anyone gonna riot tomorrow?

[southeast]

i think i'll rob the local tesco as most of the police will be in london

Right.
Look, today I am not in the best of moods so I apologise. We have lost a lot of money recently, my bro is suicidal and my mother making abusive phone calls.
But that's by-the-by.

They dress up to ensure maximum publicity and also to make sure that people know they are there peacefully.

Protesting is a right. It ensures that you do get media coverage, that your cause gets media coverage and by being in the spotlight you are forcing the government to respond. So even if they choose to ignore you, you have highlighted the issues and you have shown people that they can take to the streets and vent their anger in that way.

As I said, there is a lot of anger atm. Goading by bankers is the last thing they need. As is police heavy-handedness.

Just been hearing about some of the "antics".

Breaking into buildings and smashing up property is not tewwibly gwown up, is it, you wacky wadicals?

Ever stop to think it will be some ordinary person's mum and/or grandad who will be tidying up the mess, and not a fat-cat banker or politician?

This is on the infantile level of rock bands trashing hotel rooms.

Out of interest are any of you city workers worried about climate change or global capitalism?

I'm kept awake at night sometimes worrying about what the world will be like for my children.

There are elements among the protestors, but there are many people who are genuinely concerned about the way the world is headed and our leaders' lack of will to deal with it.

It's a serious question - are you worried? Would you consider protesting too? If not why not?

Minority of idiots. Unfortunately protests do appeal to idiots who take advantage, but papers like the Daily Mail focus only on those people and make us think that the whole of the protests were violent.

This is not true. Just as not all football fans are hooligans. But where there are crowds there are wankers.

I don't think the media (AGAIN) as helped. From the way they were carrying on you'd think people were planning Armageddon.

I was also around for the protests in Edinburgh in 05, and it was definitely more the local nutbags running around destroying things than proper protestors.

I work near the BoE (though in another country this week, so missing everything). My colleagues say that not much has happened: just some environmental protestors going up and down the street.

small orange, i'm not a banker and yes it worries me, as an aside how much rubbish do you think will be left on london streets by the protestors that are so concerned by the environment today?

Oh fgs.

Nancy, what would you have us do?
Really?
Put up and shut up?

It isn't about rubbish on the streets, it's about the lack of political will to address serious problems; the depletion of the Amazonian rainforest, acid levels in the sea, the fact that we cannot go on like this. And we have to act now.

If it was about rubbish on the streets then even Gordon Brown could sort that one out.

It's easy to take the piss or sit there tutting about how your day has been ruined, but these people might actually be right.

What is it Gordon Brown said: 'No more boom and bust,' well that was a load of bollocks, wasn't it.

Rhubarb, maybe have an actual point to the protest, that would be a start. Perhaps be sensible enough to realize that by making most of london a no go zone for 2 days more damage is being done to our already fraught economy than good?

Small Orange: I'm not a banker either, but work in the City.

For climate change: not that concerned. I think a lot is down to inevitable global cooling/warming that we cannot change. I was told by a friend who works for the UN that they're pretty much resigned to not be able to do anything.

I really hope that they do manage to align the regulators more; a lot of the stuff regulators produce is very much an ego exercise or protectionism, without really helping much (especially the SEC).

As for joining the protests: well, a lot of the time causes I wouldn't necessarily agree with are thrown in, and I may be VERY cynical, but I don't think it achieves much apart from wasting money on security and whatnot (I think it's very ironic that people are protesting against government funding going to banks: to protect savings, but meanwhile the protests, the security and the clean-up operation is also costing tax payers money). As for the people going: a lot of the people I encountered throughout my life who were very active in protest groups have done very little of REAL value to help the causes they support. Two of the most vocal are doing PhDs. And that's it. And TBH, I think their studies are largely vanity exercises whereas I [smug emoticon] actually do a job which actually affects the world in a positive way (stopping crime and terrorism; forcing bankers to work in a more ethical way).

Rhubarb,

Don't misunderstand me on this, I have a lot of sympathy with a fair amount (though not all) of what the protestors are claiming. I also absolutely believe that they have the right to protest. The point is that not only will they not achieve anything through it - zero, nothing, nada - they'll actively harm their cause by alienating people, e.g. those workers and small businesses in the City caught up in it, or those moderates who might otherwise have been convinced.

If I was protesting on one these causes you can betcha ass that I would absolutely not be turning out today. I'd be letting the idiots get on with it. Instead, I'd be planning an entirely separate day of protest where I could make my argument in a loud and clear manner so it was actually heard.

While we have a democratic system where most power is parliamentary and yet hugely important issues (such as those around ecology) are largely excluded from significant parliamentary representation, we are going to see protest in the spaces outside of parliament.

Also, politics has its element that is represented/is representable by the big political parties, and it has its elements that are bubbling up around the edge. and those issues may be multi-vocal and "disparate".

It may sound/look like incoherent noise from the centre, but from the margins,it makes perfect sense.

I'm hoping it will be successful, fun and peaceful. Protesting is an important part of the political process. There is such a limited arena for people to perform and work out the political issues of the future/minority/less powerful opinion.

I get the impression that it's an age-related protest. And I do think it's connected to the decline of youth involvement in mainstream politics (which has been going on for a while).

I suspect that if you're of a certain age, it all makes perfect sense.

I hope it is peaceful though, because it's clear from this thread that the threat of things kicking off really does alienate some and put off others from getting involved.

I very much agree Rhubarb

look at the daily mails coverage if any proof be needed

I think (and hope!) the possibility of city workers being in danger is massively over-stated.

There are a lot of people who work in the city who would happily join in the protests.

And in their lunch breaks some of them do

Well of course the DM is going to go to town on this. But it's not just the DM - just about every news outlet is running similar stories about clashes with police, people dressed as clowns, city workers in peril. Why? Because it makes great headlines.

Which is exactly why, if I was protesting for one of these causes, I'd be doing it on a completely different day. Not only would my message be entirely lost today, it would be damaged by being lumped in with all the idiots...

the daily mail says much the same as the guardian at the moment

Thing is, c'est la vie, if you protest on your own, you will be completely ignored/deemed hopelessly eccentric.

Moreover, unless you have a mass event, drawing on a lot of different strands/voices, you get just one voice dominating the representation.

Also, the hope is that if you get to a critical mass, you have enough people involved that, at some point, it can no longer be represented in terms of that "a few hundred" throwing fruit and ransacking an empty building/attacking the police.

Loving the idea of a lone protester with a sandwich board, pacing up and down, on a slow week in February.

Think they should wheel out the water cannons and rubber bullets on this one - DH is on his way home and he says the atmosphere up there is tense and scary - he isn't a little mouse either but a big 6 foot strapping bloke.

They should be actually targeting the very few banking workers who actually caused this crisis not the normal man in the street who works in a bank - but then the idiots that they are have no idea about what goes on in a bank - the nearest they probably got to a bank is to cash their GIRO!

If they had any sense they would protest at Westminster over the pay rise the government ministers gave themselves yesterday.

cestlavie you have no idea.

People do protest on other days too you know - and guess what - hardly any press coverage.

"If I was protesting on one these causes you can betcha ass that I would absolutely not be turning out today. I'd be letting the idiots get on with it. Instead, I'd be planning an entirely separate day of protest where I could make my argument in a loud and clear manner so it was actually heard."

Sounds unlikely that you would actually be protesting about any of the causes though eh?

I hate hate hate the fatalistic argument "this will make no difference" - you cannot possibly know whether it will make a difference or not. Let's see if it does. Doing nothing at all will definitely make no difference.

I have just got back from the city
It was very sireny indeed
saw two people being beaten up by peegs for trying to run away when they endeavoured to search their bags
That's all though
The real probs will start tonight no doubt

Well that would be amusing cherryblossoms

But clearly the groups involved have many hundreds, if not thousands, of members and if you add like minded groups (i.e. those who believe in the same cause, e.g. climate change) then you may have tens of thousands willing to protest - somewhat harder to ignore.

And, far more importantly, your message gets across, particularly if you organise the march, media support and messaging correctly. How many messages are getting across today? None. Absolutely non. The only message and coverage are those of violence, idiots and criminal damage.

There is only one way to hurt the people who caused this problem
Put them in prison
The ones who were criminal I mean
Fines won't get them
They care not for protest