WARNING v upsetting: The Doncaster Boys., who were attacked..

[ElenorRigby]

a case from last year...
Here are the details, according a local paper.
Source

Its not pretty

"THE full horror of the terrifying and brutally violent attack on two young boys by a pair of brothers in secluded woodland in Doncaster last April has been revealed to a shocked courtroom.

A hearing at Sheffield Crown Court was yesterday given full and painfully graphic detail of the sadistic 90-minute attack by the then 10 and 11-year-old siblings involving a variety of weapons including branches, barbed wire, lit cigarettes and heavy rocks, which left one of their victims close to death and the other badly injured and deeply traumatised.

Members of the victims' families sobbed as the court was shown haunting video footage taken by the older brother on a stolen mobile phone midway through the attack. It showed his stricken 11-year-old victim shaking and covered in blood as he was prodded and taunted by the younger of the two brothers.

A child psychiatrist who had interviewed the younger brother later described him as "cold and calculating" in his ability to switch between seemingly good behaviour and acts of violence.

Dr Eileen Vizard told the court the boy represented a "high risk" to the public and warned that without prolonged and successful intervention by specialists he may have the potential to develop psychopathy.

The young perpetrators, now aged 11 and 12, were dressed smartly in shirts and ties and sat passively in the dock as their shocking catalogue of violence was laid out before a High Court judge, Mr Justice Keith.

The pair, who cannot be named for legal reasons, had pleaded guilty at an earlier hearing to counts of causing grievous bodily harm with intent, robbery and intentionally causing a child to engage in a sexual act. Charges of attempted murder were dropped.

The court heard how they came across their two young victims at a playground and lured them to a secluded area with the promise of showing them a dead fox.

Once there, the brothers subjected them to a vicious 90-minute attack using branches, sharpened sticks, barbed wire, broken glass, rocks weighing up to two stone, and pieces of metal.

Both victims were repeatedly hit with tree branches and fists as they lay cowering on the ground, the court heard. Their faces were stamped on and heavy rocks dropped on their heads.

At one stage the battered and bloodied victims were forced to attempt to perform sexual acts together.

Later, one was choked with a metal hoop, the older boy putting his foot on his victim's back "for extra leverage", said Nicholas Campbell QC, prosecuting. The younger victim was strangled with a clothes line.

The same victim eventually sustained a deep wound to his arm, which the older brother forced a lit cigarette into. When the terrified nine-year-old said he needed the toilet, he was forced to urinate on his friend's face.

The court heard that as the attack reached its climax, the younger victim was ordered to kill himself. He repeatedly rammed a sharpened stick into his own mouth before slumping against a tree.

His older friend was left for dead after having part of a broken sink dropped on his head. He could not be interviewed by police until 10 days later due to the seriousness of his injuries.

The court also heard details of a strikingly similar attack carried out by the brothers on a choirboy in Edlington a week earlier.

The court was told how he too was lured to the patch of wasteland, this time with the promise of seeing a "massive toad", and how he was beaten and stamped on. The brothers have pleaded guilty to a charge of assault causing actual bodily harm.

On that occasion their 11-year-old victim was apparently saved from an even worse fate by the intervention of a passer-by. The brothers were identified a few days later and were due to attend a police station on the morning of Saturday, April 3.

Instead, they fled their foster home, and within an hour had begun their second savage attack. The pair are due to be sentenced tomorrow.

The hearing continues."

For most parents the details of case of the depravity is beyond belief.

Completely see how it sounded like I was defending Doncaster SS - really I was saying the more fundamental thing that social work systems are so under pressure throughout the country that they can't but be impossibly hard to manage (and fail). I was hoping that someone would have a go at looking at what a properly resourced effective SS system would be like (and cost, that is crucial).

Are there any areas of the country whose SS departments aren't in crisis? That would be interesting to know about.

"that social work systems are so under pressure throughout the country that they can't but be impossibly hard to manage "

that is so true. We've just be allocated a family support worker, who always works as social worker. She has 48 families on her books and she's been told she may have more added. That's 48 families that she is responsible for. Not all of them are child protection ones, ours comes under the family support worker line of her work not the social worker side of things (we could easily have been allocated a family support worker who isn't a qualified social worker) , but there are no doubt many in that number who are "at risk" children

chegirl and bink - that's what worries me too.

I know Doncaster SS have apologised but the fact they tried to block that report doesn't augur well. I am saddened to think the two/three victims (though I can't help but feel the two other boys were failed too - but I don't want to re-open that debate,) are now being cared for by way of Doncaster SS ... .

This whole event is forcing me to reflect on the choices we, as a society, make about care for vulnerable children. Implicit in this is the conclusion that it is deemed somehow cost-effective for there to be a certain number of badly failed children and the "occasional" event such as this.

I hate the fact that social workers are working in an underfunded system, and that this probably won't change, despite our horror at what something like this has revealed.

Sigh. Just venting.

blaming the SS is easy, sorting out the kids who act like this isnt.
i think the problem is that they have to have a model to work from, (a plan of action, if you will) and that model wont be a perfect solution for every child in the care system.

The fact they have covered up the report is very worrying, especially as it was leaked to the BBC. According to Newsnight yesterday, the summary, which was the only bit publicly released, does not match the actual report!

The anonymity excuse is complete crap - they could easily change the names, or abbreviate them like they did for "Baby P", or just black them out.

This is Doncaster trying to prevent those who were negligent from being named, and blamed.

oh, I see Bink, that's a relief (that you weren't defending Doncaster, I mean).

John Hemmings has posted on other threads about Danish SS - they have a very well regarded system of pedagogues, specialist childrens social workers who have a long-term relationship, 1-1. Seems far more effective and much kinder. All this move away from childrens homes and insistence on fostering has been very over-done, relied on actually having enough foster parents (when there's a shortage) and has placed children and foster families in considerable danger. Remember that case in Wales where the foster child raped the foster parents' own children?

For some very badly damaged children a well-resourced residential home with dedicated workers who could help to put right some of the things that have gone wrong would be a far better solution.

I'm not sure I'm blaming SS per se. I think I'm leaning more in the direction that SS generally are handed a huge job, without the resources to back it up.

I have no idea about Doncaster SS. I suspect that a lot of their problems stem from lack of resources, over a long, long period. I might be wrong, and maybe I'm a complete hippy, but I do, naively think that most people do not go into SS in order to mess things up - from the top to the bottom.

Obviously, I could be completely wrong. for all I know, the problems in Doncaster stem from mismanagement by incompetents. But (maybe because I'm a hippy,) I suspect under-funding, under-resourcing.

My concern is that the attempt to hold back the report indicates a defensive attitude in management at the highest level. Not good if they are going to have to make structural changes.

My further concern, really, is that, clearly, they are stretched, and, as Chegirl suggests, the two boys are just going to have their place in a queue.

sadly social care/services has never taken any great priority - right from the start of the Welfare state after the war and the situation has never improved.

There is no clear "source" of funding (unlike for say schools, NHS, benefits etc etc) afaik and a look at this seems to me that the only place that has a "set" budget for social services is Northern Ireland.

And to think this is the sector I want to work in once I've done my degree (not a social work degree)

I was exactly thinking about an NHS-equivalent for the non-medical (though it tends to shade into the medical, with family support for illness, and special needs, and so on) aspects of a social framework - when you read about the energy and the earnestness (and, maybe, the naive idealism too) of the post-war NHS plans it makes you feel quite sad about how little of that type of energy is around now.

And I could not agree more about how institutions (properly sized/resourced) Aren't Necessarily Bad, and how it is not fair to let fostering carry the burden.

Jamie Bulger's torturers had a worryingly similar home life and had watched the same sort of films.
Yes, these two boys need to be kept away from the rest of society until they pose no further risk ( or never if that's what it takes). Hopefully counselling and being in a more 'normal' environment may be able to do something for them.
Their parents are FULLY responsible for the actions of these children and should be punished as such.
They let children take cannibis ( far far more harmful on a growing brain) and watch horror/torture films.
They should be fully punished for their part in this.
My heart goes out to the two young boys and their families.

Apparently the police are looking at bringing charges for neglect against the parents.

Interesting that the boys' anonimity has been maintained post verdict (there was an application to have them named).

RE the fostering , who thought placing the boys , who have severe behaviour issues/violent tendences ,with a 60year(?) old couple a good idea?. How on earth did they expect them to cope and disapline them effectivly.

Neglect doesn't cover it

Bink - the post war Welfare reforms never included Social care in it's own right.

And indeed not much later on the NHS had "3 arms" - hopsital services, GPs and LA or community health services.

The hospitals got the biggest share of the budget, the GP's started out (and I think still are) pretty much businesses contracted by the NHS rather than being employees of the NHS, and the LA doing the rest of it basically.

It wasn't until the Seebohm report in 1968 that a social services in it's own right was suggested (taking over all of the "social" work from the mental health, welfare and children's departments) becoming a 5th welfare service in it's own rights..........of course guess what stopped it - yep money.

Of course there have been changes since then, but it's still a bloody shambles with the way the funding/set up is done (imo)

This gives a glimpse into their home life.

The parents should be charged. they have done their worst by these boys ,and that in turn has caused to innocent kids to be harmed.
what has happened to the 5 siblings? are they still with the parents or are they in care?
will the siblings get new identities?

drlove - according to that link that Molli has just posted one one of the other brothers was sent to a young offenders institution for mugging an old lady last year.......

Awassailing - if only mn ran the country! I suspect SS would get their own budget then.

I am always really, really impressed whenfriends tell me they are training to work in this area.

Was a bit shocked at your earlier post about the caseload of 48 families.

I wish that we had a government / potential government out there with the balls to say that they are going to raise standards in teaching, social work, and all the usual suspects by paying much increased salaries to those who qualify and can be measured as doing a good job. Ridiculous how the arguments about high pay being necessary 'to get the best' are trotted out to justify bankers' salaries, when that never seems to be an option for vocational jobs. And that goes for the resourcing of services too. Not to say throwing money at a problem is always the solution, but if properly planned and spent it would at least do some good. And yes, I will happily pay more tax to see this done and done properly.

[steps off soapbox]

I didn't know that Doncaster SS had already come under government control. So depressing to think that apparently it just can't be turned around. There must be many kids out there being horribly treated with no hope of help. Awful.

I still find it hard to sympathise with the attackers here, and as has already been said, it saddens me hugely to think that the victims will probably only get a fraction of the resources that their attackers benefit from.

MollieO - omg that link. the mother "fed" them cannabis to make them sleep .
words fail me.

And having read Molli's link, both the parents should be locked up. Toxic.

I was shocked by the police's attitude to the next door neighbours - suggesting they only bother to report after 6 or 7 incidents .

Isn't the thing about the new identity that it is actually a saving to the taxpayer? - in that if they didn't have it, they'd need police protection, which is far more expensive - and indeed, what is the cost of a new identity - not much, in itself, surely? (I realise you can challenge whether they'd "need" police protection, but that rather depends on what view is taken of vigilantism ... which is not something I can see any good in, ever.)