon. Firstly, at no stage was Chris Grayling talking about Tory policy and secondly since when did one person speak for a whole party?

Anyhoo, I agree that no one is going to change their mind over matters like the hunting debate, but I DO think anyone basing their vote purely on the hunting issue needs to get a grip! Education, the NHS, the armed forces etc are far more important topics. Yes I will be voting Tory, but it has absolutely nothing to do with David Cameron's position on hunting.

I'd like to take issue with what Lite wrote about bits and bridles - a properly measured and fitted bit does no damage to a horse's mouth at all.

My horse used to be on a yard where quite a few people went hunting - they were, if memory serves, a nurse, a social worker, a teacher and a lift-fitter. No class war there. However, the rest of the yard didn't hunt because, largely, we thought it was cruel, dangerous and particularly ineffective as a method of pest control.

It's not a town vs. country thing, many country people dislike the hunt and are vocal in their dislike.

I'm glad it's been banned and it annoys me that these selfish gits are finding workarounds to satisfy their bloodlust.

As someone said further up the thread - if you want a nice fast ride with a few jumps in the countryside, there are plenty of places to go and do that. An animal doesn't need to die because of it. I've known pet cats and dogs torn apart by hounds when they've been unfortunate enough to get in their way/be in their gardens as the hunt's gone by.

(As for drag-hunting - are you insane?? Do you know how fast the horses go when there's no natural breaks with the dogs losing scent etc? I've known grown men grow pale at the thought of drag-hunting...)