Illegal downloaders to be targeted by lawyers demanding cash.

[StripeyKnickersSpottySocks]

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8381097.stm

I must admit I'm a bit worried after downloading a few DS games. Although I'd like to point out I'm not doing it anymore. Do you think I can blame it on DD if we get a letter.

Yes yes, this is my plan of action...was the 8yr old, honest

Well DD who's also 8 has her own laptop in her room, and it is that laptop that all the downloading was done on. So how can they prove its me? She's under the criminal age so they can't prosecute her.

I can't afford hundreds of pounds. I know I shouldn't have done it. It was a couple of years ago. DH is sniggering about it.

Yeah, sounds like they're taking the piss just trying to get money out of people tbh.
Unlikely you'll get a letter anyway if it was just a couple of things years ago, me however....

That's me in trouble then.
Seriously, I can't see much happening with it.

Didn't they target music downloads a couple of years ago. Quite a few people had to pay hefty fines although I think that was file sharing. Not sure how they would historically track games downloads, more something they would track from now (but I don't know for certain). No doubt a gaming geek can advise.

The easiest defence in this case is deny, deny, deny.

If you have wi fi let them prove without a doubt that no one else could have possibly jacked into your connection and downloaded anything.

They must also prove that no one else has used your IP address ( the tech exisits to make this possible).

The companies do not want to go to an open court case, it would be a show trial and when it is proven that the tech they are using to harvest IP addresses is flawed they will lose everything.

The best defence is to make THEM prove they have the right person, something which they can not do.

Yes, the wonders of Wifi. When people first got in trouble a while ago I decided it would be better if I used my neighbour's wifi account for downloading.

So I did this for a bit but then DH told the neighbour that he ought to put a password on his account. I keep trying to guess what his password may be but I've run out of pets and kids.

I really am a bad, bad person.

This will be a civil case not a criminal one so they don't need to prove it beyond doubt but merely on the balance of probabilities. And, while an 8yo may be too young to be prosecuted, the person who pays the broadband bills could well be regarded as culpable.

In the US there have been lots and lots of successful prosecutions even though a lot of the evidence has been less than solid.

I work in IT and, trust me, if you use wifi you have nothing to worry about ......

Nothing to worry about other than it being wrong in both the moral and legal sense?

I work in IT and, trust me, you do have things to worry about.

Not from a technical evidence point of view you don't

ignorance is no excuse.

And fwiw there was an article this weekend about a pub landlord fined £12000 because someone illegally downloaded material through his unsecured wi-fi.

Lots of successful prosicutions have been brought in the US for illegal file sharing and it is IMO only a matter of time before they start clamping down on illegal games - microsoft have started cutting off access to xbox users who play illegal games for eg.

And ultimately it's theft. Just because you do it from the privacy of your own home doesn't make it any different to walking into a shop and stealing a game off the shelf.

The xbox thing was different technology - MS were detecting Xbox live subscribers with modified xboxes - i.e hardware. They were not downloading anything, just enteringthe xbox live subscription area.

and they weren't fined, just banned (which is fair enough, of course)

people readily have chipped ds's though and those hard drives that they use to download dodgy games for the wii.

Still theft, but people seem to view it differently because they don't have a physical game iyswim.

I am not commenting on the morals, merely the technology.

(I do think, however, that massive global conglomerates that charge 30/40 quid for games once they have sucked consumers in with the underpriced hardware are probably not best placed to lecture consumers on ethics tho, imo of course.)

Personally I think they would be better off going down the wii ware / free ware route and charging small amounts for games as noone seems to object to doing that.

I'd be very careful about using the wifi excuse - not least because if you have any open channels and someone downloads child porn for example, you can have all your equipment taken away while they investigate.

I often wonder how those people who don't think that it's theft would feel if their bosses decided not to pay them for their months work for the reasons that pirates often give ("I wouldn't have paid you anyway", "You're too expensive" and so on).

And some UK ISPs are beginning to make noises about banning customers who have open WIFI networks and the industry in the UK is making it quite clear that they consider the owner of a WIFI connection ultimately responsible for keeping it secure and for what happens through that connecting.

As to using a neighbours WIFI connection I do know that the police have cautioned some people for "WIFI Theft", but I don't know how far they went and that was a year or so ago.

But surely using a neighbours connection, and risking them getting a nasty letter, for something that is illegal and immoral really isn't a good or justifiable thing?

"I do think, however, that massive global conglomerates that charge 30/40 quid for games once they have sucked consumers in with the underpriced hardware are probably not best placed to lecture consumers on ethics tho, imo of course."

If you think something is too expensive then don't get it.

So yes they are well placed to say "you taking the results of my work without paying for it is wrong."

However I'm very much in favour of alternate routes to market, either free or some App Store type thing and I actually think we some see of the best innovation there.

Agreed and I think they should be concentrating their resources there rather than the scatter gun approach of trying to fine a few people here and there which will only ever be a drop in the ocean. I think they are fighting a lost course - you can't turn the internet off and all that. We are not talking about hacking into a software house and stealing an unreleased game which would, of course, be indefensible theft. Someone had paid for the software and is choosing to share it. When we were kids noone tried to stop us buying a record and lending it to a friend or taping it - and all it does imo is stir up enthusiasm and make you actually buy more records, games, hardware whatever. Eg all those people with DS cards who were exposed to way more games and types of games than they would otherwise have been able to afford to - are the same ones people that then bought the DSi or whatever it is called and a Wii with different genre titles than they would have otherwise bought. I think they shoud make the hardware more accurately reflect development costs and then release the software at lower prices. After all you only need one console but it is interest in the 1000s of different games and genres that keep people buying the next gen hardware.

cause sorry

fabhead - they did try to stop us taping records - didn't they talk about, or actually levy, a tax on cassettes to pay for pirating?

pub landlord fined £8000 for someone else's download

So I certainly wouldn't think you could use wifi as an excuse.