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Not intelligent enough to marry- ss at it again

93 replies

atlantis · 12/09/2009 00:33

Social workers banned a young woman from her own wedding in an extraordinary row over whether she is bright enough to get married.
Kerry Robertson, who has mild learning difficulties, was told her wedding was being halted just 48 hours before she was to walk up the aisle with fiance Mark McDougall.
Miss Robertson, 17, had bought her wedding dress and the couple had booked the church ceremony, bought the rings and organised a reception to be held last Saturday.

But two days before they were due to say their vows in front of 20 guests, social services told the bride-to-be that she would have to cancel the big day because she 'did not understand the implications of getting married'.
Yesterday, Miss Robertson, who is five months pregnant, said the decision was cruel.
She said: 'I am still so upset about everything. I know what marriage is. It is when two folks want to spend the rest of their lives together. I love Mark and I want to get married to him.'

Miss Robertson, of Dunfermline, Fife, has been in the care of her grandmother since she was nine months old after her parents were unable to look after her, with her welfare overseen by social workers at Fife council.
In January this year, she met Mr McDougall, a 25-year-old artist from Arbroath. When Miss Robertson became pregnant, they began making wedding plans.

Mr McDougall said their nightmare began last Thursday when two social workers arrived at the flat they have shared for the past four months.

He said: 'We were about to go out and make final arrangements for our wedding when we heard a frantic rapping at the door.

'When we opened it, two social workers burst in and told us that the marriage was illegal because Kerry has learning difficulties and did not possess the capacity to make such a decision.

'Kerry burst into tears. 'But despite arguing with the social workers that we loved one another and didn't want our baby to be born to unmarried parents, they wouldn't budge.'

Under Scottish law, a registrar may refuse to marry a couple if he believes one or both the parties lack the mental capacity to understand what the institution of marriage is about.

In a highly unusual step, the registrar at Dunfermline Register Office refused to sanction the marriage after Fife council wrote a letter of objection.

Mr McDougall claims Miss Robertson's learning difficulties are not severe. 'It's true she is not very academic,' he said. 'But she is nowhere near as stupid as social services are making out.
'She is a loving caring person. She can also read and write, although not very well, and was going to college to catch up.
'I didn't even know she had learning difficulties until we'd been dating for two months.
'At that time, social services said they were pleased we were together and seemed supportive.
'For the first time in her life Kerry was truly happy so we cannot understand what all the fuss is about.'

The couple are concerned that their unborn baby, a boy they have already named Ben, could be taken away if Fife council judges Miss Robertson unable to care for him.
She now faces a psychologist's assessment to determine if she is too unintelligent to get married.
Mr McDougall said: 'We are both going to fight this all the way. We feel the fact we want to get married should be encouraged, not forbidden.'

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1212867/Youre-intelligent-marry-bride-told.html

What's the betting they are setting her up with the psych evaluation to take the baby away and not allowing her to marry will make it easier for them.

OP posts:
DollyPS · 12/09/2009 04:22

I am speechless at this as she is 17 so not a minor so how can they do this to her beggars belief. Oh thats right the SS can do what the hell they like and still say its for their own good. My question is what are her learning difficulties and if they are really that servere they can halt a wedding. If that was the case why is she allowed to live with her boyfriend and not with her gran with them there all the step of the way. It doesnt make sense to me

I wish it wasnt in the daily mail though hate that paper with a passion.

nooka · 12/09/2009 06:08

I would be wondering what a 24 year old was doing getting a 16/17 year old with learning difficulties pregnant to be honest. Indeed I would wonder even without the learning difficulties (if she was my daughter I would be absolutely furious with the man in question). I'd also be highly surprised if the whole picture was in the Daily Mail given their general political slant. I do agree it seems an incredibly poor and insensitive way to handle things, but then who knows what was going on behind the scenes.

On the other hand my nephew who is severely learning disabled but would love to get married also understands that marriage "is when two folks want to spend the rest of their lives together" indeed my children picked up that concept when they were fairly tiny too. I wonder what the Scottish standards are?

seeker · 12/09/2009 06:34

24 year old man - 16 year old with learning difficulties.......hmmmm.

There is more to this than meets the eye. Don't assume you are being told the whole story.

belgo · 12/09/2009 06:40

Agree with seeker and Nooka.

wahwah · 12/09/2009 07:24

This is the job of adult services, not the child snatching ones and we don't know all the facts of their concerns (a point that nooka, belgo and seeker appear to have noted)...but, hey, don't let that get in the way of another attempt to slag Children's Social Care, social workers and a number of mumsnetters...

TotalChaos · 12/09/2009 07:33

whatever the ins and outs of it - poor girl, hope she is supported to keep her baby, and can get some sort of independent support from organisations that help advocate for those with learning difficulties.

TheDMshouldbeRivened · 12/09/2009 08:11

so not suprised. I bet they try and take her baby away too. People with learning difficulties are treated like shit by some SS, as are those with any disabilities.
My assigend SW practically pated me on the head.

ArizonaBarker · 12/09/2009 08:33

There has to be more to this than reported. I used to work for an extremely large learning disabilities charity and organised a wedding/honeymoon for a couple of the clients. Social Services were very supportive and even sent a gift.

TheDMshouldbeRivened · 12/09/2009 08:38

there probably is but its also true that diffeent SS are very different in their appraoch.. I wish I lived 300 yards further west cos then I'd come under a different LA and therefore a different SS.

mumblechum · 12/09/2009 08:42

Hmm, I know nowt about Scottish law but in England and Wales a child ie under 18 can't marry without the written consent of the parents.

As presumably there's still a care order in place so SS are in loco parentis, I can kind of see why they panicked about her getting married as a minor. It may not actually have that much to do with her LD, rather her age, but who knows?

I do feel terribly sorry for her and hope that she ends up getting married.

differentID · 12/09/2009 08:42

however, even at 17 she would need the written permission of her parent/ guardian to marry as she's not considered of age until 18.

weegiemum · 12/09/2009 08:46

In Scotland, you can marry from 16 with no permission.

Callisto · 12/09/2009 08:49

It sounds amazingly heavy-handed and insensitive of SS, whether or not there are underlying issues that haven't been reported. Also, can't quite see why everyone has such a problem with a 17 year old and a 25 year old. I've been in relationships where the age difference was bigger than this and it wasn't a problem, and he doesn't exactly sound like your average predatory male.

Callisto · 12/09/2009 08:51

Of course, as Riven says, they probably have plans to take the baby as soon as it's born and this will be much easier for them if the couple are not married.

seeker · 12/09/2009 09:12

An 8 year age gap is no problem - when both people are adults. I would not be at all happy with my 16 year old having a relationship with a 24 year old man. I would be even less happy if she was a vulnerable 16 year old.

cory · 12/09/2009 09:25

I think there may well be more to this story than meets the eye; it is easy to be influenced in our judgment by any bad personal experiences we may have had.

though why do you keep calling her a 16yo, seeker; the article says 17. Do you have inside information?

seeker · 12/09/2009 09:28

Sorry - she is 17 and he is 25. I was just assuming that they were 16 and 24 when she got pregnant.

cory · 12/09/2009 09:34

ah, I suppose that may well have ben so

RedAction · 12/09/2009 09:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

expatinscotland · 12/09/2009 09:38

It's a ploy to get hold of a white baby boy.

And yes, so she was 16 and he was 24. Last I checked, age of 16 is age of consent.

And why does there have to be more to this than reported? Because people don't want to believe that people with LD and other disabilities aren't treated like second-class citizens by SS?

zubin · 12/09/2009 09:39

Unless it is different in Scotland her ld would need to be at least moderate to come under the category of adult social care and if she was 'known to services' (horrible phrase I know) she would still be in child services and going through transition. If she is now going through assessments it would seem that the ss have made an assumption of mental capacity rather than a decision based on actual mental capacity. I work with many people with mild ld and they aren't known to ss at all and I am sure ss wouldn't even know they were getting married (unless someone from the family was concerned and reported it). The personalisation agenda and VP Now (from the gov but importantly not law!) is moving strongly towards enabling people to live independent lives (including getting married and having and keeping children) - I too think there must be more to this from experience of working with the very good and the very very bad of ss it doesn't seem to be something they would do without some cause (whether rightly or wrongly) in light of all the new philosophies that everyone is supposed to be working to, perhaps it is the age gap - 17 and 24 is not huge but they could be questioning the intentions of a 24 yr old man without ld and a 17 year old girl with.

hercules1 · 12/09/2009 09:39

It's the daily mail. Social services won't be able to publicise their side. Let's just believe the headline though eh.

expatinscotland · 12/09/2009 09:41

She wants to marry. There are no end of bitchy threads about single parents, here's one who wants to marry and people can't resist slagging her off, too.

Oh, and the father who actually wants to marry the mother of his child and be around and support them.

Because of course, at 24, he must be a paedo.

hercules1 · 12/09/2009 09:42

Who is slagging her off?

expatinscotland · 12/09/2009 09:43

They were planning a church wedding, too, so presumably the vicar or pastor found them fit to marry.