Not allowing Dads in the delivery room?

[Chulita]

The BBC was just talking to a man who was saying that men get in the way and that if we just got all the men out of the delivery room, labour would be easier and simpler. Can't find a link but grr! I wouldn't want to have had DD without DH around, if they banned him I'd have the baby at home!

I would have gone mad if DH hadn't been able to be with me. I had 50 hours of induction, which failed, then a c section. I was tired, I was in pain, I felt rubbish much of hat time. I needed DH to be there for me, to support me, to listen to me, and to have someone there I could just talk to when I wanted to, and to keep me company when it went on for so long. When he had to go home at nighttime during the induction I hated it, being on my own - and I was quite scared and felt very alone when I got so much pain I was being sick, and he wasn't allowed to be there.

In the c section he was a godsend. He didn;t get int he way or even do naything in particular. But he held my hand and talked to me, and in turn that made me feel more relaxed and less terrified.

If it wasn't for my DH, I think my 100th midwife would still be trying to induce me with "one more gel". It was DH that said, enough is enough and got my labour moving to the next stage (induction by drip), it was DH that explained everything to me in idiots' terms because after 2 days, I was so tired, I'd have agreed to anything. It was also DH that held our baby for the first because I couldn't. The support he gave me was amazing and should never be underestimated or shoved aside as men getting in the way. Every labour is different so it should be a personal choice, but, for me, I'd have been so frightened had he not been there.

I had my second baby (DD, 8 months) at home with only a 'silent, experienced, low-profile midwife' there. It was wonderful.

I felt like DH should be at the first birth, but I don't think it was much help to me (sorry DH), but it was an unforgettable experience for him to see DS coming out. Unforgettable in a good way, that is!

DH said that having seen it once, he didn't really feel the need to see it again, and logistically it worked for us that he took care of DS while I gave birth, at home, to DD.

I did find it more relaxing and ... freeing, somehow ... to just have the midwife there.

Bambinoloves - your experience shows why men should be there and why medical professionals do not want men there.

At the birth of DS1 the midwives changed shifts an no one came to see DW for 2 hours in the middle of the night. I dozed off in the delivery room until DW woke me very frightened having been in labour 24 hours and contractions having stopped.

I stormed down the corridor and found both midwife and consultant and demanded to know which one was in charge of my DW. They just looked at each other. I demanded to know what there next decision was if the birth process had stopped. In particular told them if there was any chance of an induction it should be a planned caesarian instead as that was my DWs wish. They seemed to sit up and take notice after that and be a lot more attentive then.

Same in the birth of DS2 where the midwife tried to trick DW into not having an epidural. DW was having a back-to-back birth which is agonsingly painful and the midwife told her she could not have an epidural. The look of panic on my DWs face was enough for me to know that I had to intervene and demand that epidural as my DW wanted. The epidural then happened but the midwife then failed to notice DW was bleeding heavily after the birth and there was 2 pints of blood spreading across the floor. I drew the midwife's attention to the spreadng pool of blood as she had her attention on admin in the corner of the room. Panic ensued and surgeons were called to stitch DW.

That is why men need to be there (or at least a birth partner)to make sure DW/DP gets what she wants and not what medical professionals want and also to be a witness if anything goes wrong.

My sister gave birth on her own and the midwives treated her appalingly.

ABetaDad "tolerated and beig patronised throughout the entire conception birth and anter natal process."

Really? Even for the conception?

Morloth - yes the IVF clinic were especially bad and they admitted it to my face when I complained. They said they were 'woman focussed' in the way they did things. Used to annoy the hell out of me.

Well my very rocky marriage is a tiny bit better because H was there for both births. He did make useful suggestions and he was a support (apart from going out to get a paper so he "wouldn't get bored" ). He did say that he felt in the way in the hospital but "useful" at #2's delivery at home.

I think the point is that couples should have an informed choice (sorry about the hackneyed phrase). If the woman has a friend/relative who has given birth or can afford a doula then that might be a better option for her. It's personal choice like a lot of things and not everyone has access to a woman friend/relative who will be able to be available 24/7 when the baby is due - whereas it is not unreasonable to expect a partner will be.

Oh duh ABetadad! Sorry, am dumb as a brick at the moment. I hadn't realised you guys had used IVF.

Was thinking it was a bid unfortunate that you were tolerated and patronised by your DW at moment of conception, iyskwim?

Hopefully normal service will resume in Morloth's brain upon baby vacating the premises.

morloth - its OK. It wasn't obvious and no offence taken.

I couldn't have done it without my DH there - who else could I have sent for the MW when the baby's head crowned and we were unattended?

IF the father is being hysterical/a PITA, I would have thought that the team could make a decision at the time to ask him to leave as he is being counterproductive - but a blanket ban is RIDICULOUS.

I find ABD's post interesting. It's all about playing a defensive role to his wife, protecting her from doctors and standing up for her rights, which is of course very important.

But all the talk of 'storming' around and 'demanding' things doesn't sound very conducive to a birth environment which should be more gentle and flowing.

I think this rather demonstrates how useful a doula can be (NOT to replace the father unless the couple opt for that) but to keep a calm atmosphere, a steady support and allow the woman to focus on labouring and the father to focus on being an emotional support. A doula can also reassure the husband that things are progressing normally.

Of course, men will generally leap to fighting for pain relief quicker than a midwife. Obviously they don't like to see their wife in pain. However this is not always the safest option for the mother or baby and also, might not be what the mother actually wants. (Not saying this is true in ABD's case, this is a generalisation).

There is certainly evidence that women have shorter labours with less perceived pain if they are supported by a doula, and a doula should be well versed in coping techniques which ideally reduce the need for pain medication.

Ideally, women should have much better, consistent support in labour from a calm, supportive midwife whether or not anyone else is present.

But whether or not this happens, it should be entirely up to the couple to decide whether the father should be present or whether to add a doula to the mix.

ABetaDad you saying about your DW's wishes has just reminded me that I had a birth plan - what a joke that was, wasn't even taken out of my file. Another reason why DH/DPs should be at the birth - they are our voice.

I dont think banning husbands is right ,as alot of posters have said they really wanted them there . I had my mum with me when i had DS ,my DH when i had DD and i have invited my best friend to this (hopefully ) homebirth ,Dh will be there too ,unless he isnt ,but i feel that my friend will be more supportive having had children herself ,plus she does actually know where the kettle is

Have to laugh at the idea of a 'birth plan' ,i gave up after the first child and when my midwife asked me about it today ,i just said i plan for both of us to get out of it alive ,other than that i will wait and see

Thanks for the links pupuce, I'll look them up. DH reckons a doula might be a good idea too!

Bambinoloves - exactly. The reason I was 'went storming down the corridor' was precisely because the midwife at both DS1 and DS2 birth simply ignored what DW wanted. DW explicitly said she wanted an epidural and she explicitly said she wanted a planed caesarian if there was any decision to induce.

She had been very explicit about what she wanted. I was defending her wishes. I only intereferred once at each birth. The rest of the time I sat calmly talking to DW.

I listened to the piece on Woman's Hour - Eccentrica, I have to say I found Odent very annoying and patronising. I know that his writings are highly rated by many here, and haven't read them myself, so am happy to reserve judgement on that, but he was much more dogmatic than I'd expected, and had me shouting at the radio.

He seemed to present a very "one-size-fits-all" approach, and his statements on teh husband being more impressed by his wife if he hadn't seen her give birth, and on retaining the mystique of childbirth struck me as quite reactionary.

I would not even have considered not having DH with me.

He was the most supportive, calming influence I could have wished for at my birth - a drug-free homebirth which ended up with a rush to hospital 12 hours in, just as I was giving birth, when they realised DS was breeched and they thought he had a prolapsed cord.

DH was totally aware of how dangerous the situation was but stayed 100% calm the whole time. He held me in place on the stretcher to stop me falling over in the oh-so-glamorous head down, bum in the air position. He had to hold me so tight on the bumpy journey he was covered in bruises from the stretcher bars. His presence enabled both me and DS to stay totally calm through the whole ambulance journey and Emergency C-Section. Neither of our heartbeats changed through the entire thing which I attribute entirely to DH.

I even found out afterwards that he'd researched all the latest resuscitation techniques for babies, just incase the Midwife did not arrive at the homebirth in time.

The Midwife (when she eventually arrived at the homebirth 10 hours in when I was nearly fully dilated...!) was nice but didn't really do much and I would never have managed without my DH. He even got mistaken for one of the Consultants when we were in Theatre due to his calmness!

I think it should be entirely up to the couple whether the partner is present as I would never want to give birth without my DH present.

Michel Odent was pioneering in the intorduction of more home-like birthing rooms and use of water birth in European hositals. His research was the first published recommending breastfeeding within the first hour after birth (now the WHO recommendation). Lots of things that we now take for granted as 'normal'.

He does have some different views to what we normally hear, but I think it's vital that someone out there is saying that it's OK for Dads NOT to be there. It isn't right for everyone.

He's speaking to parents in Bristol soon - see:

www.motherslove.co.uk

It should be really interesting!

Reactions to Michel Odent's comments are also on this thread

I think he has a point but of course it shouldn't be about banning men - just changing the culture that expects them to be there, which has done a complete u-turn since 50 years ago. Some women would do better with just their midwife plus mum/a friend etc. Some men aren't well-suited to attending. It should be fine to make that choice and for men not to be berated if there weren't there.

But DP is my birth partner of choice and was a brilliant support last time so I do want him there.

I agree with madamedubain - it should be up to each couple whether they want the father there or not.

Personally I would have hated it if dh had not been there and would have been much more nervous/tense/scared etc. He was a really calming influence and I knew I could rely on him to make sure I was ok when I really wasn't in a fit state to make decisions/think for myself!

Just found this it appears he's been talking about this for 10 years now. Am really looking forward to hearing his talk, although probable more for his ideas on hormones - it's fascinating stuff

sp. *probably (oops)

My partner is a junior doctor. I've told him when the next one arrives (not pregnant yet, just talking etc) I want him no where near me! He'd be offering to put my eppy in and deliver the little darling.

For my first I had my mam and my best friend. The instructions being if I need you I'll tell you. I hate being touched or spoken to when in pain. I like to just go into my head and ignore it. I loved my low key midwife also, I requested a calmer quieter midwife at the hospital and she was fab, firm but friendly.

At my first I was a bit weird during the end of second stage and I do remember telling midwives and birth partners "If I go poo everyone leaves this room. That includes you Mrs Midwife. I'd rather deliver it myself than go boom boom in public"

I would hate to think that any woman was told she couldn't have her dp/dh there. It's personal choice.