Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

News

Mum pregnant with 13th baby, 12 taken by ss

131 replies

ChopsTheDuck · 30/07/2009 13:25

here

Feel so sorry for the babies, being born under those circumstances. A case for enforced sterislisation if there ever was one!

OP posts:
johnhemming · 04/08/2009 09:47

Surestart and homestart are different things.

msled makes an important point about the neglect of babies. This can cause developmental trauma.

One of the things that children need is love. That is being attentive to them even when they don't have a defined "need".

That is one reason why I am so unhappy about taking a newborn baby off a mother who loves the baby and giving the baby to an overworked foster carer already caring for two babies.

Developmental trauma can occur with a birth family, but also in the care of the state. (cf Romanian orphanages)

Ninkynork · 04/08/2009 09:54

Oh of course they are

PeachyTheRiverParrettHarlot · 04/08/2009 10:17

Ninkynonk- my job description used to be Sure Start Home Start Co-Ordinator (my post as entirely manabed by HS but fnded by surestart and within their area)

Try explaning that to people- took about 3/4 of the allocated time!

We did make a difference though. Dread to think what happened to some of our famillies after the closure

Ninkynork · 04/08/2009 10:31

How confusing, and how awful that it closed

hobbgoblin · 04/08/2009 10:39

She is merely evidence of how poor parenting skills in this country, poor support and a dire care system fail children on a daily basis.

It's a shame the article does not tackle that issue but instead focuses on the failings of the mother who stood little chance under the circumstances.

wahwah · 04/08/2009 21:12

Apologies, not flounced, just very tired last night and thought I should really be doing something more productive like sleeping. Thanks for the concern for my mental health, but in real life am fairly boringly stable, so not to worry yourself, blueshoes.

I think my annoyance comes with the hyperbole and paranoia every time social work intervention around protecting children is raised in this topic. There are some reasoned and seasoned thinkers, but inevitably when we get to John Hemming and his adoring throng (please note that the sycophantic burble that surround his comments isn't something I hold him personally responsible for) I really worry about how anyone visiting this thread and not knowing very much about the system, might leave with the idea that it is normal for evil social workers to prey on the wrong parents with the collusion of the secret family courts to fulfill some malevolent adoption quota.

Occasionally I wish to challenge that perception and ask for some evidence / constructive solutions to be posted on here to make the thread a much more interesting and helpful read (in my opinion). However, I usually then find that I lack the energy after a busy day to really engage with the process here and invariably just want to go and watch some mindless tv with my dh and remember to leave these sorts of threads alone.

Good luck to you all with the discussion.

blueshoes · 04/08/2009 22:31

wahwah, don't be silly. It is clear we are talking about individual cases, not some vast conspiracy theory. Believe it or not, some of us are trying to understand in what way the system works or how it can and is improving. Feel free to suggest, you can, you know - unless you don't think it is helpful for the public to understand the workings of the child protection system.

What is also clear is you have an impressive chip on your shoulder about johnhemming's work in this area, if you feel the need to use terms like 'adoring throng' to dismiss anyone who wishes to find out more about the cases he is involved in. Perhaps you can share what your experience in the social work field is or ... forget it, just go to sleep.

BTW, I am not in the least concerned about your mental health. Just telling you how you came across earlier on this thread.

tazz32 · 05/08/2009 17:40

ok im new to this so plz bare with me im a mother of seven children i was in a bad relationship left him a yr an a half ago now left with nothin but my seven kids i tryed leavin a few time an asked for help from ss an womens refuges an none would come to my help but this time i did it by myself thn i ask for help again because i wasnt copin very well with rules an bounderies an learnin my children to respect the home an thm selfs so it got to a stage were my home got real untidy an messy i asked for help because i didnt have everythin i needed to make my home look like a home an because of this an because i was in a bad relationship the ss took all my children away they was only involved for 3 mnths at the time never helped me an they really bullied me told so many lies its just annoyin tht poeple judge before they knw the hole story an tht john hemming is right about them bullin an the lawers doin what the ss tell them im still fightin for my kids but i feel i cant trust no one because they all stick together an i just want someone thts on my side as i might not be the best mum or because im not middle class an have the best job but my kids are my world an ss are bullys an wrong my kids are now so lifeless an withdrawn im real worried for thm an i just would like some advice thx

Arewenearlythereyet2009 · 05/08/2009 18:08

Its just a really sad situation i think. I feel very bad for the children in this situation and really feel that education is the way forward with them to break the cycle

dilemma456 · 05/08/2009 18:15

Message withdrawn

tazz32 · 05/08/2009 18:31

thx just annoyin tht if i never left him i would still have my kids wether he was violent so i just wonder how many other children r goin throught it because mothers r scared of this an the children are sufferin

edam · 05/08/2009 22:50

Tazz, do contact John Hemming. I hope very much he can help you and your children.

johnhemming · 05/08/2009 22:53

Best to email me at [email protected] with your name, address, phone number and summary details of your case.

You clearly have a bad experience with your lawyers. Sadly the LSC won't fund a shift in legal representation so you will probably have to go Litigant in Person to have any chance.

pippibluestocking · 05/08/2009 22:55

My first thought - OMG her pelvic floor

pippibluestocking · 05/08/2009 22:58

Sorry - hadn't read all the threads so wasn't aware that this had got serious - sorry

johnhemming · 05/08/2009 23:06

These things often get serious. Then again Fran Lyon is living happily with her daughter in Stockholm. Beats a forced adoption any day.

FlightHattendant · 06/08/2009 07:05

I don't know anything about court secrecy etc but I think it is just bizarre that you are discussing individual cases on here, and things pertaining to court paperwork fgs.

It seems thoroughly unprofessional. That from a layperson's standpoint of course.

But it makes my teeth itch iyswim.

blueshoes · 06/08/2009 07:56

Isn't court paperwork in the public domain anyway?

blueshoes · 06/08/2009 07:58

Tazz, I hope you find help and support you need.

johnhemming · 06/08/2009 08:05

Fran's case went into the public domain in late 2007.

Court paperwork generally for these cases is not in the public domain.

What I am trying to do is to persuade people that the system is not working properly.

glastocat · 06/08/2009 08:09

According to Closer magazine the first child was taken into care when she sustained unexplained injuries at the age of two. The mother admits that she has been agressive in the past, and her sister claims that she has the babies to get the £500 maternity grant. I take the sister's claim with a large pinch of salt, but if the unexplained injuries are true, my sympathies are limited.

edam · 06/08/2009 09:14

Flight - until the process changed earlier this year, these cases were shrouded in secrecy. There was no oversight, and no way of addressing injustice. Worse, parents who felt they were victims of miscarriages of justice were ordered not to tell anyone and left too terrified to seek help from their MPs or from anyone else. An appalling abuse of democracy.

Secret justice is no justice. It is perfectly possible to protect the identity of people involved in the justice system without preventing those involved seeking redress if they have been unjustly treated - look at anonymity for rape victims.

A woman used to post here who had been one of the first wrongly accused by the infamous Roy Meadows - the guy who dreamt up 'one cot death is a tragedy, two is unfortunate, three is murder'. She was threatened to the point of her medical records being sealed. Which caused major problems because she was suffering a medical condition that eventually left her in a wheelchair.

I know we are all anonymous internet pixies, but I met this lady, and she was very real. A member of the House of Lords saw all the documents (eventually, when she was finally able to share them) and wanted to take up the case.

Sadly she was too scared to allow her case to go forward, partly because she feared the adoptive parents would stop all contact with her teenagers, who were reaching adulthood. And she had to stop posting here because the adoptive parents stalked her. They appeared to feel very threatened by the idea that the adoption had been based on a lie.

FlightHattendant · 06/08/2009 11:07

Thankyou for explaining, Edam - I can see in the light of that why the backlash.

It was posts such as this:

By johnhemming on Mon 03-Aug-09 20:04:36 I have access to the court paperwork to know that this is considered sufficient for the S31 threshold.

that made me feel rather uncomfortable. Hope you understand why I mentioned it.

tazz32 · 06/08/2009 11:23

thank you for ur help but im also puttin a point across tht most of ss do not know what they are doing from the moment they came to my life they told me they were takin my children an they already had foster parents for my for eldest and adoptive parents ready for my to youngest i belive they picked on me because i was at an all time low an that i was emonaily easy to put down i hope tht this doesnt happen to any others because if u see what state them children get in its just so discustin

johnhemming · 06/08/2009 11:24

People need to know the basis upon which decisions are taken. That does not actually require the parties to cases to be identified.